SunlitZelkova Posted March 2 Share Posted March 2 6 hours ago, Codraroll said: Is this pathetic attempt at whataboutism in any way relevant to the topic at hand, which is the state of the Russian space agency? I think he’s saying that the types of accidents Russia has can be found in the US too, and thus the problem should not be characterized as Russian but rather something every space program goes through. Russia does have its own problems specific to it but the failure of spacecraft themselves feels like normal teething pains. The “we forgot to turn on the laser altimeter” of IM-1 feels a lot like Nauka’s “we forgot to take the cover off of the star tracker.” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted March 2 Share Posted March 2 7 hours ago, Codraroll said: whataboutism I'm as sad about the US space program, as you are about the RU one. Just wanted to support you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatastrophicFailure Posted March 2 Share Posted March 2 5 hours ago, SunlitZelkova said: Russia does have its own problems specific to it but the failure of spacecraft themselves feels like normal teething pains. The “we forgot to turn on the laser altimeter” of IM-1 feels a lot like Nauka’s “we forgot to take the cover off of the star tracker.” On the one hand, you have a commercial space startup on its very first mission making rookie errors as, well, a rookie (and still pulling off a mission success). On the other hand, you have the agency that arguably started spaceflight and should be the ol’ hoss at it making… rookie errors. Not just once, but a pattern, which points to deep systemic troubles within said agency… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SunlitZelkova Posted March 2 Share Posted March 2 40 minutes ago, CatastrophicFailure said: On the one hand, you have a commercial space startup on its very first mission making rookie errors as, well, a rookie (and still pulling off a mission success). On the other hand, you have the agency that arguably started spaceflight and should be the ol’ hoss at it making… rookie errors. Not just once, but a pattern, which points to deep systemic troubles within said agency… Incorrect, the lander was manufactured by Lavochkin, which wasn't in the space business at all when Sputnik launched. And it was managed by the Russian Academy of Sciences, which played no role in Sputnik's launch. I don't believe there is anything special about Luna-25's failure that can actually be tied to a "modern day" problem of the Russian space program. Since the very beginning, the Soviets and now Russians have had numerous failures of robotic spacecraft. Just look up how many early Luna missions they launched that didn't actually get named because they failed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luna_programme#Mission_success_rates Essentially only 1 in 3 missions succeeded overall, with that ratio getting worse for landers in particular. Luna-25 is just a drop in the bucket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDE Posted March 2 Share Posted March 2 (edited) 2 hours ago, SunlitZelkova said: I don't believe there is anything special about Luna-25's failure that can actually be tied to a "modern day" problem of the Russian space program. Luna-25 had a major revision to its control system, likely caused by a combination of reliance on imported electronics and the dragged-out development uncharacteristic of Soviet-era probes. 3 hours ago, CatastrophicFailure said: On the other hand, you have the agency that arguably started spaceflight and should be the ol’ hoss at it making… rookie errors. Well, it's not the agency that builds the probe, is it? It's not the ghosts of Korolev and Babakin doing QA. Essentially, Lavochkin are rookies all the same... just with more bureaucracy, thieving and braggadocio. Process analysis and control engineering do seem to be JPL's magic sauce, and I don't remember them being nearly as much of a thing in the later years of the Soviet Union. The Elon Musk ethos of flying by the seat of the pants seemed to remain quite pervasive, and so precious little systematization was done. Remember the old story about Khrunichev hiring two guys to hammer out the same piece of Proton hull, for decades, instead of going to the manufacturer and asking for a respec? Edited March 2 by DDE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreeMACH Posted March 2 Share Posted March 2 I think it has something to do with higher education per capita Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted March 2 Share Posted March 2 Even when nothing failed, it's a time to say that everything's failed. Even on two successful launches, including the multisat one. This inspires. It's nice to see that Starship/SLS/Orion/CST/lunar probes feel good. But of course, Roskosmos and DPRKosmos are the only bad feelers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 (edited) [snip] https://spacenews.com/nasa-cancels-osam-1-satellite-servicing-technology-mission/ NASA has cancelled the OSAM-1 project (in-orbit satellite refuelling). 2 bln USD was not enough. [snip] Edited March 4 by Vanamonde Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDE Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 Spektr-RG's magnitude goes from 17-18m to 11m, likely due to upcoming equinox https://t.me/kiam_ison_network/189 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanamonde Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 Some comments removed. Please restrict discussions to the space program and not the politics behind it. We're not here to decide whose country is better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted March 5 Author Share Posted March 5 On 3/3/2024 at 5:36 AM, kerbiloid said: NASA has cancelled the OSAM-1 project (in-orbit satellite refuelling). 2 bln USD was not enough. Note that the goal here was to refill props in satellites not designed for refilling. Odd anyone would even bother trying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darthgently Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 3 hours ago, tater said: Note that the goal here was to refill props in satellites not designed for refilling. Odd anyone would even bother trying. That one always seemed very sketchy. Maybe via EVA from a Shuttle or Work Truck Dragon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 (edited) 17 hours ago, tater said: Note that the goal here was to refill props in satellites not designed for refilling. Odd anyone would even bother trying. Bed bugs do it daily. (18+ photo, maybe even R) Spoiler https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Постельный_клоп#Размножение Quote Reproduction One bedbug (Cimex lectularius) traumatically inseminates another Bed bugs mate through traumatic insemination. The male pierces the female's abdomen with his genitals and injects sperm into the resulting hole. In all types of bed bugs, except Primicimex cavernis , sperm enters one of the compartments of the Berlese organ [note 1] . Gametes can remain there for a long time, then penetrate through the hemolymph into the ovarioles to the formed eggs. This method of reproduction increases the chances of survival in case of prolonged starvation, since stored gametes can be phagocytosed [13] [14] . Insect with incomplete metamorphosis . Females lay up to 5 eggs per day. A total of 250 to 500 eggs during a lifetime. The full development cycle from egg to adult is 30-40 days. Under unfavorable conditions - 80-100 days. Conclusion: sats are bugs. Edited March 5 by kerbiloid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDE Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 (edited) Imagine having that hair on official record. I'm at a loss who that is to Gagarin's left. Edited March 6 by DDE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDE Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 It's not a new meme but it's always a handy one "What we pitched" "What got approved" "What fit in the actual budget" Spoiler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 14 hours ago, DDE said: Imagine having that hair on official record. They are standing below a high-voltage power line, and he's the only one with dry hair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDE Posted March 9 Share Posted March 9 90th birthday Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted March 10 Share Posted March 10 (edited) https://www-interfax-ru.translate.goog/russia/949672?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=ru&_x_tr_pto=wapp Oleg Kononenko is appointed to the command of ISS till September. Edited March 10 by kerbiloid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatastrophicFailure Posted March 10 Share Posted March 10 On 3/9/2024 at 8:12 AM, DDE said: 90th birthday Wow… so much to digest on one page… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted March 11 Author Share Posted March 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SunlitZelkova Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 https://www.lpi.usra.edu/publications/books/sovietReach/index.pdf A brief history of the Soviet Moonshot project, for anyone uninitiated and interested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted March 21 Author Share Posted March 21 (edited) 9 hours: Edited March 21 by tater Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted March 21 Author Share Posted March 21 Abort at 20s Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDE Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 There's a long, highly critical article by Fyodor Yurhikhin in the GLONASS journal. I dunno if I'll ever get to pulling the whole interview out of a PDF and into a translator, but one point felt particularly novel to me. Roscosmos is a poor attempt to emulate the success of Rosatom. Also, fun fact: Roscosmos's Telegram lists Vasilevskaya as a spaceflight participant, not a cosmonaut. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted March 21 Author Share Posted March 21 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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