Devnote Thursday: Tweaking and Turning Gears

[Skalou]

2 minutes ago, HoloYolo said:

Life support should stay a mod. This game isn't meant to be 100% realistic.

that's what people said for communication relay, aerodynamic(FAR in 0.90), heatshield, fairings, ...

i'm sure there is a way to do life support fun and affordable even for beginers.

[Kerbuvim]

3 minutes ago, HoloYolo said:

Life support should stay a mod. This game isn't meant to be 100% realistic.

Now I play the PS4, mods are not expected, unfortunately. But when I played on the PC, TAC LS I had in a mandatory set.

[Alshain]

6 minutes ago, Skalou said:

that's what people said for communication relay, aerodynamic(FAR in 0.90), heatshield, fairings, ...

i'm sure there is a way to do life support fun and affordable even for beginers.

affordability is not the issue.  Fun is very much the issue, and life support is not.

[Redneck]

3 hours ago, Jarin said:

Any word on PorkJet's work with the rocket-part models?

Yes I would like to know also. Ive asked this question in 4 different devnotes this being the 5th. Squad will not answer this question. Why? 

 

6 minutes ago, Alshain said:

They aren't answering the question because it's not coming in the next version.  If it were, we would have heard before QA started.

What difference does it make what version it comes out in? I am asking about any progress that has been made regardless of version.

[Alshain]

2 minutes ago, Redneck said:

What difference does it make what version it comes out in? I am asking about any progress that has been made regardless of version.

Because the DevNotes are mostly concerned with the upcoming version.

[Redneck]

1 minute ago, Alshain said:

Because the DevNotes are mostly concerned with the upcoming version.

So I should make a seperate thread then? If they wont answer it here.....whats the point?

[Alshain]

Just now, Redneck said:

So I should make a seperate thread then? If they wont answer it here.....whats the point?

They will tell us when they are ready to tell us and not before, that's the point.

[Perry Apsis]

10 minutes ago, Alshain said:

affordability is not the issue.  Fun is very much the issue, and life support is not.

Could we possibly allow for some difference of opinion on this issue? Personally, I would have said the same thing about money. In fact, I did. Now I use settings that make it so money doesn't affect my gameplay.

I like playing with life support, and I would enjoy having a stripped down version in stock. I'm sure it would be optional if it were implemented.

[Alshain]

2 minutes ago, Perry Apsis said:

Could we possibly allow for some difference of opinion on this issue? Personally, I would have said the same thing about money. In fact, I did. Now I use settings that make it so money doesn't affect my gameplay.

I like playing with life support, and I would enjoy having a stripped down version in stock. I'm sure it would be optional if it were implemented.

The problem with "It will be optional" is that part loading is not optional and life support requires a lot of parts.  No feature that requires parts is completely optional.  As far as difference of opinions, we have that.  My opinion is no life support.

Edited August 25, 2016 by Alshain

[Kerbuvim]

35 minutes ago, Alshain said:

affordability is not the issue.  Fun is very much the issue, and life support is not.

And what a fun in flying on the tediuous curved orbits? Let's fly in straight lines, it is easy and fun!)

Edited August 25, 2016 by Kerbuvim

[Alshain]

1 minute ago, Kerbuvim said:

And what a fun is flying on the tediuous curved orbits? Let's fly in straight lines, it is easy and fun!)

You will find I don't make points against strawmen.  Might as well not place them, I just step around.

Edited August 25, 2016 by Alshain

[eddiew]

1 hour ago, Jarin said:

Top tier cores have "target" and "maneuver" SAS options, in addition to all the others, which makes them very easy to pilot with only local control. If you need less thrust, you can modify the engine's max thrust directly.

Yeah, but... I don't fancy landing on a vacuum body above 0.5g with only a binary choice of 0 or 2 TWR. (Plenty of these available via Kopernicus!)

[FullMetalMachinist]

9 minutes ago, eddiew said:

Yeah, but... I don't fancy landing on a vacuum body above 0.5g with only a binary choice of 0 or 2 TWR. (Plenty of these available via Kopernicus!)

You have lots of options. 

1) Land your probe such that it has line of sight with Kerbin 

2) Use a satellite in orbit to relay the signal from the probe to Kerbin if you can't get line of sight directly. 

3) Have a mothership in order that has a pilot Kerbal aboard to control the probe. 

4) Turn off the telemetry system altogether. 

I'm sure that there are more possibilities, but that's the point, isn't it? To add more gameplay mechanics which make the game more fun? And if you don't like it, or don't like exactly how it is implemented, then turn it off or mod it. 

[Skalou]

32 minutes ago, Alshain said:

affordability is not the issue.  Fun is very much the issue, and life support is not.

For me it is ,

it forces me to find a nice balance between pure efficiency trajectories and time, bi-elliptic transfert or ejection burn cut in dozen pieces for manned? no more...

[RoverDude]

14 minutes ago, eddiew said:

Yeah, but... I don't fancy landing on a vacuum body above 0.5g with only a binary choice of 0 or 2 TWR. (Plenty of these available via Kopernicus!)

Then set up a relay in advance if you are concerned you will be occluded on your descent.  Or get creative with your engine tweakables   

The rub with a probe core that bypasses all restrictions is that in sandbox, it becomes the only probe core you actually use.

[eddiew]

2 minutes ago, RoverDude said:

Then set up a relay in advance if you are concerned you will be occluded on your descent.  Or get creative with your engine tweakables   

The rub with a probe core that bypasses all restrictions is that in sandbox, it becomes the only probe core you actually use.

I remember relays from 0.90 with remote tech... the satellite always left LoS before I landed  

But it's ok, if I don't get on with it, I will just turn that feature off and go on with my life

[Errol]

4 hours ago, RoverDude said:

If your probe has control, you're fine.  The control locks only kick into play when you lose your connection (via occlusion or lack of signal strength).  By the way, I was able with the auto pilot to very creatively align to a node, even when occluded - was just a bit tricky   of course your best bet is to make sure you have signal and pre-align.

Can we get more information on how signal strength will affect gameplay or other things in game?

53 minutes ago, Alshain said:

affordability is not the issue.  Fun is very much the issue, and life support is not.

Yeah no. Life support for you isn't fun, sure, fine.

There are a lot of us, mainly everyone that uses an LS mod, that think life support is fun. 

 

 

Edited August 25, 2016 by Errol

[Kerbuvim]

15 minutes ago, Errol said:

Can we get more information on how signal strength will affect gameplay or other things in game?

Well, for example - increase in electricity consumption in the weak-signal gain with increasing distance from the signal source ... With many years of flying on batteries or small solar panels, small probe can suddenly turn out to be completely de-energized.

Edited August 25, 2016 by Kerbuvim

[Fobok]

I'm really liking the sound of these changes, especially the radio system. Like a low difficulty Remotetech, which is just what I'm looking for. (Up to now I basically take the mod as it is and turn the difficulties down, this time I'm using the SETI rebalance settings.) As long as Mech Jeb still works, and unmanned satellites can work as relays (I only saw manned capsules mentioned earlier), this will fit me just perfectly. :-)

[klgraham1013]

1 hour ago, Alshain said:

I hope not.  Life support and KSP do not fit together, it adds tedium and no gameplay.

Agree to disagree.  I think anything more on the subject has been said before.

1 hour ago, HoloYolo said:

Life support should stay a mod. This game isn't meant to be 100% realistic.

Most of the LS mods aren't 100% realistic.

1 hour ago, Alshain said:

They aren't answering the question because it's not coming in the next version.  If it were, we would have heard before QA started.

Yep.  It's been clear for a while that the parts overhaul isn't coming this update.

[luizopiloto]

How will wheels and Legs perform in 1.2? any update?

[regex]

Landing a probe without signal will be pretty easy; you have engine on and off controls, and can use SAS commands like "point retrograde", if I'm reading this correctly. Sure, you can't land it exactly where you want it, but it's certainly not a super-difficult task.

Also, this game could use life support for the extra detail, and fun, it offers.

[AlphaMensae]

1 hour ago, Alshain said:

They aren't answering the question because it's not coming in the next version.  If it were, we would have heard before QA started.

After today's Squadcast, I'm more inclined to think this is the case.  @NathanKell has been showing a proto-version of 1.2, not even a buid, but something that runs inside the Unity editor.  Someone in chat asked if it was merely 1.1.3 with some 1.2 features hacked in, but NK said nope, it really was 1.2...and there was no sign of any revamped parts, everything was just the same as before .  Now, it could be that they weren't loaded in or otherwise not ready yet, but it's looking more and more likely the new parts will be in 1.3 (if there is one).

 

[basic.syntax]

52 minutes ago, Alshain said:

54 minutes ago, Perry Apsis said:

I like playing with life support, and I would enjoy having a stripped down version in stock. I'm sure it would be optional if it were implemented.

The problem with "It will be optional" is that part loading is not optional and life support requires a lot of parts.  No feature that requires parts is completely optional.  As far as difference of opinions, we have that.  My opinion is no life support.

I don't think LS is a "missing" part of the stock KSP experience, which has many consumables that can run out, and lead to rescue missions.  If a future Squad LS were implemented as a mod, then we could choose to install the parts, or not. I think that would be the best way to go. I would further suggest new checkbox options in game settings to automatically download / install / enable official mods.

[HafCoJoe]

Great notes! I sadly have to gloss over most of the notes as I fly in and out of signal range in Yosemite, but I want to thank Nightingale for adding the custom difficulty settings to the main menu (should be amazing for KCT and the likes), as well as to Claw for fixing black hole ablator! I sadly can't tag names on mobile so I'll have to hope you see this. Also another shout out to Porkjet who although isn't named this week, I'm sure is hard at work with the hinted at part revamps to come. Take care everyone