Overland

Thankyou may it help many who caught the train bug

A little update on my own KTP Operations primarily because of my original post some pages back, MichealV2.0's Puma continues to be the flagship of the new KTP operations.. not upto elcano heights yet but useful little things transporting fuel and kerbals.. Ive gone with the decision to mod my own wheels based on the M1, they'll be released in a few days referencing the squad default M1s model but textured and modified to compliment land trains.. the simple modeling also means they impact on framerate alot less than other more advanced wheels from mods.. giving longer trains.. better physics time and all round improvements..also compatable with wheelsound mod although not bulletproof (see post above for details) A big aspect for me with land trains besides all the technology and mods that make them possible is the Feel of a railway.. in that eventually a train isnt just a nameless unnumbered thing released into the world but much like their realworld cousins. .every train has to have its own number or name.. and naturally so. its own personality mechanically.. and some would say emotionally speaking This has given rise to the need to try to repaint Micheal's puma rovers.. however the lack of any reference as to where the parts are on the texture map caused alot of confusion.. Until. a lightbulb moment, a bit of masking in paint.net and some new found skills gave life to the idea of military styled camouflage trains.. ones that didnt matter if the textures were a little off... camouflage being what it is.. did its job exactly whats on the tin.. while giving the trains a unique look with no concern if things didnt line up correctly also upgrading some details like airvents.. eventually adding class numbers that became running number and depot 1xxx -- KSC1 Being a 1000 class Unit, assigned to KSC Their job.. at the moment quite a simple matter of transporting kerbals, Delivering fuel with KAS pipes to mark 3 Fuel Tanks some 50km from KSC.. its taking some trips as the current trains are rather small and only hold around 4000 maximum 1003 is the heavy lifer of the fleet, being the newest locomotive type.. an 8 wheel version for increased traction, extra RTGs and a blue identification light.. eventually she'll have a custom horn and motor sound.. top speed of the fleet is 12-15m/s, once they reach this speed. wheels are modded to cut off torque.. thereby the RTGs generate all lost power.. only using resource on hills and starting where torque is required.. this all happens automaticly via the torque setting in the wheels configuration file cutting off at 15m/s 1002 & 1001 are respective sistertrains of the class.. both having similar specifications and uses.. jack of all trades.. one has australian camouflarge (1001), the other has fire/sunset inspired custom camouflarge (1002) which was originally ment to be used as just a KSC shuttle restricted to 6ms within taxiways.. too and from the launchpad .. equipt with a bell.. but now finds itself on mainline duty One of 1001s Fuel Runs - 5000 units of Liquid Fuel delivered & Home safe

You have a very interesting land train.. @n.b.z. Made all the more interesting by it having an actual prototype, im struggling to find the page now where I once saw it years ago.. one of the pages that originally started me down the path of land trains. but it detailed how in world war 1 there was a diesel electric land train used, the tractor (locomotive) provided electric generation power and the wagons ran with electric motors, it was quite successful in its own small way.. Something about each wagon also had the ability to be controled via wires/batteries so if any wagon got stuck, it could be uncoupled and driven itself out of where it was stuck.. your locomotive does look alot like this seems from the picture it was also rail capable as well, although in all the other pictures ive seen of it (and fact that its got a steering wheel) it was trackless in general operation so respect for you in your first adventures with trains aye, Kerbin is an oftern overlooked flagship world.. the terrain is harsh, detailed.. beautiful and deadly.. yet its the place most people seem to be in a rush to depart in a rocket.. orbiting over all those lovely details at thousands of ms its only once you start to explore you discover what you did and many others.. the deceptive nature of the perfectly flat KSC cleared land provides no hints to what lies beyond those mountains.. thar be dragons, and krakens.. death.. and awesomeness too.. its not all destruction Your couplings are very interesting also, ive oftern looked for a way to couple without being one vessel, as it brings the kraken when shunting.. IVA's dont follow the cockpit their in . if theres an original one.. in that the bug ive FINALLY tracked down is that the IVA internals themselves seem pinned to the same plane as the root part.. once you dock/undock alot of times.. the docking port becomes the root part.. and forever and then on.. you'll get your IVA view covered in fuel tanks and wheels and yuck.. for the same reason you cant have a locomotive at both ends you can switch too if the vehicle is one unit.. Eg. here we have an example of what I mean and a bug thats been haunting me since 0.23 or so.. finally visible with the 1.1 view IVA from external view.. those things in the air are the IVA of the cockpits, still stuck on the same location tied to the lander (root part) despite flexing and being on the ground now.. Your nice exploitation of docking port magnetics fixes alot of that without the use of mods.. and as someone who just lastnight tried to make a train with stock parts, something I havent attempted since 0.90.. finding everything so damn rigid and train-unfriendly.. you have my highest respect. your discovery helps myself and others in the growing KTP .. um.. Hype Train.. enthusiast collective about the power of the train.. as much as I dislike doing so.. as its against railway tradition.. the changes in 1.1 to stock things and even modified things dictate that .. we cant so much be traditionally locomotive hauled train drivers.. but the best solution being to follow real world landtrain practise (big ones!) Fully Powered Trains All the cold war land trains had powered trains with the locomotive being the generator.. to spread the power through the vehicle, the US army overland train holds the record for the longest single vehicle.. not as a train but as one unit for that reason some australian road trains have powered units seperate from the lead truck. as do trackless canetrains... rails were invented to make terrain constant.. in difficult weather or terrain. the guiding aspect of it helped too... but its the lack of friction that helped the most.. example being a horse tram Unfortunately trains of the land.. dont have that luxury.. the element of these beasts are powered wagons M1 wheels stock are horribly underpowered.. or maybe realisticly so since their ment for mun rovers... they have trouble conquering things without a train.. the massive rigid wheels also strangely seem to be underpowered and lack horsepower they once had Infact my own modded wheels based off the M1s have had to have their torque increased 5 times from default.. even then they struggle with a 4 car train.. with 2 cars powered.. so I think its a mixture between current changes of stock parts.. and whats expected of them.. you might need to break with tradition somewhat.. with all that said though.. modified .. painted... tweaked M1 wheels do make the perfect land train wheel .. they're not buggy like the rugged wheels, they actually turn unlike them massive ones.. and with suspension set to rock hard.. torque to high.. speed to realisticly low 15 or less.. they're still by far the best thing to mod for success if you wanted to start KOS, I think thats the best way we could go..id love to see it done programming wise not so much.. im happy to say this thread seems to be turning into less about overlands trains and more about the goto resource for all things land train.. this pleases me greatly if youd like to put a few screenshots of your coupling system im sure it'd help everyone.. stock is good.. while Infernal robotics docking port swivels and steering axels are all nice..being able to have blueprints to so speak of how to make a good coupling.. thats a level above a good mod.. and a credit to your self too

They're Infernal Robotics Docking Washer very useful.. the actual couplings are just a cube and a truss. but the wheels of the first leading bogey on each wagon have the free rotating docking washer (not the powered one) so they steering when pulled in that direction

Spent the day modifying @MichaelV2.0's Rover the Puma to suit my needs as whats become the flagship of the KTP for the moment repaint mostly. learning new skills in Paint.net.. ive got my own wheels to use but gave up after they kept exploding suddenly.. although they worked lastnight! so I went back to using the wheels from the Buffalo rover pack.. quite a mix of 2 seperate machines I added some air vents, little details but.. the colour sadly I didnt have the UV map for so I didnt know where things went for the body. I tried many colours, white, orange, black.. but KSP renders colours really oddly in game.. the moment of inspiration came while listening to youtube playlists and a sad militant song came on the playlist I was using in the background.. lightbulb moment went on! Land trains were a military invention, used in ww1, ww2 and cold war.. if I cant pinpoint where to paint.. i'll just add details where I can the rest? Australian Woodland Camouflage!! a light bulb idea of randomness... it ended up making the most hostile looking thing ive ever made in KSP Not sure if its permanent.. but I like it

30ms used to be my treasured speed, when 35+ means certain death, 30ms seemed to be "underway" the speed of which land trains are in full warcry.. engines at full throttle, clouds of exhaust smoke,..electric motors consuming all the power from the alternators.. full power.. mild hills and humps the terrain softly absorbed by the suspension.. the whole thing was a symphony of beauty I miss dearly.. a beautiful thing that could turn deadly in seconds past that magic number.. only later did I realise it was close to 110kph in realworld.. suddenly everything made sense Alas. 1.1 put an end to that.. downsize. upgrade.. reinvent the KTP.. it seems silly given the above but my favorate new speed is 13m/s its the maximum speed of any RTG powered electric cargo train.. in that they can turn safely at this speed without any worry but generally slow to turn.. most unexpected bumps arnt lethal as they used to be and generally its very relaxing yet fast enough not to get boring I still use a steering wheel.. but it wont kill the train if I dont its a 2 tiered thing though, this is for an outer suburban freight train or passenger set theres another favorate speed.. 7m/s why so slow? This is the magical speed of safety given to KSC bound shuttle trains, tiny 2 car units that transport kerbals from the crew area to the runway or launchpad (my favorate run) at this speed.. the train can negotiate all sharp corners of the KSC pathways with ease.. everything seems lively.. indeed KSC is a massive place when taken at ground level perspective.. do I wish for faster speed? sure.. the long run into the launch pad sure does take time.. id love to open up the throttle.. but I dont for realism.. its a great drive and a great mission I enjoy

Are any of the tornado planes space capable? I recall in sonic 2 and 3 the biplane version had a thruster on the bottom

Friction is not what it sounds like in my experience, dampening also doesnt do what I think it means Firstly suspension.. Set it either rock hard full or as low as itd go depending on the wheels..find the right one here first Dampening...please just slide this useless thing off..Itll hurt you and demoralise you dearly like it did with me.. friction in the KSP universe doesnt seem to mean traction/friction nor does it slow anything down... The BEST way to describe it is a ships rudder in water 0 friction will be like driving a boat with a rudder broken off.. Youll spin..slosh around hopelessly.. As if your on ice too while full friction would be like driving a ship with a massively oversized rudder.. At the mercy of any waves that would rip the boat in that direction as the boat pointed another way even slightly.. Consider full friction to be invisible guide rails.. If your plane happens to flex even slightly one direction..everything goes there..if you turn the wheel..then your craft will follow it exactly 1:1 where the wheels pointed.. So find a safe middle ground..high enough not to slip but low enough.not to mean any change even tiny changes the course My experience? I play KSP 100% with wheels..im a KSP land train driver..ive seen it all Its not as broken as some think..its just labeled wrong Eg Locomotive wheels are set at 2.3 friction at front.. 1.5 for drive wheels (for following authority) And around 1.2 for the train with some changes on the last wheel set NO dampening. Max suspension

I made the FFR 2ft narrow gauge loco in trainz 1.3 But back on the subject of KSP land trains..ive had great success with going backwards from mainline diesel electrics to..opposite of the spectrum.. Little cargo and crew transporter trams Speed limited to 13ms for longer range units (outside of ksc) and a respectable but realistic 6.5ms for use within ksc using its complex pathways as "rails" they present a very very stable yet train like unit not all that different from realworld "dotto trains" Smaller is better.. With a steeringwheel its a really nice drive.. Ive always wanted a job driving one..KSP again forfills a dream At the moment im using buffalo rover wheels and puma body.. In the near future im releasing a repaint and modded perfected configuration file (with aliased stock model) specifically for low speed 12ms land train use but rated upto 105ms for aircraft Half the cost in science and money than the default m1 wheels since these are rubber pnumatic Traditionally whitewalled for locomotives and unpowered black for wagons

Dial back all dampening and suspension..or try full rock hard suspension with no dampening The above both work on land trains perfectly.. Anything with dampening brings the kraken

Id like to get the official word on what modding and releasing the stock M1 rover wheels would be, likely aliasing the model and just being textures and a configuration file Ive used modded M1s for landtrains in the past and having struggled with the new wheelsystem..finally got back to a working wheel Theres been some requests though for it..so far its always been a personal use mod Theyre half the cost of moon M1s.. Dont explode unrealisticly ( but will if abused) and generally form the backbone of any low polly land train operations where wheels are the killer for framerate using 3rd party wheels with more detail Anything I need to do to make it above board?

@teag2 @pandaman Theres other builders of Hype Trains Last time I built a dedicated one..flaming exhaust..exploding wheels.. It was actually fortelling what cometh.. Explosions..trains in great distress detonating on loading with near escape velocity force.. It was a sad time and aided in the retirement of 44 and 40 class diesel electric workhorses in favor for KSC roving Kotto trains powered by RTGs limited to 10ms I dont want to put a hex on 1.1.3 via train abuse and accidently summon demonic bugs such as exploding wheels..white space.. or perhaps the complete reversal of gravity.. Bugs so horrible and yet no one noticed.. Rcs might have stock sounds that play christmas songs as a feature Not again Im happy with my KSC passenger shuttles..a safe haven until we know more about just what 1.1.3 isnt going to break that worked well before

Wait... Its 2016 not 2012.. Whats this ticket thing? No opal card readers? You dont want easily obtainable easy to use paper tickets... Everyone will get in..look at all the bugs that got in last time! They all boarded the hype train! Atleast with opal cards (oystercard etc) The readers wont work and less bugs get in

Havent had many push scenarios. What ive had is (more oftern than not) not applying handbrake when getting out of a train..unwisely still at idle to plant a flag and have her roll away on idle voltages, just enough to turn any slight microscopic change in terrain into 72 tons of rolling train with her driver not in the cab.. Sure she stops when physics cut out but those few 100 metres can be fatal to a landtrain. Especially backwards.. PUSH scenario! The ideal of wedging a kerbal against the front wheel of a locomotive or rear wagon and running.. In the hopes that itd be enough to stop Problem with trains spanning multiple versions of ksp is...this works in some versions more than others.. Reducing the kerbal to being rollingpinned under a locomotive and 4 wagons..turning to dust at random.. One day ill make a KOS script to sound an alarm if the trains stopped and brake not applied

A race of green people dedicated thier entire lives to thier space program...not only space program but one could say thier entire reason for living, Numerous and seemingly unlimited in number for years despite the female of the species only recently immerging from large door in the vehicle assembly hanger ( and dying shortly after) They have lidless eyes..eternal in thier stare fixated on space. No nose to speak of..and a lipless mouth of which to silently scream Below the neck things resemble a lifeform thats more at home pulling sunday roasts out of hot ovens..born with oven mits.. Vs something capable of spaceflight and vehicle construction.. Infact thier home world bares witness to this being an untouched unblemished surface by the mits of the forementioned roasters and bakers Thier aim is just as confusing.. Colonising other worlds.. When kerbin itself is an empty undeveloped echoing shell.. Upon futher study though... Perhaps because kerbin has sand..dirt..light..and wind...the enemy of those without eyelids.. They chose to exist in capsules..cockpits and landers.. Forever in search of simply..sleep in the blackness of space..and a contained enviroment without deadly sand and dirt.. Or the more life ending fatal.. Hay fever.. Without eyelids to close.. And noses to sneeze... They explode into a grey dust cloud.. Unrealistic? You decide

A new one for me since switching from diesel electric locomotives on rapid land trains of mostly death.. I used to strictly adhere to a class system where the first set of numbers denoted the railway class number eg 44 followed by locomotive number like 31 so following railway practise 4431 would be both her number...name of which legendary feats were applied too in history..and the sorrow of loss..respecting her fallen sisters before her But! With the switch to KSC taxiway trundling trackless trains serving as crew and fuel transport..small in size..ultra flexable electricly powered and speed limited to either 5 ms for a shuttlecar limited to KSC and 13ms for an outer suburban 4 car passenger set, Theyve become friendly SAFE perfectly viable joys to drive both exploring KSCs surprisingly complex network of pathways and roads and taking an almost relaxing drive to outlying bases..if a little slow..but slow means survival.. Speed is death They dont quite deserve to be numbered and in essence follow the dark traditions of land trains of old.. Ive decided to follow a short lived idea of sydneys tramline and give each a name..in time ill paint it on First up is outer suburban set class leader.. Yet to be painted light blue Lobster-Magnet Her name comes from the pre-youtube newgrounds flash animation by the same name , although not having a beek.. The name is both happy and a play on previous trains Kraken attracting properties Her sister train, a 2 car KSC set is similar named YATTA in the same ideals

Well arnt you nice.. If I could downvote I would.. Instead enjoy the reporting Nice is better..screaming at the world is not. Perhaps your landing gear doesnt like you ...i direct your attention to YOURSELF

Are you sure thier intact? On the rare occasion I fly planes its to scout out terrain..im no good at space so its always atmospheric I still need to get there fast as i never use time acceleration Ive had deployed gear burn off before..it doesnt leave any visible scars.. They just look like closed gear pods once the explosion happens IF its superheated while deployed Try entering with gear down and youll see.. Are you triggering gear by accident?

Does it have a train?

Radial ant engines make really good airhorns with both shutdown and startup sound replaced...modded to have no fuel Also works for tram bells..something nice about toggling the gear lever on my steering wheel for a bell to sound Loud..simple and in the case of horns..long seemless blasts with multiple firing..bells any combination too Jet engines modified also make good Klaxxon horns & air raid sirens modified to spool correctly

I built a "Kotto Train" (Electric isotope battery/regenerative powered) for crew transport and pickup around KSC, small enough and articulated enough to putter around KSC turning into all taxiways and pathways at between 3 and 7m/s depending on where shes going.. KSC is actually an amazing place, quite large from the ground.. where every taxiway leads somewhere nice to pickup or drop off crew.. made all the more special by a nice bell I was able to get from the Yarra Trams website and use everytime I hit the gear button.. sound the bell when approaching a junction, sound when departing.. and sometimes just for fun.. ding ding ding ding!!! the run to the launchpad was especially nice, being able to open the throttle to 7m/s.. stop at the pad, drop off a kerbal.. then turn into that circular pathway that actually brings the train fully back around heading back Passenger Pickup Point Heading to Launch Pad A days work, heading to Runway from Launchpad via detour that eventually snaked its way around the dish array, under the research tunnel and back out near the fuel tanks to the runway Articulation Extreme! (Test) Around the dish! EDIT: Night time later run video (Real thing - inspiration and what I hope to own if I ever win the lotto)

See things like this make me sad.. Its all true what you say.. yet with a few tweaks to the config file of 3rd party mod wheels, everything works perfectly.. realistically and im loving it I just finished driving a crew tram around the whole of KSC dropping kerbals off at various places, navigating tight taxiways, perfectly circling flagpole and suchlike with the cobblestone footpaths they have, the wheels performed better than they ever have in 1.04 using my steering wheel but these are the buffalo wildblueindustries Grizley and Mountain Goat wheels.. theyre not indestructable they explode IF stressed horribly but dont explode when you look at them.. in a 3 and 4 car dotto train. theyve never given the train handling problems outside of reality they're capable and dependable..with the slightest suspension change in SPH its great the only way ive modded them is to keep below 30m/s speed wise.. other than that they're "stock" 3rd party wheels.. so the problems are not so much the new wheel system but squads own settings on their own parts that have been set unrealistically.. this I dont understand.. crew train - not exactly crush capacity.. indeed a branchline..

Ive made some dangerous trains in the past, self propelled fuel tanks screaming along at 35ms on unstable terrain. the slightest wrong move from the driver means death for train and crew. its fair to say trains in my experience are more lethal than any other craft in KSP.. However.. in the history of the KTP, ive never built a train more dangerous than this.. Please Help 1.1.3.. we need you

3 kinds of wheels..all work nicely Compatable with rover wheelsound mod And most other things too.. Im using these grizley and cub wheels with puma rovers from another pack and aircraft love the double wheels too