Long-term Laythe Mission (pic heavy) - ^_^ With Part 45 ^_^

[The Error]

Cool. And I feel with his badassery Alder *could* simply drive into Mordor.

[Geschosskopf]

Excellent reading (and quite useful to pass the time while scanning for Kethane ).

I've never been to Tylo's poles so thanks for the info. I have been to a huge N-S canyon that crosses the equator, though, and it's as kinda anomalous, too. It's like the seam where Tylo's surface wraps around didn't quite line up right. You could easily see this trench from orbit. Or at least it was that way a few versions back. If it's not too far off the trail, you might want to take a look these days.

[Geschosskopf]

I meant to include this in my post above....

You were talking about the difficulties of moving from moon to moon at Jool. I've never been able to ride through reentering the departure moon's SOI and get back on track to the target moon. Each time I reenter the departure moon's SOI, I'm on an impact trajectory that doesn't ever go away.

All this seems to be caused by the moons' SOIs being so big. As you head outward and slow down, they catch up from behind and suck you back in. The only way I've found to avoid this is to delay the burn until a little past the optimum window, so I have a larger outward component of my transfer velocity. That way, when the departure moon catches up, I'm just out of its reach.

[Brotoro]

Yes. But I was bound and determined to make that Hohmann transfer work. It required not only leaving Laythe's SOI at 1X (no time warp), but I also had to be at 1X when recaptured by Laythe's SOI...and when leaving again. So it took a lot of time because of running without warp. Not really worth the effort. Much easier to waste some fuel and use a less-optimal trajectory.

I've also had similar things happen when exiting from Jool's SOI to return to Kerbin...and got grabbed back into Jool's SOI and had my course messed up. Dealing with huge SOIs is a bother.

Maybe KSP should use a different distance for when you enter an SOI and when you leave an SOI (have the exiting distance be greater) to prevent these re-encounters.

[Geschosskopf]

Yes. But I was bound and determined to make that Hohmann transfer work. It required not only leaving Laythe's SOI at 1X (no time warp), but I also had to be at 1X when recaptured by Laythe's SOI...and when leaving again. So it took a lot of time because of running without warp. Not really worth the effort. Much easier to waste some fuel and use a less-optimal trajectory.

Expected crossings of SOIs I have no trouble with. I just have KAC kill warp a few minutes before so I can sneak on across. What galls me are the Unexpected SOI changes. You do a burn and all looks fine in the map, so you warp on along and suddenly BAM! Out of nowhere you're in an SOI you didn't plan to be (happens a lot at Jool), or reach your target way earlier than expected at a very bad angle (happens a lot at Duna and Ike). Or even sometimes your expected SOI change just disappears and you just go back around the ellipse (happens a lot going from Kerbin to Mun).

I've also had similar things happen when exiting from Jool's SOI to return to Kerbin...and got grabbed back into Jool's SOI and had my course messed up. Dealing with huge SOIs is a bother.

Even Duna will do this to you when it's near its closest approach to Kerbin so your departure angle is shallower. Last time I went to Duna, I got recaptured 8 or 9 times before I finally got free. But unlike Jool or Jool's moons, each time I got recaptured, I was still heading away from Duna with an escape, so I just rode it out and eventually got home without too much problem with my trajectory.

Maybe KSP should use a different distance for when you enter an SOI and when you leave an SOI (have the exiting distance be greater) to prevent these re-encounters.

They definitely need to change something. It's just silly to run away ahead of a moon at > escape velocity only to suddenly do a UFO-style change of direction and find yourself heading back towards the moon at the same speed you just left at.

I'm sure it all has something to do with the Kraken being on Bop and Pol being the Spawn of Azathoth. The Jool system is haunted in the Lovecraftian sense. It's a wonder we're able to do what we do there .

[Commissioner Tadpole]

Uh... I'm confused.

The first Laythe Crew had six Kerbals in it. Two of them went to Tylo, and the other two females went to Vall, while the remaining two are still in Laythe. Once the new crew gets to Laythe, what will the other four do? Where will they go exactly? Just go back to Kerbin without getting back to Laythe?

By the way, could you add a version of the part links for those who use the 20-posts-per-page setting?

EDIT: I would also recommend to you the Distant Object Enhancement mod. I apologize if I am burying you in mods, but this one is relatively neat; you can see planets glowing far away with their respective colors, be able to see vessels further than 2.5km and up to 750km away(they're not rendered, just plainly visible), and, just like in real life, stars are invisible if you stare at the Sun or at a bright celestial body.

Edited May 25, 2014 by Commissioner Tadpole

[Brotoro]

Uh... I'm confused.

The first Laythe Crew had six Kerbals in it. Two of them went to Tylo, and the other two females went to Vall, while the remaining two are still in Laythe. Once the new crew gets to Laythe, what will the other four do? Where will they go exactly? Just go back to Kerbin without getting back to Laythe?

By the way, could you add a version of the part links for those who use the 20-posts-per-page setting?

EDIT: I would also recommend to you the Distant Object Enhancement mod. I apologize if I am burying you in mods, but this one is relatively neat; you can see planets glowing far away with their respective colors, be able to see vessels further than 2.5km and up to 750km away(they're not rendered, just plainly visible), and, just like in real life, stars are invisible if you stare at the Sun or at a bright celestial body.

I have gone back and edited the page-based links into post-based links (like the ones I've been using recently...I did not originally know how to make those). Hopefully that works well for you.

The first longterm Laythe crew had FOUR kerbals: Thompbles, Kurt, Aldner, and Nelemy. They we part of my project to set up either longterm bases or extensive explorations of all the bodies of the Kerbol system (starting with Minmus, followed by the very interesting Jool system). That crew was planned to already have gone back to Kerbin a couple years ago, but the massive Kerbol-mega-flares threw off that schedule.

Hellou and Emilynn were the crew sent to do extensive exploration of Vall. That surface exploration was slated to be less than a year long, with reusable lander and rovers to be left at Vall for use by follow-on crews (but it was not planned that Vall would be continuously staffed). Their Vall mission was cut short by the Kerbol-mega-flares, and Hellou and Emilynn fled to Laythe. There they were incorporated into the now-extended Laythe mission of the first crew.

There were also extensive exploration missions planned for Tylo, Bop, and Pol (like the Vall mission, these would not be permanent bases, but they would leave hardware in place that could be used by future explorers). Those missions got cancelled by the Kerbol-mega-flares. At least the aspect about sending out kerbals with the mission hardware was cancelled. But the mission hardware for the Tylo, Bop, and Pol explorations got sent out unmanned... and the original Laythe crew was given the choice of doing those missions before returning to Kerbin.

So... Once the Kerbol magnetic activity returned to normal and the replacement Laythe crew was given the go-ahead to start their year-long trip to Laythe (six kerbals now en-route), the kerbals in the Jool system were also cleared to do the off-Laythe explorations. So, Hellou and Emilynn have returned to finish up their interrupted Vall mission, and Aldner and Nelemy went to explore Tylo. After maybe a half year of this, some or all of them will go on to explore Bop (that hardware, as well as the Pol hardware, will be arriving in the Jool system in several weeks, and will be maneuvered into place remotely by Thompbles and Kurt). Then some or all of the extended-Laythe-crew kerbals will stop to explore Pol for a few months before finally heading home to Kerbin (the replacement Laythe crew will have arrived at Laythe by then).

I know it's somewhat confusing when there are several staggered payloads coming and going, and I have activities going on in the Jool system in the meantime (I don't just launch something to Jool and assume everyone is sitting on their hands while I zip through the year it takes for the payload to get there...because that would be thoroughly unrealistic). For example, after the Bop and Pol payloads arrive, there is the claw-based refueling equipment that will arrive in the following window (which Kurt will test out on Laythe), and THEN the replacement crew finally will arrive at Laythe.

Also: Over 200,000 thread views. W00t!

Edited May 30, 2014 by Brotoro

[Scotius]

Congratulations I hope sheer amount of interest will keep you writing ()b On that note - i demand that Thompbles and Kurt are given a chance to stretch their legs off-world (Off-Laythe as it is)

[Brotoro]

Thompbles has been to Bop before, but I'm sure he wouldn't mind a chance to visit Pol.

[The Error]

And before they returnt o Kerbin, they'll get the final send-off dinner that won't be beat?

[Scotius]

They have to make room for all fresh snacks arriving from Kerbin, aren't they?

[AppleDavidJeans]

Quick question: how old are the space program (the game save) and specifically the long term Laythe mission in game years?

Also, what mod do you use to use physics warp while doing burns, especially when using the tugs?

Edited May 30, 2014 by AppleDavidJeans

[SuperWeegee4000]

I would be excited to see you do an Eeloo mission. Any plans for that?

[Brotoro]

Quick question: how old are the space program (the game save) and specifically the long term Laythe mission in game years?

Also, what mod do you use to use physics warp while doing burns, especially when using the tugs?

My game file is in year 27 (Earth units).

The Laythe Mission has been going on for 4 years 280 days (Earth units).

I don't use any mods to allow physics warp during long engine burns. I just use the Alt key in conjunction with the time-warp keys to turn up to the maximum physics warp that the ship can handle without excessive wobble (usually 2x or 3x). I used to use MechJeb to help keep the ship pointed at the maneuver node marker during the long burns, but nowadays the SAS works pretty well at holding the heading during burn.

[Joshwoo70]

You should install remote tech 2. Just install it and the community patch.

[Scotius]

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/56440-0-23-5-AntennaRange-1-3-Enforce-and-Encourage-Antenna-Diversity

Personally i like this mod much more. It's simpler, functional, and requires only small investment into relay network (of which Brotoro already have much in place).

[Joshwoo70]

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/56440-0-23-5-AntennaRange-1-3-Enforce-and-Encourage-Antenna-Diversity

Personally i like this mod much more. It's simpler, functional, and requires only small investment into relay network (of which Brotoro already have much in place).

Is there extra antennas? Remote tech has morw that those listed.

[Deddly]

Brotoro avoids mods as much as he can (particularly parts mods) because he prefers to use the tools he is given in the game. He did use hinges on one of his rovers a while back, though, but having mods makes it much harder to update to new versions of the game. This save file has managed to survive several big updates, and it would have been unlikely to have been able to do that if he had parts mods.

--

Deddly Design

[Scotius]

Antenna Range doesn't add any new parts. It's only a plugin that changes how stock antennas work.

[DevL]

This save file has managed to survive several big updates, and it would have been unlikely to have been able to do that if he had parts mods.

I beg to mostly differ as I'm still playing my first KSP game, started back in the 0.20 days. That said, a KSP update entails some caution and waiting for the odd mod bug to be fixed before continuing.

[Joshwoo70]

I am hungry for the nxt episode

[DevL]

I am hungry for the nxt episode

So say we all.

[Joshwoo70]

So say we all.

Agreed.when is the next episode?

[macdjord]

Agreed.when is the next episode?

When it's ready; no need to bug him.

[AppleDavidJeans]

Bump Bump.