Gap in research development / career mode

[Psykikk]

Hi there, 
I just came back and realized something (might be that my hiatus is the reason.. but... )
it "feels" that after the first few missions, you - aka Me -  seemingly hit a glass ceiling when it comes to research and tech tree progress. 

the first couple of mini launches,  walking aroun KSC .. al this adds up fairly quickly and you kind of blast through the early stages in development.

and then: it just hits major bumps. 

getting enough deltavV stuffed into a mun lander that really is able to get loads of science back to KSC is ...hard , especially when you hit parts and tonnage requirements. 

especially when you try to minimize trips to maximize science (aka biome-hopping)

I enjoy the challenge, but I do not remember it being THIS hard. or am I just rusty ? 

[jimmymcgoochie]

A lot can depend on the difficulty settings, you’ll progress a lot slower at 10% science gains than 100%. Most of the facilities and buildings in the KSC are their own biomes- and some of them change as buildings upgrade- so there’s A LOT of science to be had right there, not to mention the Island Airfield not so far away; a little jet-powered science rover to trundle around the KSC can rake in science points for minimal effort.

While it can seem like a good idea to send every science experiment you have on every mission, the heavier experiments (materials bay mostly) can really cut down on your delta-V. It can be better to send a group of small, lightweight probes with only the small, lightweight experiments on them and drop those across several biomes, something that works particularly well for Minmus due to the low gravity and thus low delta-V requirements per lander.

Try sending a scientist Kerbal on a free-return trip around the Mun and have them transmit all the data they can and collect the rest and store it in their pod to be returned later, this will maximise the science gained per mission. Free returns can take a bit of work to get right, but also cut down on the fuel you need to carry and so lighten the entire vessel.

[Echo__3]

One of the first buildings I like to upgrade is the astronaut complex so that my Kerbals can go on EVA. Then on my first orbit, I will gather EVA reports over every biome. If I launch into an equatorial orbit, I can get seven. But if I use a polar orbit, I can get all 11.  This is a good way to gather a lot of science early on. Follow that with a crewed Mun flyby or orbit with a pilot and scientist, and I can gather science in low and high space around the Mun and typically get EVA reports over a couple or more Mun biomes. This sets me up very nicely for landing on the Mun or Minmus. 

[DeadJohn]

On 11/25/2022 at 3:02 AM, Psykikk said:

the first couple of mini launches,  walking aroun KSC .. al this adds up fairly quickly and you kind of blast through the early stages in development.

Have you tried building a science plane? You can collect crew reports, thermometer readings, and EVA reports flying above each Kerbin biome and also by landing. You can also taxi around KSC perhaps before electric rover wheels unlock.

You also mentioned a "mun lander". Land on Minmus before Mun; it takes a lot less fuel to land and lift off.

Are you playing in science or career mode? If career, look for contracts that include science rewards.

[Zhetaan]

On 11/25/2022 at 3:02 AM, Psykikk said:

getting enough deltavV stuffed into a mun lander that really is able to get loads of science back to KSC is ...hard , especially when you hit parts and tonnage requirements. 

especially when you try to minimize trips to maximize science (aka biome-hopping)

I enjoy the challenge, but I do not remember it being THIS hard. or am I just rusty ? 

In addition to what everyone else has said, I'll add that you may also be trying to take a bigger bite than your program can support at the moment.  You're not wrong that there's a hump in the middle of it, but maybe the approach you need at the moment is a Mun orbiter than can manage low and high space in a polar orbit, rather than a multi-hop lander.  There are a few early-game spaceplane SSTOs, but there are also much more mission-capable spaceplane TSTOs that exist because the designers didn't feel the need to force conformity to the single-stage constraint.  Also, you get quite a lot of manoeuvring reserve when you don't need to use the propellant for landing (and take-off).

Don't forget solar orbit, either.  The high space science multiplier isn't the best, but it's something.

Don't feel the need to get comprehensive.  There's nothing wrong with sending out a couple of Goos on a bare-minimum core-transmitter-power stack with not much else.  The OKTO is a fine core for probes that don't need to do much (and even a lot of probes that do).

On the other hand, maybe the thing to do is to focus more on making money than on retrieving science, since money is what you need to upgrade facilities to get past the parts and tonnage requirements.

Either way, good luck and welcome back, and remember:  you don't get rusty in space; you vacuum-cement instead.

[Psykikk]

hahaha. 

20 minutes ago, Zhetaan said:

On the other hand, maybe the thing to do is to focus more on making money than on retrieving science, since money is what you need to upgrade facilities to get past the parts and tonnage requirements.

Either way, good luck and welcome back, and remember:  you don't get rusty in space; you vacuum-cement instead.

I feel this advice is spot on. since I already did it all WAY back when, I felt the urge to just blast through and simply forgot the trials and tribulations and countless attempts at landing anywhere... and having so much fun doing it. 

I now have three Kerbals in mun orbit waiting for rescue. one is the original lander , FULL with science. the other is the rescue mission. I messed up sevral docking attempts earlier and gave up. :-) need to revisit them sometime soon I guess :-)

I already started kind of what you suggested. doing core / staellite and probing missions and contracts. earning cash. scanning planets. plane contracts( and the frustrations that go with those) ...

KSP was and still is an awesome piece of software 

thank you so much for your input. 

[Scarecrow71]

My suggestion:  aim for Duna/Ike as soon as possible.  Take a good read through the Kerpollo Challenge thread and see about landers for this body duo as you can gain a boatload of science without even landing on either the first time out.  And then landing?  Loads more.

[magnemoe]

On 11/28/2022 at 10:01 PM, Psykikk said:

hahaha. 

I feel this advice is spot on. since I already did it all WAY back when, I felt the urge to just blast through and simply forgot the trials and tribulations and countless attempts at landing anywhere... and having so much fun doing it. 

I now have three Kerbals in mun orbit waiting for rescue. one is the original lander , FULL with science. the other is the rescue mission. I messed up sevral docking attempts earlier and gave up. :-) need to revisit them sometime soon I guess :-)

I already started kind of what you suggested. doing core / staellite and probing missions and contracts. earning cash. scanning planets. plane contracts( and the frustrations that go with those) ...

KSP was and still is an awesome piece of software 

thank you so much for your input. 

Note you only need to get pretty close to have the other kerbal pick up all the science and go eva to the other craft. But yes eva is another skill. Learn this in another Test game or at least in low orbit around Kerbin. 
Stuff like docking and eva took US and Soviet multiple missions to getting used to and its still less standard than in flight refueling of helicopters.