Automate science collection - there is no reason to force players to manually press a button

[Vl3d]

I've played For Science! for quite a few hours and I think that, considering this minimalist implementation, science collection should be done automatically when the right conditions are met - without forcing the player to press a button.
A notification that science has been collected or that there's an experiment ongoing would be enough.
The only real use of the "collect science" button is that it shows the current location / biome.
Data transmission should still be done manually, because it can drain all the EC.

[yijian huang]

In KSP1, there is no notification at all, when your flight reach somewhere having new science points.

In KSP2, the game at least gives you a notification, despite you need further click to collect the science points.

I think this is a progress, and is good enough.

 

One reason why science cannot be collected automatically, is that the transfer of science data consumes much electricity.

So the user needs to explicitly click in order to choose a right moment and balance between science and control in terms of electricity consumption..

[Superluminaut]

I agree that it needs work, but I think the player should also do something to do science, not automated.

I'm also not a big fan of the electricity per second transmission mini game. Probes can perfectly communicate with mission control, but cant transmit experiment results.

Possibly a deployment mini game could be fun. For instance, pointed a telescope at a certain star, or find a soil sample with x% purity in a 100 square meter purity gradient area, or use x fully charged batteries to power the experiment, or run the experiment 1km away from spacecraft, or build a space station with x tons dry weight. 

It may also be useful to limit the amount of experiments that can be held in a part, right now a grand tour can scoop up everything.

 

[Superfluous J]

I have no problem with transmission of science using more power than basic comms, as basic comms can be optimized and a single byte can tell the probe to do a lot. While transmitting data on a sample could be millions or billions of times that amount of data, or more. And ignoring realism, it's more interesting that way.

I'd actually like the ability to right-click that flashing science button and select experiments to run one by one, or click an "auto-run" checkbox if I want. I'd have no problem if collecting them took power, though it should be clear how much power they're expected to consume so you can plan ahead in the VAB.

Balancing electric charge, transfer time (if only there was occultation to worry about), the situation that the craft is in, etc are interesting issues to have and the more you have to balance that the better. For example: Do you transmit the data now in case your craft burns up, or do you collect more data on the assumption that you'll come out the other side and will have plenty of time to transmit later once you're back in space?

[ShadowDev]

this should be a mod. auto science collection would remove a core part of the game.

[Vl3d]

54 minutes ago, ShadowDev said:

auto science collection would remove a core part of the game.

What core part of the game? Clicking a button when it lights up? It's a useless forced action.

Sure, transmit science manually so you manage EC. But actually collecting the science should be done automatically / passively, considering the lack of any experiment mini games except for "go there and press a button".

The action of collecting science is a redundant click and should be replaced with notifications. Reviewing and transmitting science is the only mildly interesting activity.

[ShadowDev]

if you forget to click the button you miss your science. thats a core game play mechanic. 

Clicking the button is you, the mission commander telling the kerbal or the probe that at that point is when the science is performed.

now if you dont want to have that key part of the game you can create a mod to remove it. 

[RaccoonTOF]

Also keep in mind that not all science experiments are simple, free, one-click-and-done affairs.  Some take time spent continually in a particular biome (like the atmospheric experiment, and to a lesser extent, surface sampling.)  Others have an ongoing resource drain when being run (currently only EC that I know of, but plans for future experiments after the ISRU stuff is implemented could certainly include other specific resources - perhaps even "using up" the results of prior research experiments, like the above mentioned surface samples).  Simplifying it to automatic might "make sense" now with the extremely simplified experiments we have currently, but it would be a headache to not have the manual interaction down the road...

[EngineeringWaffle]

I think that automating science collection is sort of like automating the victory screen in a more typical game. It's the final action required to win the points you traveled so far for. I get a lot of satisfaction out of doing my experiments. This feels like mod territory, it's something that many hardcore players might want, but which somewhat hampers the core dopamine loop.

[Vl3d]

1 hour ago, RaccoonTOF said:

Others have an ongoing resource drain when being run

Yeah I saw that with the radiation experiment. It seems that science collection can't really be automated if it also consumes EC. We're stuck with the button click I guess.

[DailyFrankPeter]

This should be a menu option because people are completely polarized: some think pressing 1 button is too much, some believe we didn't need that button.

[Vl3d]

9 hours ago, DailyFrankPeter said:

This should be a menu option because people are completely polarized: some think pressing 1 button is too much, some believe we didn't need that button.

The issue is how pointless is having to remember to press the button when the devs actually try to make it flash and sound alerts for you to press it.

[bolloxim]

I like the button indicator that there is science in this region to collect. The button bothers me because its broken..  It always flashes science that nets 0  return because its not account based but kerbal based.  Likewise if you had transmitted all the data but then moved your kerbal to a rescue video..  all that data is still there but has to be fully resent again.     I think its just a quick work in progress.  I think it would aid exploration, if all the science zones etc were listed  or ? if bioms are not found, so it shows that there are more things to find on moons.   Just some feedback.   Also and this gets super annoying..  Observation probe in high and low orbit... STOPS but does not RESUME when running science.. so if you moved from highlands to lowlands it pauses,  moving back to highlands does not unpause.  Also I found running out of EC destroys the experiment.   Its 6 minutes long too.   Talk about a painful science experiment to get it to actually work. 
Oh and I've had the light indicator not glow when there is science available..   at least I can spam the button to resume science (or go to the parts menu and spam it) but if you hover on the button it shows the biom, so when it changes.. can easily just press it to return to scanning.

 

Edited January 25 by bolloxim

[mikeman7918]

In KSP2 some experiments take time to perform and they come with certain piloting challenges like requiring you to stay in a biome or in flight for a certain period of time.  Automating that would cause a lot of problems, and generally limit how interesting and gameplay-relevant experiments could be.

Edited January 28 by mikeman7918
spelling

[byaafacehead]

Its funny seeing this thread and other threads which say the exact opposite, that science should be far more interactive. Devs probably will be a in a good spot when both sides are mad

[Periple]

5 hours ago, byaafacehead said:

Its funny seeing this thread and other threads which say the exact opposite, that science should be far more interactive. Devs probably will be a in a good spot when both sides are mad

I’m in the “more busywork please” camp!