CessnaSkyhawk

I'm planning to rebalance experiments somewhat to avoid that kind of scenario, but I'm still just working out the values. At first, the only experiment available will be a generic "telemetry report" which gives just enough science to unlock the tier 1 nodes with the parts you start with, and then more stuff will start unlocking from there. I'm going to try and sit down later this week and do some spreadsheet stuff to try and get it figured out.

That’s the balance I’m trying to strike. I want there to be reasons for early game operations in LKO (plus this also gives a lot of earlier BDB satellites a use case), but at the same time I don’t want to make it too much of a grind that it’s just a huge hassle. 100% planning Kerbalism support. I just want to finish stock science system first so I have a baseline for it.

Sure - I'll see if I can throw something together either tonight or tomorrow, as I might use that as a chance to make an updated full tree image as well... Fair enough - I'll take a peek at it and think about what I should do. The one thing I will note is that the Apollo tier ntr tech only gives you the two weakest ntrs (stock's Nerv and MissingHistory's Candle), and you don't really start getting into the more useful ones till a tier or two further down.

I'm wondering if there might be a way to change the config so kerbalism farms just produce x food per day from the inputs instead of the whole harvest system. I'm going to be looking into that for a seperate tech tree thing I'm doing, and if it works, I'll report back here too.

Fair enough - my thought process is that I'm trying to encourage a slightly different playstyle focused on doing a lot of unmanned missions (Mariner-style flybys and orbiters, and Surveyor style landers) before starting big manned missions (kind of like how the first Mariner flybys happened a few years before Apollo 11), but maybe I am a little aggressive on the science scaling. I'm thinking I might tone things down slightly to help make it a bit less extreme (maybe add a 75 between the 50 in 100, so tier 8 is now 200 instead of 400) In regards to this, I tried my best to keep stuff relatively compact - you do still have to unlock at least a few different nodes for various types of parts (engines, command modules, etc), but I try my best to keep them in the same tier instead.

Hey everyone! I've already started planning out how science is going to be balanced, and I've got a question for everyone. Here's the current set up for science cost per tier, along side what major milestones/techs come with each tier. What do you all think about this balance setup? Does it seem reasonable? I do plan on modifying the costs of some experiments, especially earlier in the tree, to make sure stuff isn't too grindy, but also not too easy. Tier Science Cost Important Milestones/Unlocks 1 5 Space-Capable Sounding Rockets 2 10 Basic Orbital Spaceflight (Tiny Sputnik/Explorer 1 style probes) 3 20 Improved Orbital Spaceflight (Multipart, slightly larger satellites) 4 35 Mun/Minmus Probes 5 50 Interplanetary Flybys, Unmanned Mun/Minmus Landers, Manned Spaceflight 6 75 Space Stations, Ion Propulsion 7 100 Rudimentary Manned Mun/Minmus Landings (Think Gemini Lander concepts) 8 200 NTRs, serious Mun/Minmus Landings (Apollo) 9 400 Surface Bases, ISRU, Interplanetary Manned Spaceflight 10 800 Plasma Propulsion 11 1200 12 1600 End of all tech branches aside from Fusion and Plasma/Antimatter, so tech costs increase to compensate 13 2400 Fusion Power/Reactors 14 3600 Antimatter 15 4300 16 5000 17 10000 FTL Tech EDIT - Changed tier values slightly based on comment two below this one.

Skyhawk Science System v0.8.0 - "Last, but not Least" https://github.com/CessnaSkyhawk/SkyhawkScienceSystem/releases Well, finally, after a bit of a delay, here's another release, and its a big one! We're in the home stretch now, and I've really only got one last big release (the Science update) left before a full release. I'm also considering releasing a playable beta at somepoint mid development of that, so if people would be interested in trying that out, do please let me know! I'm trying out a more formal changelog setup now that we're closer to release, so here goes nothing! Added Support for the following mods Bluedog DB Master Updates (Clementine & Pioneer 10) BonVoyage CommNetAntennasExtension ConformalDecals Deep Freeze DSSHU HabTech2 JX2 Antenna KAS KeR-7 Kerbal Engineer Redux Kerbal GPS KIS kOS MechJeb2 Missing Robotics Stockalike Open Cockpit Planetside Exploration Technologies Project Orion Rational Resources & its Derivatives Stockalike Mining Extension TeaKettleRCS Universal Storage 2 Added Rocket Engine Fuel Reworks There are now three different classes of rocket engines available, conventional, cryogenic and hypergolic. Conventional rockets use a combination of Kerosene (renamed Liquid Fuel) and LqdOxygen (renamed Oxidizer). Oxidizer/LqdOxygen now boils off, adding a new design constraint to consider. Cryogenic rockets use either LqdHydrogen or LqdMethane along side LqdOxygen, and aren't changed much, aside from the LqdOxygen boiloff. Hypergolic rockets use Aerozine50 as a fuel, and NitrogenTetroxide as their oxidizer, and have the nice perk that neither boil off, making them the best choice for interplanetary probes and other missions where fuel will be sitting for a while, just like in real life. The hypergolic fuels have full ISRU support and tankage support for both stock and rational resources. Monopropellant has been renamed to Hydrazine, bringing it in line with the rest of the fuels namewise, although nothing else about it has changed. NTR Fuel Reworks I have implemented a support mechanism which allows for NTR propellant switching so long as one installs the Rational Resources Nuclear Family Patch alongside with SSS. Tankage Standardization I have standardized all tanks under one B9PartSwitch regime, meaning that you can expect all parts to accept all possible propellant resources from the basic trifecta to exotic nuclear ones like LqdAmonnia or Water, with the same ratios and breadth (The one exception being BDB Balloon Tanks, which have a little bit of special treatment). I've standardized boil-off as well, so all tanks operate under the simple CryoTanks setup, preventing any inconsistency. This release is still in alpha, and is not recommended for installation in career saves!!! It's still not balanced, and could potentially mess stuff up! It's all good for sandbox though if you want to test out the new fuel reworks!

Should have v0.8.0 out by the end of the weekend! We are in the home stretch now! I'll start working on the science system once its out, and then I may try and release a playable beta before going to kerbalism science as well.

Completely random question - would it be at all possible to get a release which only has the OPM visuals and not the stock planet ones, for when u are using OPM with a non-stock planetary system? In the past I've done it by just deleting files and seeing what works, but it'd be nice to have an officially supported way to do it.

*Technically not real fuels. I just added a tertiary "hypergolic" fuel type, made oxidizer boiloff to give it a use case, and added a patch to rename the stock fuels to more realistic names. It's still far more simplified than Real Fuels. It is "technically" playable right now, but in reality I 100% would advise against it. I haven't gotten to balancing science experiments yet, so every node is just 5 science points, which as you can imagine would make for an incredibly easy tech tree to unlock.

From what I've played around with it, seems like it does, but your mileage may vary. I'm not Nertea so I can't give a 100% guarantee that it's all working right.

Glad to hear you like it! I do plan on seeing about setting up a CKAN bundle once I release v1.0, so look for that once it finally drops! Speaking of ETAs, I don't want to make any promises, but I'm optimistically thinking I can get 1.0 out around the end of November, and if not, it'll almost certainly be out by the end of the year. At this point it really just depends how long the kerbalism integration will take, but I might release a non-Kerbalism beta as well depending on how I structure the last few alpha releases.

No, thank you for all the great times @hemeac!!! KTT really was a ground-breaking tech tree and I enjoyed playing around with it! Beyond that, it was KTT which gave me the inspiration and base ideas which eventually led to my Skyhawk Science System, so I think you'll be happy to hear that the KTT's legacy will continue to live on through it!

They are If you go to this github issue here, you can see all my plans for mod support and the like Sorry for the lack of development updates everyone. I've decided to combine the next two updates into one big update which is taking a tad longer then expected. Hopefully it'll be out soon, but for now, enjoy some teasers of what's to come...

Last I checked they are in the dev branch on github. Not sure if they'll ever be officially released, cause I believe Nertea is about to retire from modding, but when I tested them out they seemed to work just fine.

Hi There! I've just got a quick question regarding part switch. Let's say I wanted to use a MM patch to reorder the tank switches another mod provides so that they are in a different order (Ex, if they are normally Fuel 1, Fuel 2, Fuel 3, I patch it so it's Fuel 1, Fuel 3, Fuel 2 instead). What exactly would I need to do to do that? EDIT: Never mind I figured out a workaround so I don't need to do this

Thanks for all the advice! I'm gonna take a look at the calculator now to start playing around with getting my resources set up. And as to the second part, I think your idea probably is the best idea - uploading it to CKAN and then just having me tag the engines is probably the smoothest and most simple way to do it, although I can also provide a PR variant too incase you ever want to implement it directly. I will need to see what I do about the RCS though, as I'm planning on having my own RCS fuels aside from CGTs. I definitely want to avoid KTT style glitches tho, so I'll keep you updated on what I do with them - that was one annoying bug I always noticed during my time using that tree which actually helped push me towards making my own!

Yup - that's actually where my code is going to be derived from. It'll just be a simplified version of their work, so long as they are okay with it. The license they use seems to allow it, but I gave em a heads up anyways over in their thread.

Hi @Clamp-o-Tron I just wanted to let you know that I've started adapting some parts of More Fuels directly into the Skyhawk Science System, as from what I understand the GPLv3 allows it. It's a much more simplified version (really only has the Aerozine50/Nitrogen Tetroxide combo and the Lox Boiloff & Resource Renaming patches so far, and the only other thing I plan on adding is a rcs switcher between hydrazine and hypergolics), but it's still based on the same basic code. I will make sure that the code adapted from it is still under the license, and all the policies are followed, but if you don't want me to continue, just let me know and I can just remove the functionality from my tree and make something from scratch instead. I just opted to move ahead with it as I hadn't seen much activity and I'd finally reached the point in the SSS's development where I was planning to start implementation. Once I wrap it up, I plan on submitting a PR to the More Fuels Github with whatever fixes/optimizations I do end up making, so that you can make use of them too

Hi guys, sorry to bother y'all but I've got a quick question - is there a way via Module Manager to change the boiloff for BDB tankage to just use the same system as CryoTanks? I'm currently testing a thing for the Skyhawk Science System that will add in a hypergolic fuel option, and to help balance that out, make LOX/Oxidizer boil-off too, and I'm thinking it'd be easier overall to just have everything be consistent under one system.

Hi @JadeOfMaar I've just got a quick pair of questions - I'm currently working on my own custom tech tree and I'm getting to the point where I'm gonna be adding support for Rational Resources, and I've got a few questions about that. First of all, my tech tree has a basic hypergolic fuel system w/o Real Fuels that would need to use some but not all of the ISRUs (it only has Aerozine50 and NTO, no MMH or UDMH, so I'd try and set up a recipe that goes right from the basic RR elements to the final products with no middlemen). Looking at the GitHub page, I think it seems like I could do that by just adding in the ISRU recipes in the following format in a separate config file? Does that seem right? I'm also planning to try and add support for most nuclear engines to have the same fuel-switching capabilities as in the Nuclear Family patch (and potentially the same for Cold Gas RCS), but I'm not entirely sure how to approach that. I know that with the RR Nuclear Family patch all I should need to do is give every valid nuclear engine the "RRNF = Yes" tag, but I'm concerned that people might just miss installing the extra file. Do you think it would be easier to just include a copy/modification of that file in my download, or nah? From what I understand the MIT license seems to allow it, but either way, figure it was better to ask and see what you recommend first!

Don't worry - if I do end up integrating Kerbalism, I'll definitely make sure it's not a hard requirement. And I'll take a peek at Snacks as well when I get to that point. I know it's a very light LS mod, so it honestly shouldn't be that bad to support as well.

Skyhawk Science System v0.7.0 - "World Tour" https://github.com/CessnaSkyhawk/SkyhawkScienceSystem/releases With this new release, the Skyhawk Science System is going global! We've added support for all sorts of international space programs in this smaller scale update. Some highlights include Commonwealth Rocketry Expanded (UK), GemstoneLV (Japan), Chrayol Design Org (ISRO), Provenance Aerospace (Blue Origin) and Luciole (France). Unfortunately, after taking a look at Tantares and Knes I decided to hold off on those for now. I've been getting a little burned out with devolopment lately, and honestly, just want to get the tree to a point where it's playable so I can finally start a career save again. As I don't plan on using either of those two, I'm just thinking I'm gonna hold off till I feel ready to put them it, so that I can give them the care they deserve in working them into the tree. Sorry to disappoint those who were hoping for support, but I still aim on getting them in here someday. In other, happier news, we are getting close to a big milestone! I've got one more release planned for supporting a couple remaining part mods I like, and after that it's just science balancing and support for MoreFuels & Rational Resources. I'm also heavily considering Kerbalism support, so let me know if that's something you'd be interested in! We are almost there, but it's still in alpha. Don't use it in real saves!!!

Skyhawk Science System v0.6.0 - "Balancing Act" https://github.com/CessnaSkyhawk/SkyhawkScienceSystem/releases This release doesn't have any new mod support or things like that. Instead, I've done some basic rebalancing, and more importantly, added icons for nearly every tech node aside from the science, space stations, and control trees (those will come soon). Here's a sample: https://imgur.com/a/r6yj4YQ Sorry for how long that took. I've been busy and also a little burned out with all decisions and stuff related to localization and icon work. And as always, this is still NOT gameplay ready!

I do, but I still also use a couple stock ones as well. I think I might finally have a plan to fix em tho.