RSS Moon Landing using stock parts

[joshudson]

Challenge: Moon landing in RSS using stock parts.

I originally planned to have a true scoring system; however this challenge proved so difficult on attempting it myself I'm not too sure that is reasonable. Anyway, here are a few challenge levels. I have done the first one so it's possible. Don't bother launching your rocket if it doesn't have at least 17k delta v. I think you need 18k but 17k might be possible with a hot enough launch.

Level 1. Land one Kerbal on the moon and return him/her safely to Earth.

Level 2. Same as 1 but leaving no space debris. (Anything left in low lunar orbit may be assumed to decay into the moon. RSS doesn't have the masscons.)

Level 3. Land two or more Kerbals and return them safely to Earth.

Bill's level: Land two or more Kerbals and return them safely to Earth, no space debris (see level 2 about masscons).

Jebadiah's level: Land three or more Kerbals and return them safely to Earth, no docking.

 

Allowed Mods:

Real Solar System (required)

Module Manager (required for RSS)

Kerbal Engineer (strongly recommended)

Mechjeb for all

TAC life support (optional; glutton for punsihment)

FAR (optional but unnecessary -- stock aero is good enough for me)

Disallowed mods:

Mechjeb: placing the part would make your craft non-stock; use Mechjeb for all

Please, use sandbox. As far as I know, playing career in RSS like this is not feasible. No kraken drives, no ladder drives, no F12, no ways of cheating I haven't thought of.

 

Standard evidence applies; if you're low bandwidth post your craft file. I've got a pretty good idea what crafts would be able to do it by inspection + Kerbal engineer.

 

Level 1:

    Nefrums

Level 2:

    maccollo

Level 3:

    maccollo

Bill's Level:

Jebediah's Level:

   KerbonautInTraining, parzr

Jebediah + Bill's Level (same mission):

    maccollo, Nefrums, Mesklin

Edited January 27, 2016 by joshudson
update scoreboard

[RA3236]

Wow. Just wow.

This is where my big rockets come in.

[KerbonautInTraining]

I'll have to re-fly the mission to get screenies but I did a 3 kerbal direct ascent lunar mission launched on a 22 kiloton stock part only launch vehicle. 

I'm not at home right now and I'm really hoping I still have the craft.

If I don't respond with pics in 24 hours feel free to scream a reminder at me 

[Gaarst]

Seems interesting, I kinda reached a turning point in my RSS save where I won't do regular Moon landings anymore (from Earth with the huge rocket and all) so that seems appropriate. I'll probably give it a try over the week-end.

Though I already know I am going to be extremely tempted to use SpaceY's parts. 3.75m is too small for anything!  

 

Just to be sure: I guess TweakScale is forbidden too ?

[KerbonautInTraining]

3 minutes ago, Gaarst said:

Though I already know I am going to be extremely tempted to use SpaceY's parts. 3.75m is too small for anything! 

When you use over 300 of them they aren't too small 

[Dr.K Kerbal]

Dude!! You need 10000 meters per second just to get to the mun!!!

[ihtoit]

21 minutes ago, Dr.K Kerbal said:

Dude!! You need 10000 meters per second just to get to the mun!!!

nope. 5km/s to get there. 5 back.

[joshudson]

It would pretty much defeat the point to allow general tweakscale. @Dr.K KerbalI have a stock-parts craft saved with 21k delta v on the pad and no nuclear engines. @KerbonautInTraining: Can't wait to see it. I wonder which of us is heavier. I'll have to check. (I did direct ascent with 1 Kerbal but I suck at efficient design).

[Dr.K Kerbal]

48 minutes ago, ihtoit said:

nope. 5km/s to get there. 5 back.

Look at maccollos ro to the mun video

 

[KerbonautInTraining]

Until I can actually refly the mission, here's a little teaser:

[x]

Embedding isn't working. Awesome.

[ihtoit]

5 hours ago, Dr.K Kerbal said:

Look at maccollos ro to the mun video

 

can do one better, check out any of the myriad delta-V maps.  Here's one:

Entirely doable for 5k each way with a hyperefficient launch:

3200 to LKO, 860 Holmann, 310 capture, 580 for landing. Double all round for the return trip. A century shy of 10k the entire trip.

(the way to do a hyperefficient launch is to start your G-turn as soon as, and maintain your thrust to keep to terminal velocity. A good burn means you MECO the second you hit apoapse and find yourself in orbit on a single burn. Takes practice to do it manually, MechJeb is pretty good but if you do decide to go the MJ route, pack an extra 250m/s dV because you'll need it).

Edited January 16, 2016 by ihtoit

[Matuchkin]

6 hours ago, Dr.K Kerbal said:

Dude!! You need 10000 meters per second just to get to the mun!!!

14000 meters per second to get to the moon. An extra 4000dv will make you more realist, non-RO newb. 

Forgive me if this sounds rude. This is supposed to be a joke.

Edited January 16, 2016 by 073198681

[maccollo]

Designed two rockets for this challenge. One for level one and one for Jebadiah level. Will try to fly them tomorrow.

[KerbonautInTraining]

Wait, maccollo is doing this now?

Looks like I'm gonna be staying up late... Will update with Imgur album (assuming it works this time)

Edit: Well, it's 1:30 and I just flew it into orbit... only to find that the design changes I made left me 300 m/s short of TLI. The original rocket had tons of extra delta V and I trimmed it down a bit.

Anyway, here's the rocket. Once I manage to complete the mission I'll make a lengthy mission report. Nice and sleek ain't she?

Yet again I can't embed the image

I'm sure maccollo will have something much less boring.

 

 

Edited January 16, 2016 by KerbonautInTraining

[maccollo]

14 hours ago, KerbonautInTraining said:

Anyway, here's the rocket. Once I manage to complete the mission I'll make a lengthy mission report. Nice and sleek ain't she?

Yet again I can't embed the image

I'm sure maccollo will have something much less boring.

Literally a brick XD. How many tons can it haul to LEO?

Anyway, here is my first entry for level 2. All chemical 1862 ton rocket powered by 27 vectors on the first stage. The mission profile is direct to surface.
Not sure this will live up to your expectations =P
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7ZekYiJn28

Edited January 16, 2016 by maccollo

[joshudson]

Nicely done maccollo. Puts my 28.5kt monstrosity for level 1 to shame (it looks vaguely like KerbonautInTraining's picture). First the dropping PE at AP to get rid of the booster, then the precisely timed suicide burn, then the ANT engine. Just ANT engine. Sheesh. I'm embarrassed.

[KerbonautInTraining]

Okay so I decided to inaugurate my new Nvidia graphics card by recording the mission. As of right now I just landed. (Image)

@maccollo

The vessel weighed 435t in LEO, and sent the 73t lander to TLI.

Edited March 15, 2016 by KerbonautInTraining

[KerbonautInTraining]

And here it is! Seriously though, sound warning at 1st stage burnout.

Sadly the 4 cores around the lander did go off into solar an elliptical orbit. I forgot about that part of the challenge

Edited January 17, 2016 by KerbonautInTraining

[Teilnehmer]

Is it legal to use the ion thruster?

I made a 2 tonne ion ship (Δv about 10 km/s). Will that count?

[Nefrums]

I have to try this!  Never tried RSS. 

RSS with the stock isp engins sounds hard. Probably best to use engins like nerv or dawn that is a lot better in stock than irl, and not use so much of the chemical engins that have isp balanced for the tiny planets of stock solar system.

 

[joshudson]

Well look somebody @KerbonautInTraining got Jebediah's level already. I thought that would take a lot longer. I'm obliged to point out that Jeb does NOT care how much space debris he leaves behind.

@TeilnehmerGo for it. The ion engine is stock. For that matter, the fake cabin using service bay and nose cone is stock too (but you need a ladder all the way to the gournd to load it in stock).

Edited January 17, 2016 by joshudson

[Nefrums]

RSS is really hard.   I'm getting less than 2% payload fraction to LEO. 

I could have put my ship in LKO with a 20t plane, to LEO I need a 500t rocket.  

Reentry is a lot deadlier as well.  

I'll see if I can finish the challenge tomorrow. Might be Jebs level depending on what you mean by "no docking"?

 

 

[maccollo]

22 hours ago, joshudson said:

then the precisely timed suicide burn

It's actually not that hard to get a reasonably efficient decent burn that ends up close to the surface. Take the difference in between your current height and your landing location, divide that by the burn time of the decent stage, and there you have a rough estimate of the decent rate.


Anyway, If you liked that landing... here is the Jeb entry at 2700 tons. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kuoHpPy4J3Y

Edited January 17, 2016 by maccollo

[parzr]

What are your launch weights Maccollo?

 

My craft is becoming increasingly absurd, but somehow I thought LVNs and Ion where taboo.

 

Am I seeing that right, you have "Vectors" attached to your "Mammoths" ? That's brilliant.

Edited January 18, 2016 by parzr

[maccollo]

@parzr
The launch weight was just a few tons under 2700. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/22015656/MC2.png
Attached the vectors to the mammoths to lower the part count. Think my choise of propulsion for the final stage wasn't optimal. Adding 2 more ants would have dropped the delta v by 20 m/s, but I think the increase in TWR from 0.5 to 0.75 would have made up for it in gravity losses during the lunar ascent.

Edited January 18, 2016 by maccollo