[1.12.x] Mark IV Spaceplane System (August 18, 2024)

[Kebra]

Any good suggestions on how i can align COT and COM using the engine pods? I have had some luck by raising the wings, but not enough.

Once i get to space my rapiers are tilting the craft with all SAS modules going wild.

[Logan.Darklighter]

And I'm still having trouble figuring out how to embed Imgur album sets. But spoiler tags I could easily do. I'll go back and spoiler tag that long post on the previous page so people don't get slammed with all the images when it loads if someone will just tell me what the spoiler html tags are. (I've already tried

so I know that's not it.)

[Logan.Darklighter]

Any good suggestions on how i can align COT and COM using the engine pods? I have had some luck by raising the wings, but not enough.

Once i get to space my rapiers are tilting the craft with all SAS modules going wild.

I could try and help. But I'm not sure I'm clearly imagining what the problem is. Can you post a picture from the Spaceplane hanger of your craft with the COM, COL and COT tags showing?

[funk]

Any good suggestions on how i can align COT and COM using the engine pods? I have had some luck by raising the wings, but not enough.

Once i get to space my rapiers are tilting the craft with all SAS modules going wild.

First use RCSbuildAid, Second place wings and tail and then place some radial fuselages and/or engines so that COM/COT are nearly aligned, use RCSbuildAid for determination of needed torque for COM, ACOM, DCOM. If they are all in 60-80% limits of SAS capability its all fine. Repeat the iterations for fine tune (raise/lower tail/wings, ad/delete some stuff or in bad cases reengineering will be needed. TACfuelBalancer helps alot for in flight testing or in general.

And I'm still having trouble figuring out how to embed Imgur album sets. But spoiler tags I could easily do. I'll go back and spoiler tag that long post on the previous page so people don't get slammed with all the images when it loads if someone will just tell me what the spoiler html tags are. (I've already tried

Use your Imgur-album-ID and put it between (imgur)ID(/imgur). Use squared brackets instead of curved ones. ID looks like this SYDGC fro example

so I know that's not it.)

Edited December 5, 2014 by funk

[Kebra]

I could try and help. But I'm not sure I'm clearly imagining what the problem is. Can you post a picture from the Spaceplane hanger of your craft with the COM, COL and COT tags showing?

Ofcourse.

Pods under the orignal snappoint of the wings:

http://cloud-4.steampowered.com/ugc/30727700121539880/360A6C2269F5415327B19E6AA5B8B63BE213F6F3/

I can successfully fix it by doubling up on pods:

http://cloud-4.steampowered.com/ugc/30727700121544266/1020EA5E9B6122A299C37A9FB4CBF64667050F8B/

But it looks very unrealistic.

Are the pods primarly meant for atmo flight only planes?

My problem might be that i'm fooling around with a space cargoplane.

(nb, i have simplified by craft a lot for these pictures, they represent the problem, not the craft im trying to fix it on)

Edited December 5, 2014 by Kebra

[Helix935]

Nertea are you by any chance planning to have black heat tile textures for the Mark IV?

[Wanderfound]

This is the other cockpit I'm intending to add. I would be interested in your opinion of what a 'conventional' tailpiece would look like.

Nice...

For the tailpiece, I was thinking of something a bit more elongated; the sort of thing that could possibly double as a nosecone if flipped and used with an inline cockpit. Speaking of which...a proper inline (i.e. full size at both ends) cockpit would be handy.

There might be some useful inspiration in PJ's unused bits:

[Beetlecat]

There might be some useful inspiration in PJ's unused bits:

You just have to break them off the sprue and sand off the connection point so the nodes will line up properly...

[Nertea]

Any good suggestions on how i can align COT and COM using the engine pods? I have had some luck by raising the wings, but not enough.

Once i get to space my rapiers are tilting the craft with all SAS modules going wild.

You're definitely going to run into a few issues using the pods like that. Underwing usage is certainly not good for space unless you have engines on the other side of the wing, given the shape of the fuselage. You could probably get something correct by using the correct wing angles, RCS build Aid will help here.

Nertea are you by any chance planning to have black heat tile textures for the Mark IV?

Not really. Lots of work, not much gain.

Nice...

For the tailpiece, I was thinking of something a bit more elongated; the sort of thing that could possibly double as a nosecone if flipped and used with an inline cockpit. Speaking of which...a proper inline (i.e. full size at both ends) cockpit would be handy.

There might be some useful inspiration in PJ's unused bits:

http://i1378.photobucket.com/albums/ah120/craigmotbey/Kerbal/imagejpg1_zps765b3b41.jpg

Yeah, I've basically made the ones on that set save for the really really pointy one.

I did make a long nose piece, it's intended for the use you describe. I kept it with a chopped off nose so that the docking nosecone could be added on an unmanned craft. Not quite what you were looking for? It's in the third image in the OP album.

I'm wavering back and forth on the idea of an inline cockpit. It's going to be an awful lot of empty cabin space to move the windows above the fuselage. It'll either need to be packed with fuel or an awkward cargo space. Thinking resultingly of making it a radially attachable thing.

[Dunewolf]

Hi - Loved your parts in this -- despite fact I am horrible at making anything with wings fly, or making planes in game anyway.. heh..

I can barely keep stock planes flying lol..

Anyway

Regarding your inline cockpit idea - how about something along the lines of your cargo part, with a cockpit above - kinda like your talking - it would be kinda in-line with the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Cargolux_B747-400F.jpg

Cargolux version 747, sorta? would require some kinda front loading door design as an addition, but it would be kinda cool design. for a roll on/roll off cargo plane?

[Hyomoto]

I'm wavering back and forth on the idea of an inline cockpit. It's going to be an awful lot of empty cabin space to move the windows above the fuselage. It'll either need to be packed with fuel or an awkward cargo space. Thinking resultingly of making it a radially attachable thing.

Keep in mind, a 'cockpit' doesn't have to inhabit the entire space. I couldn't find a useful picture but hopefully this gives you an idea. In planes that don't specialize in carrying cargo, there are usually large areas beneath the cabin that are used for avionics systems and maintenance items, small but enough to perform maintenance or fight a fire. I may be underestimating the size of your parts, since I haven't played with them just yet, but fuel tanks aren't the only option. Having a place like this to store tanks and batteries would be welcome as well.

[Raptor9]

All this stuff is making me want to build bunch of Thunderbird replicas...they certainly look Kerbal in design (loosely at least).

[Logan.Darklighter]

Say - will these parts work with Kerb Paint?

[Chezburgar7300]

Say - will these parts work with Kerb Paint?

Nah, sorry. The dev of KerbPaint has to individually do something (can't remember what) with each part for each pack. And, he hasn't updated Kerbpaint for a while (.23 I think is it's latest).

[Crozius]

It would help the dev process of getting these to work with kerbpaint immensely if you released the textures in a .png or .psd file for us to work with. It sucks trying to get .mbm to .png.

[gkorgood]

is it just me or do profile shots of relatively short MkIV planes remind people of bumble bees? like with a body that large of girth, those wings should really be twice the size they are to lift it?

[Helix935]

oh hello Nertea i have a bug of report which involves the IVA and well the pictures says it all

not really troubling but it is really annoying to look at

also outside of that one detail, i love he pars, already launched one into high orbit and back twice

[ZodiaK]

*cough* thunderbird 2 *cough*

[SheepDog2142]

Bug report:

Every time I try to attach a utility module (the hollo one with the eva tanks) to a crew cabin my game crashes. I get a ding and crash. Any other part works fine.

[MisterFister]

This mod looks awesome, and it's an insta-download. The RPM integration looks spot on, from what I can see prior to unzipping and using it.

However, I note something curious in the OP by the mod-author. Someone making [awesome] spaceplane parts, who uses the stock aerodynamics system that turns KSP atmosphere into digital mayonnaise. I'm not making fun, I think it's just noteworthy, kinda like Mozart composing operas and symphonies after going deaf. That this mod is as beautiful, and obviously popular, is a testament to the author's skill.

That said, just as I would ask Mozart questions relating to how such a feat could be accomplished, I would like to ask here: why the seeming aversion to FAR? I ask not out of partisan debate, but again, genuine curiosity.

[Neutrinovore]

Err, I'm having a minor problem. I have no textures on the two new intake parts. In the config, the texture callout doesn't seem to point to an existing texture, or at least the texture that it calls for, 'blank', isn't in the location it's pointing to in the folder hierarchy. The 'blank' texture is in the intake's own folder, but the config is saying that that tex is in the folder for the MkIV-1 Cockpit, I believe. I'm not at my computer right now, sorry.

Anyway, I tried a few different changes, trying to reference the right folder path and/or texture file, but I can't figure it out, so all I get are parts that are either solid shiny black, or pure white. And again, just on the 2 newest radial intakes, all the other MkIV parts look fine. Weird.

If anyone could post a config that shows the right info, I'd appreciate it. Thanks!

[Woodstar]

EDIT: NVM texturereplacer was my problem.

Edited December 6, 2014 by Woodstar

[Nertea]

Bug report:

Every time I try to attach a utility module (the hollo one with the eva tanks) to a crew cabin my game crashes. I get a ding and crash. Any other part works fine.

This part has nothing special about it. I'll need a log to debug.

oh hello Nertea i have a bug of report which involves the IVA and well the pictures says it all

http://i.imgur.com/3iG11NQ.png

not really troubling but it is really annoying to look at

also outside of that one detail, i love he pars, already launched one into high orbit and back twice

Urk. I'll have a check.

It would help the dev process of getting these to work with kerbpaint immensely if you released the textures in a .png or .psd file for us to work with. It sucks trying to get .mbm to .png.

I don't release psd as a policy, I'm afraid. Reexporting everything in png would take quite a while also. I can provide tgas to you if you really want, as I have them made (use them as an intermediary).

Keep in mind, a 'cockpit' doesn't have to inhabit the entire space. I couldn't find a useful picture but hopefully this gives you an idea. In planes that don't specialize in carrying cargo, there are usually large areas beneath the cabin that are used for avionics systems and maintenance items, small but enough to perform maintenance or fight a fire. I may be underestimating the size of your parts, since I haven't played with them just yet, but fuel tanks aren't the only option. Having a place like this to store tanks and batteries would be welcome as well.

http://www.bst-tsb.gc.ca/eng/rapports-reports/aviation/1996/a96o0030/96o0030.gif

Fair enough, that's probably what'll happen. I'm sure I can make it look good.

Err, I'm having a minor problem. I have no textures on the two new intake parts. In the config, the texture callout doesn't seem to point to an existing texture, or at least the texture that it calls for, 'blank', isn't in the location it's pointing to in the folder hierarchy. The 'blank' texture is in the intake's own folder, but the config is saying that that tex is in the folder for the MkIV-1 Cockpit, I believe. I'm not at my computer right now, sorry.

Anyway, I tried a few different changes, trying to reference the right folder path and/or texture file, but I can't figure it out, so all I get are parts that are either solid shiny black, or pure white. And again, just on the 2 newest radial intakes, all the other MkIV parts look fine. Weird.

If anyone could post a config that shows the right info, I'd appreciate it. Thanks!

Hmm, I think there must be something else up. The config doesn't say that, it says "replace the texture called blank in my own folder with the textures from the mk4pod folder". Works fine for me and for other people, apparently. And you're sure every single part looks fine? Engine pods included (that's where the intake texture is). Please verify you have the file GameData/MkIVSystem/Parts/Pods/mk4pod-1/mk4pod-1.mbm available.

You might try redownloading and reinstalling as well. If not, well, I'll need a log!

[Kebra]

You're definitely going to run into a few issues using the pods like that. Underwing usage is certainly not good for space unless you have engines on the other side of the wing, given the shape of the fuselage. You could probably get something correct by using the correct wing angles, RCS build Aid will help here.

How are the pods meant to be used?

They have attachment points above and below on the flatsurface. Not on the sides.

Attaching them "upright" on the side of the hull suffers from clipping issues.

Attachking on the buttum of the hull will result in a COT off from COM.

I have reverted back to using MK2 parts for "in wing" pods. That seems to work faily well

[Krevsin]

Absolutely terrific parts, I pretty much exclusively use them for my spaceplanes now.

Although I'm wondering, are you planning on making a shorter cockpit?