to mod or not to mod (new player)

[crycyrc]

I just started learning KSP and I really have great deal of fun. I watch tutorial videos, read stuff and play to learn the game mechanics. However, my question is that whether I really need mods or not? Does the game itself provide adequate tools? I don't want to play it like cheating. I read some stuff about mechjeb doing many stuff for you such as autopiloting many things. I mean that could be helpful but I am not sure if I feel like playing the game. Therefore, the question is that if there is an essential mod or not? What do you recommend to a new player? I have never played earlier versions btw.

Thanks.

[sal_vager]

Well, you don't need mods, the game can be played stock no trouble, but it's your game, mod it if you want to

[Kryxal]

You might want to consider the distinction between informational mods, parts mods, and other mods.  Things like Kerbal Alarm Clock, pretty much nobody argues against, for example.  Parts mods can have a major impact on gameplay, though.

[bewing]

You might want to think about what makes the game fun for you. It's not just one thing for everyone. Some people like learning orbital mechanics (ie. "rocket science"). Some people think of it as a puzzle to figure out. Some people just want to build and launch rockets and jets. Some people find it hilarious to watch things blow up. Or to find glitches. Or they want a super hard challenge. Or they want to roleplay exploring a solar system.

Some of those things can be done very well with the stock game. Some can be done better with a mod or two (or fifty).

 

[Jarin]

@crycyrc I'd suggest sticking to at least a semi-stock experience while you learn the game. Add too much and you're learning your modpack, not the game. That being said, let's talk about pros and cons of some major non-part mods.

I highly recommend getting a basic informational mod for showing you craft Delta V, orbital information, etc. Your primary choices here are Kerbal Engineer Redux and MechJeb. People have differing opinions on the latter due to its autopilot features, but those don't have to be used, and it's a great informational tool regardless. Some people also say that watching the autopilot perform maneuvers is a decent way to learn to do them yourself. Your mileage may vary.

Kerbal Alarm Clock is something I could not live without, but may or may not be necessary for a complete newcomer. If you only ever have one mission active at a time and always keep it in focus, this does basically nothing. But if you ever want to run some orbital tourists around while a probe is on a trip to Minmus or something, this becomes invaluable. 

For assistance in ship building, you might consider Editor Extensions. It adds a huge number of useful tools to the VAB and SPH. On the other hand, it also adds to both complexity and ship design options; so falls into the category of "maybe learn the base game first". 

Waypoint Manager. Use it. Love it. Can't think of any drawbacks. Immeasurable improvement to any location-based contracts.

There's plenty of other possibilities, but those are mods I consider to be reasonably core to any playstyle. If you have interest in a particular area of the game, I might have more suggestions.

Edited March 16, 2017 by Jarin

[Spricigo]

 

Its up to you decide if the stock game is adequate or if it need fine tunning. If you decide something different can improve your game experience go for it.

Also, while some mods can make the game arguable easier, many mods preserve the challenges of the game or even bring new ones. As an example there is no life support in the stock game but several mods are available if you are interested. There is also "info mods" that just present some information in a different  form, "cosmetic mods" that just change some visuals/sounds/etc, "quality of life mods" that aim to 'fix' some awkward interface.  Even if a particular mod make the game easier often can be argued that its an aspect that the game its more difficult than necessary, and being KSP a sandbox single player game the general consensus its that nothing is "cheating" except if you brag about doing it with no mods/glitch/tricks (like is often required in a challenge )

Edited March 17, 2017 by Spricigo

[crycyrc]

thank you all for your answers and precious time.

@Jarin I might be interested in some information showing mods actually. I believe I can also learn how to calculate stuff by that. I don't really want to use automatic stuff that mechjeb offers. I wanna learn it by trial and error for a while so which one do you recommend? You said that it is not obligatory to use the autopilot feature of mechjeb but I am not really sure I understand what these 2 mods offer.

 

 

[HebaruSan]

2 hours ago, crycyrc said:

I just started learning KSP and I really have great deal of fun. I watch tutorial videos, read stuff and play to learn the game mechanics. However, my question is that whether I really need mods or not?

No, you don't need mods. There's a ton of content in the stock game, and it's perfectly possible to have fun with it for hundreds of hours.

2 hours ago, crycyrc said:

Does the game itself provide adequate tools?

For certain things, yes. The craft editor is pretty good, the map screen and maneuver nodes are capable enough for trips to and from the starting planet's moons, and the available parts will keep you busy for a long time even if some obvious ones are missing. But there are a few big things that are useful to have that the stock game doesn't do at all, such as calculating the delta V of your craft or suggesting good times to launch for other planets. Often such things become more relevant as you attempt more difficult things, but the stock tools are pretty adequate for the things you'll want to do in the early stages.

2 hours ago, crycyrc said:

I don't want to play it like cheating. I read some stuff about mechjeb doing many stuff for you such as autopiloting many things. I mean that could be helpful but I am not sure if I feel like playing the game. Therefore, the question is that if there is an essential mod or not?

You will find people on these forums who never use mods, people who refuse to touch the game with fewer than 100 mods installed, and all points in between.

2 hours ago, crycyrc said:

What do you recommend to a new player? I have never played earlier versions btw.

Play stock until you feel your fun levels start to plateau or decline. Then try some basic informational mods, to help you get more out of the stock parts and gameplay; say, KER for planning precise, efficient launches and my mod for interplanetary trips . Then once you get used to that, add mods that change gameplay or add parts, to do things that you can't do in stock; e.g., deprive your crew of life support, explore the Real Solar System, or build truly gigantic rockets. Somewhere in there you'll find the degree of modding that's right for you.

One point that should be noted is that mods are not really sandboxed at all; code written by modders can do almost anything it likes with very few limitations. This flexibility allows the aspiring mod developer to make things work exactly the way he or she wants them to, given enough time and effort, and without that, we may not have had such a great variety of mods available. But it also means that there are no practical limits to the negative impact a flaw or bug in a mod can have; your frame rate might slow down, your crafts might disappear for no discernible reason, your save might be corrupted, or your game might crash. A particularly common problem is for heavily modded installs to experience a "stutter" every 5-20 seconds when the Mono/Unity garbage collector runs, because so many mods are running so much code and generating so much garbage that it takes a painfully noticeable amount of time to clean it all up. When this happens, uninstalling some mods can help, but you can't uninstall certain mods without breaking your save, so it's better to exercise caution up front.

[Jarin]

1 hour ago, crycyrc said:

thank you all for your answers and precious time.

@Jarin I might be interested in some information showing mods actually. I believe I can also learn how to calculate stuff by that. I don't really want to use automatic stuff that mechjeb offers. I wanna learn it by trial and error for a while so which one do you recommend? You said that it is not obligatory to use the autopilot feature of mechjeb but I am not really sure I understand what these 2 mods offer.

With the disclaimer that it's partly personal preference, I'd say go with Kerbal Engineer. 

[Waxing_Kibbous]

I'm a big fan of basic orbit and portrait stats, basic orbit gives good info but isn't too OP, worth it just for Ap/Pe and surface Alt readout

Also BetterBurnTime for proper node burn times, for fun disable the suicide burn and rendezvous readouts:

Lastly

These are all good mods the improve quality of life without giving too much away.

[FloppyRocket]

Do what gives you the most enjoyment.

For me, I'm playing completely stock career mode. The stock game provides plenty of tools, though you have to earn some of them (maneuver nodes, etc). I figured out how to compute delta-v for myself, both as part of the rocket design and in figuring out much delta-v I have left at any point in the mission. My trusty HP calculator is my co-pilot. There are lots of resources that explain delta-v calculation. 

I'll probably use some mods when it feels like I need them. So far, I'm limited only by how much time I can put into the game, not its tools.

[paulprogart]

6 minutes ago, FloppyRocket said:

Do what gives you the most enjoyment.

For me, I'm playing completely stock career mode. The stock game provides plenty of tools, though you have to earn some of them (maneuver nodes, etc). I figured out how to compute delta-v for myself, both as part of the rocket design and in figuring out much delta-v I have left at any point in the mission. My trusty HP calculator is my co-pilot. There are lots of resources that explain delta-v calculation. 

I'll probably use some mods when it feels like I need them. So far, I'm limited only by how much time I can put into the game, not its tools.

This.  If you are interested in learning all the basics (rocketry/aero/orbital stuff), play until you get to the point where something gets tedious or frustrating and you don't want to (or don't have time to) figure out a way to do it with stock.  Then and only then find mods for it... whether it's informational tools, assistance, extra parts, whatever.  At least then you will not only know that you want/need them but also why.  It's the best way to learn and provides the most long-term benefit.

I played 700 hours unmodded stock career because I had time (unemployed) and wanted the challenge of figuring it all out.  But for my next KSP game (once I have time) I will mod quite a bit because now I know what I like doing, and what I don't like.

If however you want to do something specific (spaceplanes, mining, realism, etc.) then you will probably need mods for that from the start.  Not my area though.

 

[bigcalm]

Agreed with the "do whatever is most fun" for you.  And/or do whatever suits your gameplay style the best.

Kerbal Alarm Clock -- this allows you to manage multiple missions at once.  For example, if you send your first rocket off to the Mun, you've likely got a few hours before it gets there.  By setting an alarm for when it passes its SOI, you can then do other stuff in the meantime - do some Kerbin-based contracts, or send another rocket out to the Mun.  As soon as the alarm is due it'll pop up and ask if you want to jump to the ship, so you can plan your next move.

MechJeb - allows automation of certain things.  If you play in Career mode, you are likely to have to do everything manually before you can automate it with MechJeb.  So your first, second and third landings on the Mun will all be done yourself without the option of automation.  Your fourth however, you can tell MechJeb to land for you.  For me, I find MechJeb indispensible - but I send flotillas of ships each transfer window - if you send one each time, it's barely worth it.  Consider my first Gilly and Eve window, I sent 15 ships to do various things for Gilly.  That added up to 15 initial launches (from LKO), 15 tuning burns, 15 fine-tuning burns, 15 initial braking burns, 15 plane change burns, 15 circularisation burns, 15 hohmann transfers, 15 fine tuning burns and 15 circularisation burns - this doesn't count initial launches, SOI changes, and final landing either.  That's over 100 maneuver nodes to plot and execute and is an awful lot of work with no automation.  I can do it myself, and I can do most things better than MechJeb (he's better at Docking, accurate landings on airless worlds, and fine tuning, I can do pretty much everything else better), I just would rather automate it.  

Kerbal Engineer - gives a lot of information, some of which should be in the standard game.  Things like true altitude - in the standard game you don't know your true altitude, you know your altitude from sea-level/datum.  When landing pretty much anything this means you're guessing where the ground is - this fills that void.  It will also calculate delta-v for you and give information about a whole bunch of other stuff.  If you choose not to use MechJeb (which has similar informational windows) then Engineer is recommended.  If you do use MechJeb, Engineer is mostly superfluous as MechJeb provides similar information.

Chatterer - adds real astronaut Chatter to the audio.

Final Frontier - do you remember which of your Kerbals went into space first?  The first to orbit the Mun?  The first to go to the north pole?  The first to plant a flag on Moho?  This mod records all sorts of achievements for your Kerbals.

If your PC is decent, I would recommend some visual upgrades - Scatterer and Stock Visual Enhancements (and perhaps PlanetShine).  Makes it look prettier at the cost of a few frames per second.

The above are the basic mods, and won't depart you from the stock game too far.  Beyond that though, there's a wealth of possibilities that do affect how you play the game -- and it's entirely down to what you find fun in the game. 
 

Kerbal Inventory System:  Allows your Kerbals to do stuff whilst on EVA.  An engineer with a tool can take a part off your craft and put it somewhere else.  Or take a part off one craft and attach it to a different one.

Kerbal Attachment System:  So you've landed two vessels next to each other, and you just want to move some fuel from one to the other.  If only your Kerbals could invent something like a hosepipe!  This allows that, and a bunch more similar stuff (winches etc.), and goes hand in hand with Kerbal Inventory System.

Want to build land bases?  Kerbal Planetary Base Systems and/or USI stuff is great.  Add Extra Planetary Launchpads too to let you build brand new rockets somewhere other than KSP.

Want to worry about life support?  USI again, or TAC Life Support (but not both!)

Want more science-y things to do?  ScanSat is for you.  You could also go for "Better than Starting Manned" which gives you a completely different tech tree and very different early game.

There's a huge bunch of part mods - more planes, more rockets, more rovers, weapons, airships, boats.  Whatever floats your boat.

[Vanamonde]

Everybody should play stock for a while at first because it avoids confusion about things like, "What turned all my planets bright yellow?" and "Why are my Kerbals starving to death?" A great many newbies make learning the game a lot harder than it already is by cluttering the experience with bugs and features arising from mod use. 

[Snark]

2 hours ago, Vanamonde said:

Everybody should play stock for a while at first because it avoids confusion about things like, "What turned all my planets bright yellow?" and "Why are my Kerbals starving to death?" A great many newbies make learning the game a lot harder than it already is by cluttering the experience with bugs and features arising from mod use. 

+1 to this.  Try playing the game unmodded for a while, at least until you've gotten comfortable with how things work. It keeps things simple, and getting help is easier, too.

Then mod it till it bleeds, if you like.   But starting off simply can help reduce confusion.

[SleepyMan]

7 hours ago, Vanamonde said:

Everybody should play stock for a while at first because it avoids confusion about things like, "What turned all my planets bright yellow?" and "Why are my Kerbals starving to death?" A great many newbies make learning the game a lot harder than it already is by cluttering the experience with bugs and features arising from mod use. 

I just started playing KSP one month ago and have slowly added a few mods. Some are simply graphics and sound enhancements. Others fixed issues I had with the UI. I later added a few part packs to add things I wanted in my career game.

Mods I think help solve UI issues are:

• KER is about the best mod for giving you basic info that makes learning to fly spaceships an enjoyable experience. Instant deltaV and orbital parameters, rendezvous info all on one window on both the flight and map screen.
• Precise Maneuver allows more precise control of changing the numbers. So you can for example focus on Minmus as you plan your orbit and alter your burn parameters simply and precisely. Without trying to fight the UI to show the moon up close so you can see the node and you wont have to try to use the mouse to add 1 m/s to a burn.
• Docking Port Alignment Indicator again displays info that makes what can be a fraught experience to start with simple.
• RadarAltimeter switches your altimeter from ASL to AGL with one simple button press. Mode is indicated by the text changing colour in the display. Although you can get AGL within the stock game by swapping to the IVA and looking at the surface altimeter located on the instrument panel. That's IMHO clunky and distracting. KER does show this but you already have a big altimeter on the display so why not use it for landings.

Stuff I added for fun/QoL:

• Chatterer and Chatterer+ adds lots of mission control style voice comms in Kerbalese.
• Portrait Stats adds icons and mouseover info to the windows showing you Kerbals.
• Real Time Clock helps with RL time management.
• Wernher Checker Adds a checklist to the VAB/Hanger so you don't forget to add comms or solar panels or whatever to your latest build.
• RCSBuildAid Shows the rotation that your RCS set up will induce when you use them in translation mode. Lets you reposition them or reduce one banks throttle setting to reduce that pivot to a minimum.
• [x] Science! tells you when you are in a position to learn new science and adds a window that holds buttons for all the experiments that will produce new science in one place.
• Kerbal Alarm Clock so useful when you start to run multiple missions/long term missions/stations/mining rigs/ISRU stations simultaneously. 

Edited March 18, 2017 by SleepyMan
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