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[0.23] Alternis Kerbol - Release thread - [v0.1, Jan. 3] (development halted)

NovaSilisko

By NovaSilisko
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Space_Kraken

Space_Kraken

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Alright so I'm posting with good and bad news. The good news is that I did some work on the code and fixed quite a few issues.

The bad news is that a lot of the bigger issues are still prevalent and I honestly have no idea how to fix them.

Some of the updates:

Had to take away Laythe's new terrain, reverted it to stock and it works fine now

Found out how to minimize the Spawn in Space bug (go down to see an explanation)

Fixed Vall, but also had to revert it to its stock proportions due to a major terrain issue that would freeze ships

Tried and failed at fixing Bop moonlet far terrain bug

Tried and failed at fixing comet tails

Found a new bug where Tylo, Gilly and Ike all orbit Kerbol WAY to fast (pending a fix, will update soon)

Ike is using the stock terrain bug so therefore from a far orbit and from the map it will appear as stock Ike but in reality it's a spiky hell hole

Duna, Dres, and Tylo all seem to have a bugged to hell sphere of influence (tried and failed at fixing) that sends (hypereddited at least) probes on an interstellar adventure, same bug also seemed to occur with Vall's bugged sphere of influence but the fix with vall doesn't work with Duna, Dres, and Tylo.

Probably many more issues.

Honestly at this point a complete rewrite is looking 10x more appetizing. I would suggest trying it with Planet Factory seeing as how the existing code is a mess and Nova (he even comments it himself) didn't know what any of it did.

Oh and the Spawn in Space bug is caused more than half the time by the Mechjeb AR202 case part, no idea why. If you need to use Mechjeb go to the Kerbin Shuttle Orbiter page and download theirs as it works fine (from my testing anyway)

Also here's the updated source, though I still highly advise rewriting the code in a more stable way.

http://www./download/k6fv2rgy515g46j/AlternisSomeWhatFixedBuildsWithSource.7z

All credit goes to Nova except for my fixes. No original Alternis assets are packaged (height maps, color maps, etc) all that comes with that is my Visual Studio source (which is a mess) and the updated builds each named in accordance with what they did.

"ClassLibrary3" is the latest with all the working fixes. I'll keep trying to get more done but I figured I would post this here in hopes that the community could be of some help.

If I need a license I'm using the GNU

Source is (as stated) included in the download.

EDIT:

At the time of posting this I have found more issues and have also fixed a couple

I fixed Tylo's gravity BUT

Duna and Dres now have seemingly non-existant sphere of influences and despite my using the same method to fix tylo I can't find anyway to fix Duna and Dres.

More updates: Tylo's atmosphere does not appear BUT it DOES function properly. Tylo also has an issue where the real, modified, version of Tylo fades into existance. This makes me worried that Duna may be behaving the same way.

Vall (even after trying my fix) does not want to revert to stock heightmaps quality. [FIXED]

Jool has magically turned green again. [FIXED] (sort of)

I beg that someone who knows more about this than I do takes this off my hands, all I'm doing here is copy and pasting code from other parts of the mod that may be able to fix it. yes, it has worked so far but it's only a matter of time before I do something or a huge bug comes up that I won't be able to fix.

Download link with release has stayed the same.

I also cleaned up my coding

EDIT 2: Somehow I magically managed to fix all of the issues I was having. Duna, Dres, and Tylo all work fine. All that needs work now is to adjust the orbital period of each of the sun orbiting bodies then all known bugs (be me anyway) will have been fixed. Which is scary.

Upon many conversations with Nova, he absolutly hates his code and says a rewrite is 100% nessecary. I was honestly considering writing alternis as a bunch of configs for RSS, texture replacer, planetfactory ce, and EVE.

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wasmic

wasmic

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Upon many conversations with Nova, he absolutly hates his code and says a rewrite is 100% nessecary. I was honestly considering writing alternis as a bunch of configs for RSS, texture replacer, planetfactory ce, and EVE.

Shouldn't it be doable with only PlanetFactory CE and KittopiaTech, and some custom code for comet tails?

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Space_Kraken

Space_Kraken

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Shouldn't it be doable with only PlanetFactory CE and KittopiaTech, and some custom code for comet tails?

If I want it fully customizable, I'll need to use texture replacer to change the planet textures, EVE to customize the comets and kerbol, RSS for planet positions, planetfactory ce for maybe for an extra planet or 2.. I forgot about kittopiatech though.

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  • 2 weeks later...
StormWolf

StormWolf

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Posted

Been doing a bit of testing on a DMP server (makes complete sense, I know) with it and have come upon a few more bugs, but none that are awful and might be able to be fixed with a few lines of codes,

Some of minmus's terrain goes below 0m which results in camera bugs

Minmus is a lying *******, it's SoI is actually ~97 KM rather than the 115 KM it says it is, tried fixing this with the Duna and Dres fix, no dice.

Tylo's atmosphere can't really be seen from the ground.

Will edit if I find more. Sorry I haven't been able to upload it, I'm on vacation. I have the fixed pre-packaged in my DMP server modpack so there's a link below to download that and pull it from the zip file.

http://www./download/jm77d43aac73hj9/DMPUpdated.7z

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StormWolf

StormWolf

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Posted (edited)
Upon many conversations with Nova, he absolutly hates his code and says a rewrite is 100% nessecary. I was honestly considering writing alternis as a bunch of configs for RSS, texture replacer, planetfactory ce, and EVE.

If you could do that, that would be amazing. Some issues, however, I looked into planet factory and found that Planet Factory can NOT alter the color of orbits or the color of atmospheres at this time which means that RSS cfgs would probably be the way to go. If i'm not mistaken RSS could probably handle everything (seeing as how the current official version of Alternis is made with RSS anyway). I would try to keep it simple and small, texture replacer eats quite a bit of RAM by its self and might conflict with mods such as EVE (which, as it stands, simply just overwrites Alternis's changes to the planets). Something I've been doing, which I do not like to do, has just been reverting planets to their stock form. This fixes quite a few bugs (excluding their orbit, SOI, etc modifications). I would suggest simply just moving the planets where they are in Alternis now in a new rewrite, fixing all those bugs involved and then move onto fixing the heightmaps, atmosphere, aesthetics, etc. I can't really help with a rewrite however I can bug test as soon as a build is ready. Oh, and please, PLEASE make a github, it will save so much time.

EDIT:

If I want it fully customizable, I'll need to use texture replacer to change the planet textures, EVE to customize the comets and kerbol, RSS for planet positions, planetfactory ce for maybe for an extra planet or 2.. I forgot about kittopiatech though.

I would highly suggest just redoing the current itteration of Alternis first and then making an add-on with extra planets, that way those who just want a redux of Alternis can get what they want and those who want the add-on version can get what they want. Also I wanted to ask if you have done any work on Alternis yet, and if so, how close you are to posting it in add-on development.

Edited by StormWolf
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Space_Kraken

Space_Kraken

Posted
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If you could do that, that would be amazing. Some issues, however, I looked into planet factory and found that Planet Factory can NOT alter the color of orbits or the color of atmospheres at this time which means that RSS cfgs would probably be the way to go. If i'm not mistaken RSS could probably handle everything (seeing as how the current official version of Alternis is made with RSS anyway). I would try to keep it simple and small, texture replacer eats quite a bit of RAM by its self and might conflict with mods such as EVE (which, as it stands, simply just overwrites Alternis's changes to the planets). Something I've been doing, which I do not like to do, has just been reverting planets to their stock form. This fixes quite a few bugs (excluding their orbit, SOI, etc modifications). I would suggest simply just moving the planets where they are in Alternis now in a new rewrite, fixing all those bugs involved and then move onto fixing the heightmaps, atmosphere, aesthetics, etc. I can't really help with a rewrite however I can bug test as soon as a build is ready. Oh, and please, PLEASE make a github, it will save so much time.

EDIT:

I would highly suggest just redoing the current itteration of Alternis first and then making an add-on with extra planets, that way those who just want a redux of Alternis can get what they want and those who want the add-on version can get what they want. Also I wanted to ask if you have done any work on Alternis yet, and if so, how close you are to posting it in add-on development.

KittopiaTech allows most of the features that planetfactory cannot do. I was about 45% done with the Original Alternis idea when I ran into some major problems with laythe. I then came up with the idea of making a config. I have been chatting with novasilisko about it recently.

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StormWolf

StormWolf

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Posted (edited)
KittopiaTech allows most of the features that planetfactory cannot do. I was about 45% done with the Original Alternis idea when I ran into some major problems with laythe. I then came up with the idea of making a config. I have been chatting with novasilisko about it recently.

I tried through and through to fix Laythe, and despite my efforts I never could get the terrain to work. Based on what happened it was something more than the game's planet parameters, I believe that it is an issue with the game's loading it and transferring from the low quality terrain to the high quality version that appears at close range. I was just looking in the files and Laythe IS lacking a dif file, unlike Minmus, Jool and Duna. If you have been talking to Nova ask him if he has one on his disk somewhere or how he formed the terrain. I understand that you're trying to remake Alternis but for now I would try to upload a stable version of Alternis (barring any stock bugs/kraken that may have been amplified, which I assume is what you are trying to fix). I think a good question is what changed from version 0 to 1.0 in terms of Laythe so I can move from there to try and fix the terrain in current Alternis. As for a re-release I would HIGHLY recommend just completely nuking the Laythe revisions or at least skipping Laythe for now and coming back to it. Laythe is too problematic to have anyone's full attention for now. I also would crowd source parts of the code to make sure Alternis gets out faster.

EDIT:

Did some more Minmus bug testing, Minmus NEEDS a heightmap to correct a lot of its issues. As it stands a few of the craters and the new "red ice lakes" (for lack of a better name) need to be set far above sea level to make sure the other, deeper, craters are still above sea level. I attached an image with some comments on it to aid you. Though I have been to a LOT of Minmus I have NOT been to all of it so you might want to give some more threshold just to be sure. Vall also has a small issue where on the map you will appear to be floating above the planet (but landed and does not have a visible orbit). Actually now that I look at it, Minmus has the same issue. Pending a fix or maybe it's just my stupidity. It might just be some messy coding that I'll have to fix (for Minmus, not so much for Vall). So a recap:

Issues:

Minmus heightmap (URGENT FIX, SCREWS UP CAMERAS)

Vall Floating orbital view

Minmus floating orbital view*

I'll see if I can improvise a map from the current Minmus texture, the heightmaps appear to be black and white so if I can just give it a black and white filter, give the plugin the code to load it I *MIGHT* be able to fix it. Will post in a few days give or take some I might be able to rig it up. I doubt that it will be a permanent fix, though. If you can get in contact with Nova and ask him how to make heightmaps, beyond making it by hand it will go 10x faster.

Edited by StormWolf
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Space_Kraken

Space_Kraken

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I tried through and through to fix Laythe, and despite my efforts I never could get the terrain to work. Based on what happened it was something more than the game's planet parameters, I believe that it is an issue with the game's loading it and transferring from the low quality terrain to the high quality version that appears at close range. I was just looking in the files and Laythe IS lacking a dif file, unlike Minmus, Jool and Duna. If you have been talking to Nova ask him if he has one on his disk somewhere or how he formed the terrain. I understand that you're trying to remake Alternis but for now I would try to upload a stable version of Alternis (barring any stock bugs/kraken that may have been amplified, which I assume is what you are trying to fix). I think a good question is what changed from version 0 to 1.0 in terms of Laythe so I can move from there to try and fix the terrain in current Alternis. As for a re-release I would HIGHLY recommend just completely nuking the Laythe revisions or at least skipping Laythe for now and coming back to it. Laythe is too problematic to have anyone's full attention for now. I also would crowd source parts of the code to make sure Alternis gets out faster.

EDIT:

Did some more Minmus bug testing, Minmus NEEDS a heightmap to correct a lot of its issues. As it stands a few of the craters and the new "red ice lakes" (for lack of a better name) need to be set far above sea level to make sure the other, deeper, craters are still above sea level. I attached an image with some comments on it to aid you. Though I have been to a LOT of Minmus I have NOT been to all of it so you might want to give some more threshold just to be sure. Vall also has a small issue where on the map you will appear to be floating above the planet (but landed and does not have a visible orbit). Actually now that I look at it, Minmus has the same issue. Pending a fix or maybe it's just my stupidity. It might just be some messy coding that I'll have to fix (for Minmus, not so much for Vall). So a recap:

Issues:

Minmus heightmap (URGENT FIX, SCREWS UP CAMERAS)

Vall Floating orbital view

Minmus floating orbital view*

I'll see if I can improvise a map from the current Minmus texture, the heightmaps appear to be black and white so if I can just give it a black and white filter, give the plugin the code to load it I *MIGHT* be able to fix it. Will post in a few days give or take some I might be able to rig it up. I doubt that it will be a permanent fix, though. If you can get in contact with Nova and ask him how to make heightmaps, beyond making it by hand it will go 10x faster.

Perhaps a partnership is in order?

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StormWolf

StormWolf

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Posted (edited)
Perhaps a partnership is in order?

I would agree, I'm trying a few things. I managed to generate a heightmap using SCANSAT's altimetry scanner. Gonna see if that works. We really should start an add-on development thread, a github and get official consent from Nova.

figured I would edit to save some trouble:

EDIT:

I MADE AN AMAZING BREAKTHROUGH! I am able to fix ANY instance of the dark camera issue on ANY planet. jack up the planet PQS Radius an extra 100 or so meters and that lowers sea level below the terrain. Or it appears to. So long as you don't make the normal radius and the PQS radius some ungodly value it SHOULD work fine with minimal issues.

Now I just need to fix Vall.

Edited by StormWolf
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Katchau

Katchau

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Whenever I enter laythe SoI my orbital speed freezes and I can´t change it anymore.

When I go to KSC and back to the vessel the orbital speed goes to zero and I start falling toward Laythe. Is this a known bug ? Is there a fix?

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Space_Kraken

Space_Kraken

Posted
Posted (edited)
I would agree, I'm trying a few things. I managed to generate a heightmap using SCANSAT's altimetry scanner. Gonna see if that works. We really should start an add-on development thread, a github and get official consent from Nova.

figured I would edit to save some trouble:

EDIT:

I MADE AN AMAZING BREAKTHROUGH! I am able to fix ANY instance of the dark camera issue on ANY planet. jack up the planet PQS Radius an extra 100 or so meters and that lowers sea level below the terrain. Or it appears to. So long as you don't make the normal radius and the PQS radius some ungodly value it SHOULD work fine with minimal issues.

Now I just need to fix Vall.

I have a hibernating Alternis Github Repo that we could use. Never would of thought of that fix stormwolf, nice work. I'll PM you some stuff later.

I think once Science of the Spheres gets a beta release to the public we might see a new, official version of Alternis Kerbol utilizing RSS. I wish there were more than one NovaSilisko, so that ScOTS and AlternisKerbol can be worked on.

*cough* Alternis *cough* already uses *cough* RSS maths in it's equations *cough*

Edited by Space_Kraken
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StormWolf

StormWolf

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I have talked with Nova and he said he'd like to eventually re-build Alternis using RSS proper. His opinion on rebuilding Alternis might have changed but the quote seems to suggest that he didn't directly use RSS.

That may be the case but he, him self, has commented in that it is based on the RSS code.

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  • 3 weeks later...
Artouris

Artouris

Posted
Posted (edited)

It does work with the 32 bit and 64 bit versions of KSP. However there are some texture issues and I believe there might be a problem (This is my guess, but I am no programming expert so take it with a grain of salt) with how it handles giving atmospheres to tylo and other planets.

Although I did find that I could get most of it to work with a few work arounds from other mods. I ended up creating a version of it that was somewhat cut down (and I did later arrange the planets in different places because i had some artistic choices), but I mixed that with parts of EVE (Well I mostly used better atmospheres for guidance for clouds and the auroras) and added in the new textures with the Texture Replacer which solved that part of it (Mainly because I believe i broke how it imported textures). Although Tylo remains without a atmosphere and some little details than that. But I decided to throw out my two cents/experimentations that i have done.

Sorry, after a bit more testing I found that career seems to work flawlessly. I first had the missions to achieve orbit around kerbin. Then the next mission was to achieve a orbit around Jool, then go to the Mun. I have to say career is pretty flexible in terms of planet locations. Although I will say that some planets look a bit funky when shrunken/enlarged when playing with better atmospheres (I believe it just might be the height its atmosphere is set at), so thats a bit weird.

Edited by Artouris
Additional Experimentation/Fixing Spelling
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  • 2 weeks later...
PoorYorick

PoorYorick

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Posted (edited)

The config file for the clouds is for an old version of EVE. I'm looking into updating the configs and if I have the time I might try to do it tonight.

Edit: Here's the fixed cloudLayers.cfg. Install the normal alternis clouds first and then replace the cloudLayers.cfg in boulderCo with mine. It's set up for the latest EnvironmentalVisualEnhancements (7.2 I think?) NOT the Overhaul release. Right now it's just the stock file with jool recolored, tylo added, and using the files from Alternis. I probably screwed up somewhere, so contact me if you find something and I'll fix it.

http://pastebin.com/BmDpQTKX

Edited by PoorYorick
Added config file
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