HansonKerman

What were the "Rocket Builders"?

Recommended Posts

Before the november 2015 forum update, there was a subforum in the spacecraft exchange called the rocket builders. To quote @Ted:

"This is a Forum for all your Rocket/Craft Building needs. 
Essentially, if you, or a group of people, are churning out rockets under a single name post them here. Additionally, if you need a rocket built for you, simply post in one of the existing threads asking the 'Company' to design and build you a rocket/craft."

So if you made many craft they could be shown there under one banner, or you could work as a group. Also, you could make requests to have craft built by the "companies".

However, I believe it was started before rules against role-playing were instituted on the forums, and so it was removed from public view entirely during the forum update (the moderators likely have a copy of it). Strictly speaking, the entire concept was based around roleplaying, however many people were upset by the decision to remove it, especially since some of the older threads were entirely wiped because (unlike active threads) the OPs were not active during the grace period to copy their threads over. I believe there were some actual examples of rule-breaking happening in some of the older threads too, and the rule against roleplay makes sense, but many of the threads were simply showcases and requests, although that was allowed to continue in the spacecraft exchange, minus the roleplay.

@zekes said this about it, which I think is pretty much what everyone thought:

"Well this is a large blow to me and I'm going to try to come up with some two cents to say about it, if I end up just blowing hot air in circles feel free to ignore me.

The Rocket Builders have been dying. It's gone on for the past year, and I've been discussing it with a lot of other people. It was a great fun place a few years ago, but now it's hollow, the companies mean nothing anymore, there are no engineers working for them, and partnerships don't have a meaning (if they ever did at all, it's been lost on me). 

Nevertheless, I feel a certain nostalgia to the place that really is tied to KSP. I started on the forums because of SSL and Giggleplex, and their companies. My own company was based off of SSL, and For the past 3 years it's been where I hang out and enjoy KSP the most. Now, granted it's had it's ups and downs and I am partially responsible for a lot of the downs, but for better or for worse it was a part of me, of KSP. Just deleting the Rocket Builders will tear out three years of my life, three years of KSP conversations, of working to build up a community, of the past glory days of massive craft releases and conversations between builders. Getting rid of the Rocket Builders means things that i have worked on, names that I built will be lost. I'm quite sure most of you have at least heard of Zokesia Skunkworks through the years. But now that's *POOF* gone. Three years of legacy just deleted. 

How can I go on playing KSP knowing that most of the things I've built, most of the things I've spent my time in will be gone? I have put in hours and hours of work into running and managing my Rocket Builder Company, and I imagine the moderators see us as nothing but an annoying subforum, but Please at least understand we put so much time into what we built. So much time and memories will be gone if you just delete our forum. I say "our" forum because I really never felt part of the rest of the KSP forum - i'm not a modder, I'm not a craft competetor, I'm not a troubleshooter, I'm not a greeter or game player. Or at least that doesn't mean as much to me as the RB forum does. 

So if you're going to delete it, remember how much love, time, and effort some of us have put into it. Remember that without my company there is little reason to play KSP apart from the occasional craft release. I'm just sorry after all these years our forum's only achievement is being a nuisance to the rest of the forum and that we're not fit to continue on existing, or ever having a record of existing, in the future of the community.

Respectfully,

Zekes, CEO and Founder of Zokesia Skunkworks."

I was not as badly affected, as I had joined much more recently, and never did very much collaborative building.

I tried to backup the entirety of the subforum (there were only 25 pages) to the internet archive, but with only 7 days between the announcement and the wipe, I was only able to archive some of the larger threads.

After that, some of the people (like myself) moved their threads to the spacecraft exchange, but since it used to be more busy, they would only be visible when a new craft was released, and served just as showcases. Which, in many ways, was fine, but it was never the same. Personally, I mostly made replicas of real world or fictional vehicles, so it worked fine. 

However, even later I and many of the serious replica builders began to drift away from the forums, or at least from replica building. I got burned out on KSP, and that, combined with college, meant that I stopped looking at the forums for a while. Even now I only have time for this tanks for summer break, and once school starts in a few days I'll be less active here. I think many others have had similar experiences.

In short, it is a forgone conclusion that all forums will die, and the KSP forum is no exception. At the time of the removal, the rocket builders, as a smaller part of the forums, was already dying. While that meant that objectively, it impacted the forums as a whole less than if it was very active, it still felt like it was being killed instead of being left to die in peace. And I cannot complain about rules against roleplaying, since it is almost impossible to moderate it, I and many others were sad over the loss of what was, even if it was already gone.

Hopefully that's a mostly unbiased and clear explanation.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Its demise was due primarily to the roleplay aspect, which did keep cropping up in that sub, causing arguments which resulted in some bans and many warns. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Okay...

So what should I do with this thread now?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, HansonKerman said:

So what should I do with this thread now?

What do you mean, "do"?  If your question's answered and you've got nothing more to say on the topic, no need to "do" anything.  Just let it lie.

Either other people will keep posting and discussing and the thread stays alive... or else people stop posting and the thread goes quiet.  In which case the thread will fade away the same way all threads eventually do, if they're not something ongoing:  it'll start dropping lower on the page as other threads get posts in them and become more recent, and eventually it'll drop far enough that it falls off the front page and everyone forgets about it.

Until somebody in 2022 googles it, doesn't realize (or doesn't care) that it's a dead thread, and necros it.  :)

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, Vanamonde said:

Its demise was due primarily to the roleplay aspect, which did keep cropping up in that sub, causing arguments which resulted in some bans and many warns. 

I should have made it more clear that I have/had no idea how much rule breaking was going on, since successful moderation is invisible. :) 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, Mad Rocket Scientist said:

successful moderation is invisible

We are everywhere!  And we are nowhere...  Hahahaha!

(sorry, couldn't resist)

Yes, when successful it may be invisible... but it often leaves visible traces.  For example, a user may make an angry post that's mostly "legitimate" rebuttal of someone else, but may contain a few snide personal jabs as well.  We generally don't remove an entire post unless there's something wrong with the whole thing (belligerent, or off-topic, or spam, or whatever).  In cases where it's a mostly-okay post with just a few rotten bits in it, we snip out those bits-- and when we do, we always leave a visible [snip] or something and a "Redacted by moderator" comment, so that people can see what we've done.  Otherwise it would be unfair to the poster, since it would look like they wrote something they didn't.

The issues with Rocket Builders is not just that it caused a lot of grief that required undue amounts of time from the moderator team, which is 1. not very big, and 2. composed of volunteers who do this for free in their spare time.  It also made life less fun in the forums-- people were exposed to lots of bickering.  (Stuff only becomes invisible after the moderator arrives to do damage control, which isn't instantaneous.)  In general, it was making the forum a less pleasant place to be for everyone, which is why it had to go.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now