Top Gun AI - The Official Tournament Thread

[dangerouspeople1]

Umm...The CK232C exploded one of my engines and my heatwave survived but started falling. Then the CK232C collided with heatwave and heatwave lost a wing and CK232C got destroyed. They both crashed but CK232C crashed first. So does that mean heatwave win?

[Alphasus]

Yes, it does. He crashed first, so you were flying for longer.

[dangerouspeople1]

And if that happens in the official match, I can get the engineer?

[Alphasus]

Yes. Also, in round 23, I get 3 gun kills. So, I now have hotshot and lieutenant.

[dangerouspeople1]

I turned on legacy targeting and it didn't seem to improve the guns much, probably still needs swivel weapons. Heatwave and CK232C can turn pretty much the same, so there was a lot of circles.

[Alphasus]

Ok.Thanks for the info, will run the fight some time today.

[dangerouspeople1]

That result might be because of the design of the plane, but in my test, it didn't seem to improve much, I do have instakill on.

[Alphasus]

Ok then, all instakill does is overheats any part to explosion with a single hit. So, it doesn't do much against redundant wings.

[Guest]

Alphasus, could you probaly link to the badge list post (page 53, I think) in the tournament post? Because the badges link there and if somebody is interested in the badges he should be able to find the list easy.

[Alphasus]

There you are!

[Guest]

Oh, I meant you put it in the tournament post (this one) because the badges lead there and directly link the post (this one). But if you prefer it this way, I´m OK with that, too.

[Alphasus]

Oh I can do that. It is much easier for me to do.

[Guest]

OK, thank you very much!

[Alphasus]

Youtube playlist here:

Edited August 19, 2015 by Alphasus

[Slam_Jones]

The Gladius made it to the Final! I don't care that it lost, but it made it to the final! *Wooping*

[Alphasus]

Well, your planes did quite well. But, the plane was simply too unstable to turn consistently with the little buster.

[Slam_Jones]

If anyone hasn't seen it yet, Keptin's "Basic Aircraft Design" thread has a ton of great knowledge that could be applied towards our jets. I'm reading through it (for the fifth time or so this year ) and getting some great ideas for more maneuverable craft.

Also, the drag section no longer really applies, as that's been changed since then... still good concepts to learn, though.

Edited August 19, 2015 by Slam_Jones

[colmo]

Yes, it does. He crashed first, so you were flying for longer.

Respectfully, that is a daft rule. In my original draft, I considered a plane dead when it was no longer under powered, controlled flight. It could still shoot, but it counted as dead, so in a 1v1, as the only team member, it loses.

Planes can glide a long time without engines, and which crashes first is randomly down to what their vector was at the time. It's not fair to judge which did better by which one's wreckage blows up last.

In a collision, the only fair result, if both were live before, is a draw.

[Slam_Jones]

Respectfully, that is a daft rule. In my original draft, I considered a plane dead when it was no longer under powered, controlled flight. It could still shoot, but it counted as dead, so in a 1v1, as the only team member, it loses.

Planes can glide a long time without engines, and which crashes first is randomly down to what their vector was at the time. It's not fair to judge which did better by which one's wreckage blows up last.

In a collision, the only fair result, if both were lice before, is a draw.

I do agree that it's a little silly for the jet with more fuel to (8 times out of 10) be the winner. I still may well make an unarmed plane with 20 mins of fuel an a bunch of countermeasures, to show how silly the rule really is.

Although on more than one occasion I've seen an out-of-fuel jet land smoothly without any damage. Should that really count as a loss?

[Alphasus]

Yes, but I once had a plane without an engine. It turned and shot down my plane. So, how does that work? He killed me, but i killed him. Results like these made me interpret things that way.

[colmo]

Instakill is another rule change after the fact - why pack a GAU8 if a lighter, cheaper, faster Vulcan will do better.

Once you publish rules and receive submissions, you can't be constantly tinkering with things that upset design balance.

[Alphasus]

Because, instakill is sensible. Gun hits are too rare so if we can't make that work than guns need to do more damage. The GAU8 still has more rate of fire. This makes it more likely to hit and do more damage. Look at the results when an f-9 hits something as opposed to an fa-33 or other plane that uses vulcans. One plane was torn into pieces, the other lost a wing.

[colmo]

Yes, but I once had a plane without an engine. It turned and shot down my plane. So, how does that work? He killed me, but i killed him. Results like these made me interpret things that way.

There is judgement required - I'd give it about 10-15 seconds to see if the victor immediately crashes or is shot down by a missile or guns by a death-rattle shot.

It's best to decide at the outset and stick with it.

[Alphasus]

I do agree that it's a little silly for the jet with more fuel to (8 times out of 10) be the winner. I still may well make an unarmed plane with 20 mins of fuel an a bunch of countermeasures, to show how silly the rule really is.

Although on more than one occasion I've seen an out-of-fuel jet land smoothly without any damage. Should that really count as a loss?

Hmm, good point. A plane that lands can't fight however. It can't take off again. That is a mission kill.

[colmo]

Because, instakill is sensible. Gun hits are too rare so if we can't make that work than guns need to do more damage. The GAU8 still has more rate of fire. This makes it more likely to hit and do more damage. Look at the results when an f-9 hits something as opposed to an fa-33 or other plane that uses vulcans. One plane was torn into pieces, the other lost a wing.

Iirc,the Vulcan is 5500 rpm, GAU 4000 rpm or so? GAU bullets are also slower. It's in the configs, I may be wrong. Guns are not ideal at the minute so fudging with instakill may be necessary. Knowing this in advance, though, I'd have spammed .50 cals.