[1.12] KSP-RO - Realism Overhaul [16 May 2022]

[Starwaster]

@Epox75

You asked after AIES patches for landing gear; I stumbled across this today. I have no idea if the landing gear fix is the same as the one you were after but here it is. (apparently works by using the stock animator module to animate the legs so no suspension)

Also for anyone else that had an interest in AIES

[Epox75]

15 hours ago, Starwaster said:

@Epox75

You asked after AIES patches for landing gear; I stumbled across this today. I have no idea if the landing gear fix is the same as the one you were after but here it is. (apparently works by using the stock animator module to animate the legs so no suspension)

Also for anyone else that had an interest in AIES

Yes, is the one I was looking for. I wanted to use a specific set of legs for landers in micro gravity and suspension is not really needed. 

[GameData]

literally everyone wants this to work for 1.5.1.

I have RSS but not RO, and i want this to be updated. I know the only reason this is not updated is because supporting mods haven't been updated,but perhaps you could make this work without those mods.

[raidernick]

9 hours ago, GameData said:

literally everyone wants this to work for 1.5.1.

I have RSS but not RO, and i want this to be updated. I know the only reason this is not updated is because supporting mods haven't been updated,but perhaps you could make this work without those mods.

make RO work without realfuels? good luck with that, kinda the whole POINT of RO.....

[GameData]

just make realfuels on its own

 

[MedievalNerd]

1 hour ago, GameData said:

just make realfuels on its own

 

If you think supporting this mod is that easy. Why not try to join the group and help out.

I worked on a what was probably a much simpler version of this mod. (Realism Progression LITE) And you have no idea how complex it is to try and update it. There are a lot of dependencies that prevent you from updating until they are all done. And the longer the list of required mods, the higher the risk that a key mod may start receiving less updates, see no longer getting any support.

The countless hours that modders spent on making something like this goes underappreciated.

Having shouldered the burden a long time ago. I have all the patience in the world for these brave few lads.

To be fair you might not be aware of the intricacies at play with this mod. But asking to "make it without real fuels" would be like asking to make a human but without any blood in it. You can't just excise a key mod like that.

Edited December 16, 2018 by MedievalNerd

[raidernick]

3 hours ago, GameData said:

just make realfuels on its own

 

I am now convinced that you've never actually USED this mod before...

[Starwaster]

14 hours ago, GameData said:

literally everyone wants this to work for 1.5.1.

I have RSS but not RO, and i want this to be updated. I know the only reason this is not updated is because supporting mods haven't been updated,but perhaps you could make this work without those mods.

You need to be more mindful and think about other people. Every one of the modders involved with this project does it for free and you have zero right of expectation as to when or if it gets updated. Posting that you want this or that will not speed things along or in be in any way helpful.

 

 

[NLB_BlackWolf]

I installed RO yesterday, but when I launch it, it doesn't seem to be working properly, and it always crash, should I try the installing process all over again?

Edited December 17, 2018 by NLB_BlackWolf
my text wasn't clear so I have to edit a bit

[raidernick]

Just a quick update note for everyone. I know I said I wasn't planning on making a 1.4.x release but since 1.5.x dependencies are still not finished and the release itself has many issues I was convinced by the rest of the team to just go ahead and make a 1.4.x release as everything for that is currently ready. So some updates will be made on github shortly(maybe) and once all the testing and such is done for that it will be released. After that we will either then totally focus on 1.5.x or skip it for 1.6(which i hear is coming out soonish?).

[Schizer]

        Thank you everyone for your work and patience, especially when dealing with some head aching fans.

The people who really love this mod suite are already happy as can be with previous updates. I don't care if the next update isn't until "Kerbal 2.0" haha 

[Wallygator]

I think the logic reregarding a release now and a focus on 1.6 is very sound. 

I look forward to seeing the results of this uocoming RO release.

Every mod developer involved here has the weight of the world on their shoulders regarding this addon. And I’m not speaking of the kerbal one.  

i for one quietly appreciate it. I’ve donated funds where I could to show support. And I’ll do it again. 

Edited December 17, 2018 by Wallygator

[Angustino]

On 12/16/2018 at 8:42 PM, raidernick said:

Just a quick update note for everyone. I know I said I wasn't planning on making a 1.4.x release but since 1.5.x dependencies are still not finished and the release itself has many issues I was convinced by the rest of the team to just go ahead and make a 1.4.x release as everything for that is currently ready. So some updates will be made on github shortly(maybe) and once all the testing and such is done for that it will be released. After that we will either then totally focus on 1.5.x or skip it for 1.6(which i hear is coming out soonish?).

I´d love to see it made compatible for 1.6 since RAM performance has been improved.

[etheoma]

Personally I would just give up on 1.5 and go right to 1.6 given the greater stability and performance of 1.6 as building on a unstable ground is never a particularly good idea it would also mean that you could catch up to the current release a little bit maybe.

Edited December 21, 2018 by etheoma

[NSEP]

Is there a way to make HeatPump (the little addon that allows you to store cryogenic fuels longer) work for 1.3.1, or are there alternative mods with the same function?

[siimav]

1 hour ago, NSEP said:

Is there a way to make HeatPump (the little addon that allows you to store cryogenic fuels longer) work for 1.3.1, or are there alternative mods with the same function?

The HeatPump mod was redone and is now called Real Active Radiators. It also has a separate GH repo and forum thread. The new version works a lot better with high timewarp but be aware that the EC consumption is a lot higher (and more realistic) than before.

[NSEP]

59 minutes ago, siimav said:

The HeatPump mod was redone and is now called Real Active Radiators. It also has a separate GH repo and forum thread. The new version works a lot better with high timewarp but be aware that the EC consumption is a lot higher (and more realistic) than before.

Thanks for the quick response!

[Starwaster]

3 hours ago, siimav said:

The HeatPump mod was redone and is now called Real Active Radiators. It also has a separate GH repo and forum thread. The new version works a lot better with high timewarp but be aware that the EC consumption is a lot higher (and more realistic) than before.

 

2 hours ago, NSEP said:

Thanks for the quick response!

What he said + basically, cooling costs depend on if refrigeration is required. If the thing you are cooling is hotter than the radiator then it's just basic pump costs because heat naturally flows from hot to cold. If what you are cooling is colder than the radiator then work has to be performed and the electrical cost is governed by the Carnot equations and depends on the difference between the cold side temperature and the hot side. 

To keep cooling costs down you will want to increase the amount of insulation. In Real Fuels there is a slider for MLI (multi-layered insulation) which is highly effective in a vacuum. In atmo it's not as effective (but still better than bare tank or foam insulation. Tanks marked cryogenic  automatically have 10 layers + whatever you add. If the tanks are allowed to overheat then it costs more to cool them back down than when they are already at their target temperature. (where you only have to worry about heat leak)

Edited December 22, 2018 by Starwaster

[NSEP]

Beings me to another question: Does RO or maybe even stock KSP model the temperature difference in sunlit/shaded areas?

[siimav]

5 minutes ago, NSEP said:

Beings me to another question: Does RO or maybe even stock KSP model the temperature difference in sunlit/shaded areas?

Yes, it does. With cryogenic fuels, it's always wise to orient the vessel in a way that minimizes the tank surface area that the sun is shining on. Heat conduction is also implemented so keeping the distance between sunlit areas and tanks also helps.

[Starwaster]

@NSEP @siimav

Also, MLI decreases part-part conduction for the part with the tank besides just decreasing skin-interior. (assume that the installation of the MLI included minimizing conduction pathways and low conductivity connectors.

RO/RF is also the only mod with realistically modeled boiloff. Every other mod out there that I've checked out implement it as a static loss of resource over time with no regard as to how much heat the tank is exposed to. (so you get the same boiloff no matter if you're orbiting Mercury or Pluto) - Because of that I highly recommend turning OFF boiloff for every mod that has it besides Real Fuels. Otherwise you would end up losing cryogenic resources from mods other than RF.  (and Real Active Radiator won't be able to help with those other mods since they don't care about actual heat flux or temperature of the tank)

Edited August 29, 2021 by Starwaster

[raidernick]

Ok quick update, 1.5.x is dead in the water in terms of releases. We will NOT be releasing any of the RO related mods for that if they haven't been done already. We have a current open PR for 1.4.5 which will be releasing soon. It is currently waiting on 3 mod updates. Two of those mods will be done fairly quickly, the third is being debated what to do with it right now. This should all hopefully be wrapped up soon in regards to that release.

For 1.6.x, we will be moving on to that immediately after 1.4.5. I will personally update all of the RO related mods that I have access to for 1.6.x and I'll push the mod authors of the other mods to get their stuff updated for it as well. This should ensure only the REQUIRED mods as set in this thread or CKAN are updated. I cannot and will not guarantee all of the "recommended" or "suggested" mods are updated.  There are far too many to deal with and too many mod authors who have vanished or have changed hands.

 

EDIT: On a side note we will not be supporting the DLC content at all. I don't have it, nobody on the team has it as far as I'm aware and all of the parts it adds are copies of already existing mods with much higher fidelity models. Nobody wants to buy the DLC and then do the work to add support for parts they won't be using and I don't want to do that either. That won't stop us from adding support if someone who DOES have the parts and wants to make PR for them though submits something. Just be aware that if that happens that person will be expected to keep the files up to date and in working order or they will be removed in future releases if they are causing problems.

Edited December 23, 2018 by raidernick

[ColKlonk2]

[DylanSemrau]

Does someone have an RO config for Launcher's Pack that they'd be able to share with me?

[Nebbie]

23 hours ago, raidernick said:

EDIT: On a side note we will not be supporting the DLC content at all. I don't have it, nobody on the team has it as far as I'm aware and all of the parts it adds are copies of already existing mods with much higher fidelity models. Nobody wants to buy the DLC and then do the work to add support for parts they won't be using and I don't want to do that either. That won't stop us from adding support if someone who DOES have the parts and wants to make PR for them though submits something. Just be aware that if that happens that person will be expected to keep the files up to date and in working order or they will be removed in future releases if they are causing problems.

Doing some missions with RO would be pretty nice; I had an idea a while back to make a Columbia rescue mission, but designing space shuttles that look and fly even sort of realistically in stock is absolutely painful.

Really, the DLC engines and such are no great loss (aside of the Cheetah and Mastodon, they're really ugly, as they carry that uncanny quality of KSP's painted-terracotta-like textures, just in higher resolution and with grey-colored bits protruding everywhere), but certain features are great, and so are engine plates (is there a mod that adds these to the base game?)

 

I do think little of value is lost skipping 1.5.1. The only change that really matters is deployables being stronger while undeployed (no more shattering solar panels just because the fairing brushed them). Most of the changes were visual updates (peanuts if you're running RO) and a few of the more notably shiny ones didn't even shine outside the VAB until 1.6! That said, with how little the changes touched actual mechanics, it's worrying that mods have taken this long to update, as it suggests a serious lack of maintenance.

Edited December 24, 2018 by Nebbie