NASA IXS Class Warpship, and Spacedocks - For KSP-I and Stock KSP

[CptRichardson]

Np Kertz! Glad you like it.

And yeah, the Stock KSP version is obviously less tested than the Interstellar version, Cpt. So any feedback is welcome and ill take on board. As you can imagine, i was wary of making it too powerful and people screaming "OP!" So i erred on the side of caution. Dialling it up slightly is always better than dialling it back and annoying folks So ill most likely update the Stock KSP to 1.1 first with the tweaks based on all your feedback.

For one, a thrust of 450 is rather... inadequate for a vessel with a dry tonnage of 45. With fuel, it's... uh... 4000 delta v is nice for a nice close target like Duna, but I don't think it can make a Jool capture burn, let alone avoid getting gravity-slung by a Joolian Moon encounter. And the Xenon collectors don't let you rebuild delta v fast enough to be ready by the time you get there.

[Nori]

For one, a thrust of 450 is rather... inadequate for a vessel with a dry tonnage of 45. With fuel, it's... uh... 4000 delta v is nice for a nice close target like Duna, but I don't think it can make a Jool capture burn, let alone avoid getting gravity-slung by a Joolian Moon encounter. And the Xenon collectors don't let you rebuild delta v fast enough to be ready by the time you get there.

The thrust is actually more than adequate. The issue is the massive rings hold hardly any fuel. To test this, watch the deltav go up very quickly by simple adding a few stock xenon canisters. 16 of them and you more than double your deltav.

The ring should probably have 2-3x the xenon gas.

I would personally like to see the ISP balanced more along the lines of how Near Future Propulsion does it. But that is just my opinion.

[Joachim]

~Joachim

I've honestly not seen a screenie of something with fairings that big before, Joachim. That is amazing!

I have some awesomeness incoming, separate saucer section

[colmo]

Initial impressions are as good as the reviews and videos suggest; this is a fine piece of work indeed. I'm still trying to process what all I can use this for, and how cool it'll look while doing so.

Now, a few nitpicks -

1) As you state this is a part pack, could you split off the side mounting pieces from the main reactor? No need to split them up into smaller pieces, just making them surface mountable means we can swap out either the side mounts or the reactor, or reposition them.

2) The top and bottom recesses on the reactor aren't currently being used, but they could do with nodes to at least allow easy attachment of large docking rings, or use it as the core of a station instead of a ship.

3) Given 0.25 will have internal crew transfer, I don't see a way the crew can get into the side pods without going EVA. B9 uses fairing code to meld side pods of cockpits with fuselage, perhaps a similar trick could be use to create crew tunnels or tubes?

This is one of those iconic mods that come along rarely. Keep it up!

[CptRichardson]

Idea: Modified Saucer/Command pod that deletes most of the EVA staging area/probe hangar in favor of a much smaller EVA/tool storage bin to allow for a 4 man crew with life support, and adding a Karbonite collector part. The idea being for a long-term collection of near-space Karbonite in orbit of Jool, or a Karbonite tanker to haul it back/out at higher speeds than conventional resupply. This could also be repurposed with a general life support module addition to replace one of the outboard pods, to transfer into an orbital spacecraft to return to a planetary surface like Duna, Laythe, or other location.

[Joachim]

One slight problem, where do you put the docking port to dock the ixs in the spaceport?????? No node at the front and the rear is the engine sooooooooooooooo

[CptRichardson]

One slight problem, where do you put the docking port to dock the ixs in the spaceport?????? No node at the front and the rear is the engine sooooooooooooooo

On the little side nodes (which are too small to fit anyone through as they're probe type), or stick a top-mounted airlock system on through a radial attachent system put onto one of the dorsal/ventral flat spot pair.

[Joachim]

On the little side nodes (which are too small to fit anyone through as they're probe type), or stick a top-mounted airlock system on through a radial attachent system put onto one of the dorsal/ventral flat spot pair.

Yes that all works for docking to most things, but the spaceports actually included really need front or rear docking ports to actually fit the ship in the dock.

Edited September 7, 2014 by Joachim

[CptRichardson]

Yes that all works for docking to most things, but the spaceports actually include really need front or rear docking ports to actually fit the ship in the dock.

I suppose another variant with a docking adaptor that retracts/extends through the front hatch could work for that. (With EVA hatch on top of the docking port arm).

[colmo]

I think the saucer need capacity for a lot more monopropellant - which people may or may not want to make use of. With a 3.75m docking port and some O-10s, it becomes a capable little short-range vessel.

I note the crewman requirement in the fusion reactor isn't enforced in the stock version. Is it possible to put that in? Bob's low Stupidity has Chief Engineer written all over him.

[deepfield]

I love this bundle man! Great job! That spacedock though.... favorite part.

[megatiger78]

this is why I am installing mods now....

[megatiger78]

why does the warp and resourece detector that isn't karbonite not work?

[Stevie_D]

I've no idea which version or what mods you have installed. So it's hard to say.

Having read the Karbonite and KSP-I Lite boards, it seems that a lot of the troubles come from installing KSP-I lite first. Apparently Karbonite and KSP-Lite work best when Karbonite is installed first, then removing all the folders that they both share (Toolbar, OpenResources, CommunityResourcePack, and Treeloader), THEN installing KSP-I Lite/Interstellar. No idea why this would be, but it's the only fix for potential problems there is right now.

[Mitchz95]

Am I the only one that places guns or missiles behind thr doors of the command pods.

I am going to try that as soon as I get home from work.

[megatiger78]

I've no idea which version or what mods you have installed. So it's hard to say.

Having read the Karbonite and KSP-I Lite boards, it seems that a lot of the troubles come from installing KSP-I lite first. Apparently Karbonite and KSP-Lite work best when Karbonite is installed first, then removing all the folders that they both share (Toolbar, OpenResources, CommunityResourcePack, and Treeloader), THEN installing KSP-I Lite/Interstellar. No idea why this would be, but it's the only fix for potential problems there is right now.

I had full ksp-I installed first

[darfielg]

I'm having a problem with the connection between the Alcubierre Rings and anything beneath it. Though they connect in the VAB or SPH, whenever I launch them the connection between the Alcubierre Ring and the object below it deletes, and the ring falls through the object. Any ideas why?

[CptRichardson]

Further notes on the design and ways to improve the stock version:

Thrust does not drop off when you run out of battery power. You would figure that it would properly model running on just the power output of the main reactor instead of supplimental battery power, but it doesn't seem to.

Doesn't seem to be any CLS support.

Could there be an option to temporarily switch reactants? Like say, going to LOX or Karbonite if you have fuel stocks of either aboard for temporary more power (up to lots) at the expense of more power drain as the engine compensates for the different fuel mix?

Having optional modules for hauling mass loads of Snacks, Water, and air out to remote colonies would be nice, as would be a Universal Storage modifed module for the main hull, but not entirely necessary. Heck, a cargo bay module in general would be pretty nice.

SOUND. I don't care if it's not realistic, but having the impulse drive sounds from ST:II would be badass for this thing when the stock version is throttled up.

LIGHTS! Running lights, plz?

And from playing around with the volume of the stock xenon canisters and comparing them to your warp rings, you can safely add a zero to the end of your xenon amounts per ring and still fit plausibility.

I mean, if you decide to do nothing else with this mod, it's fine, but I can think of bunches of ways to turn this into THE iconic end-game craft pack.

Edited September 7, 2014 by CptRichardson
One More Thing![/Jackie Chan Uncle]

[colmo]

Doesn't seem to be any CLS support.

I whipped up a config here: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/68617-WIP-Connected-Living-Space-API-for-connected-habs-%28new-download-9-June-14%29?p=1400103&viewfull=1#post1400103

Having optional modules for hauling mass loads of Snacks, Water, and air out to remote colonies would be nice, as would be a Universal Storage modifed module for the main hull, but not entirely necessary. Heck, a cargo bay module in general would be pretty nice.

I see no harm in mod makers supplying their own IXS modules. Any 2.5m part will do, and length can be tuned by adding other bits to the ends. In view of how much effort it takes to make a new model, especially with IVA, I'd concentrate on the parts already in the pack. Some of the fuel tanks are a bit polygonal in profile, they don't look like smooth cylinders. The bridge needs a proper IVA, that's got to be #1 new asset.

The Hangar has a precedent - http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/88933-0-24-2-Hangar-v1-1-1-1 - it's in desperate need of new models and textures, but the coding and principal seem sound. The author has explained he's not much of a modeller or artist. Anything which fits with this pack should fit with stock generally, so all to the good.

[WaveFunctionP]

I've no idea which version or what mods you have installed. So it's hard to say.

Having read the Karbonite and KSP-I Lite boards, it seems that a lot of the troubles come from installing KSP-I lite first. Apparently Karbonite and KSP-Lite work best when Karbonite is installed first, then removing all the folders that they both share (Toolbar, OpenResources, CommunityResourcePack, and Treeloader), THEN installing KSP-I Lite/Interstellar. No idea why this would be, but it's the only fix for potential problems there is right now.

I'll look into this.

Additionally, if you need any code support or run into more issues like this, please message me.

Edited September 8, 2014 by WaveFunctionP

[Fr8monkey]

Maybe I missed something. Downloaded and tried it. but I click the command pod; and I try to add another part and it wont attach. I am then stuck not being able to connect any parts. I then have to go to desktop to close out the game because I can't back out.

What did I do wrong?

P.S. I am playing with the stock version.

[Mekan1k]

Oohhh... The GN engine mod- you should add it's functionality to the alcubierre rings!

[Stevie_D]

EDIT - Oops, i missed a few replies. Sorry folks! There we go!

The thrust is actually more than adequate. The issue is the massive rings hold hardly any fuel. To test this, watch the deltav go up very quickly by simple adding a few stock xenon canisters. 16 of them and you more than double your deltav.

The ring should probably have 2-3x the xenon gas.

I would personally like to see the ISP balanced more along the lines of how Near Future Propulsion does it. But that is just my opinion.

That was my thinking after testing out a few more scenarios. And although i dont have Near Future as one of my mods, i have used it in the past and completely agree Nori. I redownloaded it after you mentioned it and will use it as a baseline comparison in 1.1. Cant guarnatee it'll be perfect, but that was the sort of thing i was going after.

1) As you state this is a part pack, could you split off the side mounting pieces from the main reactor? No need to split them up into smaller pieces, just making them surface mountable means we can swap out either the side mounts or the reactor, or reposition them.

I tried that unfortunately Colmo. The result was a pain to handle, because the attachment system hated any and every collision system i tried with it. The result was tanks not wanting to sit in the truss system or being a real pain the butt to get anything to look even semi-coherant to the actual ship it was meaning to represent. Detatching the truss system altogether also would encourage people to use it for unintended purposes. So with all those things together, the truss system i currently have seems to make the best of the situation.

2) The top and bottom recesses on the reactor aren't currently being used, but they could do with nodes to at least allow easy attachment of large docking rings, or use it as the core of a station instead of a ship.

They do have clampotron node points, but for standard and not for large rings. The theory behind it was if you wanted to use the smallest ports, you clamp onto the port or starboard struts, if you wanted standard clampotron stuff you had the dorsal and ventral of the reactor, and if you wanted to shift large 2.5m docking port stuff you can use the truss system.

I have pondered changing the ventral and dorsal docking ports on the main hull to accomodate large clampotrons however. Again, more of me wanting to "dial it up", rather than "dial things back".

But im wary of people using it as the core of a station, or seperating it from its truss system; since it would involve making the actual ship harder to assemble for people, and i also am wary of unbalancing KSPI.

3) Given 0.25 will have internal crew transfer, I don't see a way the crew can get into the side pods without going EVA. B9 uses fairing code to meld side pods of cockpits with fuselage, perhaps a similar trick could be use to create crew tunnels or tubes?

This is one of those iconic mods that come along rarely. Keep it up!

Thanks! And yeah that would make sense. However with my current to do list being as big as it is, ill add that to the backburner, and see about it when .25 hits. Im wary of jumping the gun with stuff thats incoming in the stock game and we dont yet know much about.

I'm having a problem with the connection between the Alcubierre Rings and anything beneath it. Though they connect in the VAB or SPH, whenever I launch them the connection between the Alcubierre Ring and the object below it deletes, and the ring falls through the object. Any ideas why?

It sounds like you're using it with the old, unfixed version of KSP-Interstellar (version 11.0). Things falling through parts was something Kerbal Space Program 24.2 broke with Fractal_UK's version. WavefunctionP created a 11.0 Interstellar hotfix that you can google or search for.

If the problem is in KSP-I Lite, or Stock KSP, then it sounds like you've installed the mod incorrectly.

Maybe I missed something. Downloaded and tried it. but I click the command pod; and I try to add another part and it wont attach. I am then stuck not being able to connect any parts. I then have to go to desktop to close out the game because I can't back out.

.

Again, it sounds like you didn't install the mod into the proper folder. Make sure to copy the IXS' GameData folder into the KSP directory that ~contains~ the Gamedata folder, and not copy or move it *inside* the KSP GameData folder.

Thrust does not drop off when you run out of battery power.

As i said in my previous post, balancing is still ongoing with the Stock KSP version. I still want power to be an issue/challenge in it however, because of the sheer nature of QV drives is based around it.

If i dont have an EC cap (that can still be altered by the player lets not forget), then they could whack on any number of spaced apart rings and burn beyond the solar system even heh. EC is currently a cap that says "either weigh yourself down with more charge, or lets take a breather for a moment whilst i recharge." And even then, with the main hull EC comes back very quickly. So im still mulling these things over as i try different scenarios.

Doesn't seem to be any CLS support.

I cant think of everything for the first release!

Im more than happy to add CLS support, and super thanks to Colmo for whipping up a config!

Could there be an option to temporarily switch reactants?

- I pondered myself making the Stock version have switchable fuel modes, especially for karbonite. It's already on the "to do" list for 1.1

Having optional modules for hauling mass loads of Snacks, Water, and air out to remote colonies would be nice,

As Colmo says, a lot of that stuff already comes with it's own tanks. Its part of the reason i made the truss system work as it does. You can already slot in any 2.5m tank that those mods come with. Heck, ive tried using the truss system with docking ports and already sent cargo packages to my duna station. So that wont be a priority for 1.1. But i was a fan of that tank (i think karbonite mod) that Rover supplied that could change its contents to whatever you wanted. If i can replicate that, i may rebrand the current IXS LFO tank to suit that purpose. Creating multiple tanks for different things individually would be a huge timesink, not to mention bloatware.

SOUND. I don't care if it's not realistic, but having the impulse drive sounds from ST:II would be badass for this thing when the stock version is throttled up.

I'm not a fan of the silent ion drive either. The engine currently just replicates that, which is why there's no sound. Again, that's already written down for 1.1

LIGHTS! Running lights, plz?

Newp! There are other mods that do it way better than a mere modeller like me can hope to accomplish. I have to balance authenticity/kerbalization and gameplay at the end of the day, and keeping the part count down is important until KSP eventually moves over to Unity 5 to alleviate the problem.

So i dont want to have people downloading IXS nav lights as bloatware because they might already have a nav lights mod installed (and i cant expect the average joe gamer to know how to go into their game folders to delete whichever parts they dont want)

And from playing around with the volume of the stock xenon canisters and comparing them to your warp rings, you can safely add a zero to the end of your xenon amounts per ring and still fit plausibility.

As i said before Cpt, 1.0 was me being conservative. It's easier to dial things up, and have people go "Ah, good." than nerf things and people go "OMFG U STRANDED ME AT EELOO!"

At the end of the day, the balance has to be right to still make it a game, and challenging for spaceflight. So pushing it up incrementally and finding the sweet spot is my goal in this regard

Additionally, if you need any code support or run into more issues like this, please message me.

Thanks, will do, Wave! And sorry for not getting the info to you before about that installation oddity. I was literally late for a night out when i posted that last bit.

Oohhh... The GN engine mod- you should add it's functionality to the alcubierre rings!

I have had a couple people PM me asking if there might be a non-KSPI stock version that would actually be a warp capable ship.

Im in serious danger of having too many DLs for this mod and confusing people, but it would cover all the bases then. KSPI users, stock non-warp users, and the stock warp wishers. So i wont promise anything, and cant promise it will become a reality, but i will promise ill look into the GN mod further and see if it might work.

Edited September 8, 2014 by Stevie_D

[CptRichardson]

Well, the thing is, I have a lot of problems getting anything other than your parts to actually work with your truss system. I've been fighting the 2.5 meter xenon tanks from NFP to try and get them to slot into the system, and they don't play nice. Nor do a few other parts meant to fit to 2.5 meter nodes. Your parts work nearly perfectly most of the time, though I still have some issues with them mysteriously not wanting to go on, but anything else is like... I dunno, trying to fit Jeremy Clarkson into a two-person smart car and expecting him to like it.

Addendum: I wasn't talking about separate lights, but integrated ones ala Trek.

Edited September 8, 2014 by CptRichardson

[WaveFunctionP]

Well, the thing is, I have a lot of problems getting anything other than your parts to actually work with your truss system. I've been fighting the 2.5 meter xenon tanks from NFP to try and get them to slot into the system, and they don't play nice. Nor do a few other parts meant to fit to 2.5 meter nodes. Your parts work nearly perfectly most of the time, though I still have some issues with them mysteriously not wanting to go on, but anything else is like... I dunno, trying to fit Jeremy Clarkson into a two-person smart car and expecting him to like it.

Addendum: I wasn't talking about separate lights, but integrated ones ala Trek.

Use editor extensions and disable surface attachment (alt + r, I think) for the part with it, which should allow them to pop into place without trying to stick to the sides. It's not just this mod that has a problem, its that the default editor can't prioritize that node THAT IT'S LIKE LITERALLY SITTING RIGHT THERE ON TOP OF! NO!, RIGHT THERE STUPID EDITOR! RIGHT THHHHHEEEERRRRREEEEE! CLICK! CLICK! CLICK!

/bashkeyboard

*COUGH* Um, so, yeah. Use editor extensions, it's a lot better than the default editor options.