Top Gun AI - The Official Tournament Thread

[BlueCanary]

29 minutes ago, Redshift OTF said:

Wow, it's getting better! I always thought that if El Quicko could handle missiles better it would be the strongest plane. Is that against Anduril Mk1 or Mk2? Did you need to angle the wings on your plane?

This is against the Anduril Mk2, wings not angled. I don't know why it's got better at missile dodging, but the main changes I've made since it got comprehensively slaughtered in the tournament have been simply reducing the fuel load and removing the sidewinders (which seem to have made the AI delay missile avoidance whilst trying to get a sidewinder lock and caused it to try and fight at long range where it's more vulnerable to missiles). Seeing as at the moment it only comes to 28 points though, I'm thinking of adding tonnes of countermeasures to further boost it's missile avoidance capabilities.

Quote

 

After 7 more fights, a clear winner still hasn't emerged:

2 more guns kills for the El Quicko.

1 more missile kill for the Anduril Mk2

1 guns kill for the Anduril Mk1 - the El Quicko was travelling straight to gain speed and got shot to pieces.

3 more collisions.

The overall score is:

Anduril Mk2 5 - 5 El Quicko X

With the best fighter obviously being Unity's collider system with an outstanding 6 kills.

 

 

So the fighters look to be overall pretty much equal, with the Anduril having a clear advantage in terms of missile kills but the El Quicko winning every single tight maneuvering gun fight.

If the El Quicko could dodge missiles better, or the Anduril could somehow keep it far enough away to avoid entering a maneuvering gunfight, this could change, however.

 

Edited January 3, 2016 by BlueCanary

[Redshift OTF]

Have you tried swapping out the Tail Connector parts with Advanced Nosecone A's? It would look pretty similar and you would save almost 0.4 tons of weight.

[THIRTY9CLUES]

Hey, really want to get into this competition. I read the first part and I get the jest. I was just wondering If the competition is going on now, and if so, when the next competition will be.

[CreativeCombat]

On January 3, 2016 at 5:07 PM, SasquatchM said:

Did the final results from CrativeCombat's tournament get post ever?  I know my submission for that was one of the final 2, but I don't know who won.

Yes.  I posted them.  Were they lost in the forum migration? 

They can be found on the channel where the rest of the tournament was uploaded if that's the case.  

 

My computer is dead at the moment, but when it's fixed, I'm going to run an all-guns tournament. 

[CreativeCombat]

5 hours ago, THIRTY9CLUES said:

Hey, really want to get into this competition. I read the first part and I get the jest. I was just wondering If the competition is going on now, and if so, when the next competition will be.

The OP abandoned the thread ages ago and as a result the OP is not up to date. 

I will be hosting a guns only competition in the near future if that interests you. 

[drtricky]

1 hour ago, CreativeCombat said:

I will be hosting a guns only competition in the near future if that interests you. 

Well then count me out. My Taurus loses almost every gun battle, and I believe I've hit the limit on its maneuverability; the only thing I can think of that would make a difference is reducing its size, but I'm not interested in submitting a small fighter.

Edited January 4, 2016 by drtricky

[drtricky]

On 1/3/2016 at 8:16 PM, Zahida said:

It does get pretty slow, but it's also supermaneuverable. I find that slow turning speed doesn't really affect affect the plane, it only makes you vulnerable to missiles, and countermeasures seem to be the defining factor there, not how fast you are going. 

When I said turning speed, I did not mean the velocity a plane is at when it is making its hardest possible turn, I literally meant the time it takes for a plane to change its direction. I probably should have said "turning rate" instead. 

 

Your plane's very slow turning rate is definitely affecting its success; my plane won a (few) gun battles because your plane's turn rate was so slow. And trust me, it is embarrassing if a plane the size of mine wins a turning battle against anything smaller 

Edited January 4, 2016 by drtricky

[GDJ]

On January 3, 2016 at 9:41 AM, GDJ said:

I've been tinkering with BDArmoury and trying to make a Heat seeking or RADAR guided Maverick.  It would make a nice missile in between the AIM-9 and the AIM-120. It has a wicked turn radius and fairly precise on it's targeting, albeit it's not very fast.

Doing this more for curiosity, just to see what it can do.

 

On January 3, 2016 at 10:28 AM, Redshift OTF said:

Yeah, I'm not too keen that AGM's can only target stuff using the targeting pod. Heat seeking versions would be cool although they would be for ground targets only. It would be fun to see them launched against planes though.

Well I got them to work! I made a Maverick Type R (for RADAR) and it works just like the AIM-120's.....just alot slower (375m/s versus 600m/s for the sidewinder), lower thrust at boost, but longer boost stage, and a long 15 second cruise burn at a slightly higher thrust than the standard Maverick (think more propellant, but slower burning for a longer burn). Some planes may be able to outrun them, but I'm guessing alot won't be able to....but it would be fun to watch them try!
BUT, they have a very wide FOV when targeting and they move slow enough for decent maneuvering. I rigged them for low explosive damage over a wide area (think fragmentation damage, 45 metre radius). First hit will knock weaker parts off, but most of the damaged plane will turn red (hence simulating alot of frag damage) and the plane is really fragile. After that just bumping it will pretty much finish it off.
As for making them readily different, I inverted the colours so they are mostly black vs white.

I'll get some pics later. It's 20 minutes to one AM up here and I'm done.

EDIT: After doing some historical research the Maverick missile was never RADAR guided, so I converted it to Infared Imaging (Heat seeking) and it acts just like a Sidewinder, just slower. It does seem to track a bit better than the Sidewinder, but only by a small margin.

Since the Maverick missile was designed to be Air-to-Ground only, I'm going to consult with someone that knows the code better to make it a Air-to-Ground missile again, if possible.

Another way is to use the standard Maverick and slave the laser guidance to RADAR, which from what I've read, we can do that now.

Edited January 4, 2016 by GDJ

[BlueCanary]

@Redshift OTF The Anduril Mk2's damage resistance is insane. El Quicko shoots off two engines and half of each wing, it's still fighting, and then it lands a GAU-8 burst that just vaporises the El Quicko.

And then the twenty screenshots I took failed to save.

These were the best I got:

[drtricky]

6 hours ago, BlueCanary said:

@Redshift OTF The Anduril Mk2's damage resistance is insane. El Quicko shoots off two engines and half of each wing, it's still fighting, and then it lands a GAU-8 burst that just vaporises the El Quicko.

ur plane is so weak; my taurus is tough enough to lose only half its fuselage when it gets hit by a GAU-8 burst 

Edited January 4, 2016 by drtricky

[CreativeCombat]

Posted by mistake.  How does one delete a post on the new forum? 

Edited January 4, 2016 by CreativeCombat

[BlueCanary]

37 minutes ago, drtricky said:

ur plane is so weak; my taurus is tough enough to lose only half its fuselage when it gets hit by a GAU-8 burst 

Yup, that's the disadvantage of building for minumum part count, nothing can break off without losing a significant chunk . It can fight quite well with only one engine though, and can lose a canard or an elevator too and still remain thoroughly in the fight.

[drtricky]

1 hour ago, BlueCanary said:

Yup, that's the disadvantage of building for minumum part count, nothing can break off without losing a significant chunk . It can fight quite well with only one engine though, and can lose a canard or an elevator too and still remain thoroughly in the fight.

What I said was meant as a joke on how you said the GAU-8 vaporizes your plane 

[BlueCanary]

19 minutes ago, drtricky said:

What I said was meant as a joke on how you said the GAU-8 vaporizes your plane 

I know, I was just saying the reason my plane in particular gets shredded by guns is because when I built it the plan was minimum parts - which turns out to also mean maximum ceasing-to-exist ..

[THIRTY9CLUES]

On 1/4/2016 at 3:56 AM, CreativeCombat said:

The OP abandoned the thread ages ago and as a result the OP is not up to date. 

I will be hosting a guns only competition in the near future if that interests you. 

Cool. Could you send me the forum page when it starts

[colmo]

OK, my plan to have dogfights between planes placed far apart is coming together. I was able to trigger a fight between planes launching 12km apart. We'll have to see if it can be done even more distantly.

http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/116352-discussion-thread-bd-armory-ai-tournaments/&do=findComment&comment=2350108

Edited January 6, 2016 by colmo
Typo

[BlueCanary]

Ok, does anyone know a setting that stops the AI flying in a perfectly straight line not even trying to avoid fire until it either gains speed and breaks hard, losing all that speed, or gets completely annihalated by guns? I'm fine tuning the El Quicko for the all guns tournament, and against the Anduril 90% of the times it gets shot down it's because it just suddenly disengages from the fight and starts flying in a straight line, putting the Anduril right on it's tail. Maybe turning maximumspeed down will help? At the moment, despite being totally capable of fighting the Anduril on at least equal terms usually, it just keeps commiting plane suicide, which it never seemed to do before.

[SasquatchM]

There are a few additional settings I'd like to see in the BD AI:

-Minimum Speed to hep set an acceptable speed envelope

-Pitch/Roll/Yaw ranges

-Behaviors - Aggressive, Evasive, Keep Distance stuff like that

 

 

[CreativeCombat]

It's tournament time, folks!

POST NOW.  SLOTS ARE LIMITED. 

TOURNAMENT WILL TAKE PLACE OVER FEBRUARY. 

ALL PLANES MUST BE SUBMITTED BY THE FIRST OF FEBRUARY. 

 

-No mods. (Except for BDarmory)

-Fights are 2v2

-Fights are best of 5

-The last flying aircraft wins. If both are destroyed in the sky, the round is considered a draw. If one runs out of fuel and lands/crashes before the other plane does, it is a loss.

-Part Count Cap of 200 (for both planes COMBINED!)

-ALL DESIGNS MUST HAVE A COCKPIT, PROBES ARE NOT ALLOWED.

-REACTION WHEELS ARE ALSO NOT ALLOWED (except for the reaction wheels in the cockpit).

-All designs must be within the point limit, which is stated below.

-All turrets MUST be pointed forward.

-One entry per per participant.

-NO CLIPPING FUEL TANKS, WINGS, OR ENGINES. Structural parts and ammunition, weapons, gear and so forth can be clipped.

-All planes can and will be inspected without warning for rule compliance.

-ALL PLANES ARE REQUIRED TO HAVE AT LEAST ONE RADOME, POINTING FORWARD. THE RADOME ITSELF DESIGNATES WHAT DIRECTION IS 'FORWARD' ON YOUR PLANE.

-Turret rotation values are set to be 0, 0 and 0 for this tournament, so they can not rotate in flight.

-ALL PARTICIPANTS MUST SUBMIT TWO PLANES AS A TEAM.

-TWO PLANES, AS A TEAM, COUNT AS ONE SUBMISSION/ENTRY.

-THE COMBINED POINT COUNT OF BOTH PLANES MAY NOT EXCEED 12 POINTS.

-THE PART COUNT OF BOTH PLANES COMBINED MAY NOT EXCEED 200 PARTS.

-NEITHER PLANE MAY HAVE MORE THAN 8 POINTS OF WEAPONS ON IT.

-NEITHER PLANE MAY HAVE MORE THAN EIGHT POINTS WORTH OF WEAPONS ON IT. YOU CAN, AT MOST, HAVE 8 POINTS OF WEAPONS ON ONE PLANE AND 4 POINTS OF WEAPONS ON THE OTHER. YOU COULD ALSO HAVE 6 ON ONE PLANE, AND 6 ON THE OTHER. YOU CAN NOT HAVE 10 POINTS OF WEAPONS ON ONE PLANE, AND ONLY 2 ON THE OTHER. YOUR PLANE CAN HAVE FEWER POINTS OF WEAPONS ON IT THAN THE MAXIMUM, BUT THIS IS NOT RECOMMENDED. 

ALL PLANES MUST BE SUBMITTED BEFORE FEBRUARY 1st 2016.  ANY PLANES SUBMITTED AFTER THIS WILL NOT BE ENTERED INTO THE COMPETITION.  THE COMPETITION WILL TAKE PLACE IN TOURNAMENT STYLE WITH THE FIRST PAIR OF PLANES SUBMITTED FIGHTING THE SECOND PAIR, THE THIRD PAIR FIGHTING THE FOURTH, AND THE VICTORS OF THOSE TWO ROUNDS FIGHTING EACH OTHER, AND SO ON.  THE TOURNAMENT WILL ROUND TO THE NEAREST EXPONENT OF 2 (THAT WOULD BE 2, 4, 8, 16 AND SO ON).  THIS MEANS THAT IF 5 PLANES WERE SUBMITTED, ONLY 4 WOULD FIGHT IN THE TOURNAMENT.  IF 15 PLANES WERE SUBMITTED, THEY WOULD ALL PARTICIPATE IN THE TOURNAMENT AND THE 16th PLANE WOULD BE PROVIDED BY THE HOUSE.  

PRIORITY OF WHO GETS TO PARTICIPATE WILL BE GIVEN  IN THIS ORDER:

FIRST TO PEOPLE WHO HAVE ALREADY HOSTED A TOURNAMENT IN THIS THREAD SO AS TO ENCOURAGE TOURNAMENT HOSTING. 

SECOND TO PEOPLE WHOSE PLANES COMPLY COMPLETELY AND FULLY WITH THE RULES.  (I WILL EDIT PLANES THAT ARE NOT IN COMPLIANCE IF THEY ARE ONLY SLIGHTLY NOT IN COMPLIANCE, SUCH AS IF THEIR TURRETS WERE NOT LOCKED OR THEIR AI ALTITUDE SET INCORRECTLY, BUT THEY WILL NOT BE GIVEN PARTICIPATION PRIORITY OVER PLANES THAT DID NOT REQUIRE MODIFICATION.) 

THIRDLY TO WHOEVER SUBMITS THEIR PLANES FIRST (THIS IS THE LARGELY RELEVANT ONE) SO AS TO DISSUADE PEOPLE FROM WAITING FOR OTHERS TO POST THEIR PLANES IN ORDER TO DESIGN THEIR OWN TO COUNTER THE OPPOSITION. 
 

 

 

 

12 point limit

-Ammo Can - FREE (all types)

-GAU 8 30mm - 8 points

-M230 - 1 points

-Vulcan Hidden - 4 points

-ANY WEAPON NOT ON THIS LIST IS NOT PERMITTED IN THE COMPETITION. IF EITHER OF YOUR PLANES HAVE ANY WEAPON NOT ON THIS LIST, IT WILL BE REMOVED. IF YOUR PLANES TOGETHER EXCEED THE POINT LIMIT, THEY WILL BE DISQUALIFIED.

 

 

 

All settings EXCEPT for teams and guard will be used as provided. So, save your planes with preferred AI setups. No changes after the submission is made. Planes cannot be changed after signup is over. Guard setups will be set to 1/360/3500 before launch.

There will not be rule changes after the first submission is posted until the tournament is complete.

To sign up, post your pair of planes on the thread with a Dropbox or Mediafire link to the craft file. Put the word "SHUBADUB" somewhere in your post so I can CTRL-F to find it. Only sign-ups posted after/below this post will be entered in the tournament. 

During tournament fights, planes will start approximately 100m apart.

Mid Air Collisions in which both planes are rendered unable to fly are considered a draw.

 

ON THE NAMING OF PLANES.

WHEN PROVIDING YOUR SUBMISSION, NAME YOUR PLANES IN THIS FORMAT. DO NOT INCLUDE QUOTATION MARKS:

"(Your forum name here) - 1 - (Name of the plane here)" and "(Your forum name here - 2 - (Name of the plane here)".

For example, my planes IN-GAME NAMES would be "CreativeCombat - 1 - Awesomeplaneofmurder" and "CreativeCombat - 2 - Smallerplaneofmurder". Without quotation marks.

The plane which has the higher point number of weapons on it is to be named 1, and the one with the lesser number of weapons on it is to be named 2. If your planes both have equal points worth of weapons, number them in whichever order you prefer. This naming scheme is to make tournament organization easier to understand.

EDIT: Plane AI must be configured such that the minimum altitude is between 1000m, and the default altitude is 2000m. Planes which do not abide by this will be edited to do so. 

 

LANDING GEAR MUST BE PERPENDICULAR TO 'FORWARD' ON YOUR PLANE.  

FORWARD IS DESIGNATED BY THE DIRECTION THE RADOME POINTS IN. 

ALL COCKPITS MUST BE POINTED FORWARD. 

ALL GUNS MUST BE POINTED FORWARD. 

WHEN SITTING ON THE RUNWAY, YOUR PLANE'S DIRECTION INDICATOR ON THE NAVBALL MUST BE PERPENDICULAR TO THE HORIZON SUCH THAT IT BISECTS THE BLUE AND ORANGE SECTIONS OF THE NAVBALL.  (This means it can not start sitting on its engines with its radome pointed straight up.  It also means that your plane can not have angled landing gear, it must be flat.  In other words, the front of it must be pointed at 90 degrees relative to the ground and sky.) 

 

KerbPaint, along with numerous other visual mods will be installed for the tournament!  So if you want to paint your planes red, blue or whatever then go right ahead! 

If you would like to fly a custom flag as well, then provide the .png file for it when you submit your planes and I'll attach it to your planes.  

 

IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS OR REQUIRE CLARIFICATION, POST IN THE THREAD. 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 7, 2016 by CreativeCombat

[GDJ]

This is gonna be fun!! HA HEE!

 

[DoctorDavinci]

I have a plane that I would like to enter, however I used some clipped NCS adapters as my fuselage but they contain no fuel and are only being used as structural components ... is this acceptable?

[CreativeCombat]

19 minutes ago, DoctorDavinci said:

I have a plane that I would like to enter, however I used some clipped NCS adapters as my fuselage but they contain no fuel and are only being used as structural components ... is this acceptable?

May I see a screenshot of the plane? 

[Zahida]

Question, when you say no clipping wings, does that include stuff like this? There is a small amount of clipping for aesthetic purposes (ignore the weapons, this was posted before the new rules, I won't be entering this particular aircraft).

[DoctorDavinci]

Here's one variant using 4 NCS adapters exclusively as structural fuselage components, however I have been experimenting with other designs using the same idea.

CANUKWorks DF-47 Happy Tail

 

[Triop]

Missed me ? my p.c. went 50 shades of gray....probabbelly misspelled all of that

Anyway, hard at work !

It needs tests but it looks promising