[1.8.1-1.12.x] Modular Launch Pads v2.8.0: Launch clamps evolved: Real-style launch bases and towers [24 December 2024]

[AlphaMensae]

Version 2.0.8!

I've released version 2.0.8, now available on Spacedock and the GitHub.

Changelog:

• Removed the integrated clamp arms, fuel arms and gantry from the Soyuz Launch Base. Attach them separately now; clamp arms surface attach, the fuel arms attach to the auxiliary nodes on the ring, and the gantry attaches to the auxiliary node in the center, below the rocket attach node.
• Added transfer airlocks to the gantry's crew elevator platforms, to allow crew boarding of a spacecraft inside a fairing via the crew transfer function.
• Updated B9PartSwitch to v2.13.0 for KSP 1.8.1, works in KSP 1.9.x. It is now the default B9PS in the download's GameData Folder.
• B9PartSwitch for KSP 1.7.3 is available as a separate .zip file in the root folder of the download.
• Updated Spacedock compatibility to KSP v1.9.

I decided to push out the revised Soyuz Launch Base and gantry as another interim point release, because the integrated one was just too massive and complex, and with the already existing separate arm and gantry parts, it was also a lot of needless duplication.  I also wanted to get the transfer airlocks for the Soyuz elevator out now, since it really needed those so one could actually board a crew onto the namesake spacecraft.  

[AlphaMensae]

I've also added 45° positions for the hold-down bolts in the new Round Launch Stand, and the revised stand is also on the AlphaDev branch.

It was a silly oversight, as I was trying to minimize variants, but I then added support beams for 8 clamp arms, so I should have added 4 more bolts. Now you can use the Round Stand with the Titan II...but I'm also going to make a dedicated Titan II Launch Stand.  

[Guest]

On 2/15/2020 at 7:37 PM, AlphaMensae said:

I decided to push out the revised Soyuz Launch Base and gantry as another interim point release, because the integrated one was just too massive and complex, and with the already existing separate arm and gantry parts, it was also a lot of needless duplication.  I also wanted to get the transfer airlocks for the Soyuz elevator out now, since it really needed those so one could actually board a crew onto the namesake spacecraft.  

Speaking of Soyuz, could you have a look at making more Soviet/Russian-style pads? Specifically, Angara:

I think it looks absolutely lovely.  Dual gantry with those "enveloping" arms is something you don't yet have. Also, it might be a bit big, but I found an interesting pic of the Energia/N1 launch complex:

The whole N1 tower rotated away. I would say, if this could be done, it would be awesome, though probably complex and not very modular. The Energia towers themselves seem fairly similar to those already in the mod, though they may be a bit larger (remember, the core is 5m KSP scale):

I really like that crew arm, though, and I think that the side supports and different side attachment variants have some merit, as well. That pipe going down from the hatch is the crew escape ramp, BTW.

[AlphaMensae]

@Dragon01

I actually am planning to do the N1 and Energia-Buran structures, will be part of v2.2 (or v2.3 depending on how long the Saturn redo takes).  Beyond that, any other Russian launch stuff is part of the sort of 2-year plan.

The N1 tower will definitely be one part (due to being animated), sized for the Tantares N1,  with maybe an extension for Raidernick's.  For the actual hold-down clamp (a circular one), I'll make two versions: one for the Kosmodrome KK package (has the whole N1 pad static with the triple flame trenches), and something for the stock pad, which will be a (very) large platform that sits over (and covers up) the pad static.

Energia will be getting it's own custom launch base and the two side towers, along with the Buran arms.

[Guest]

Don't forget a version of N1 tower for the 5m Energia. It was still used, for the same purpose as the Shuttle RSS. 

Speaking of Shuttle, any chance of adding a variant of the pad with exhaust hole under the tank (maybe connecting the two SRB holes, or something). Some alternative Shuttle designs put the engines under the ET. Also, a way to attach RSS to generic towers (or Saturn one, for "Satuttle" configuration) would be great, as well, for custom STS tower designs.

[infinite_monkey]

Hey @AlphaMensae, do you think you could create cable umbilicals, so they are bent and not just straight pipes? Looking something like these:

I think it could be done technically, as @IgorZ showed in his experiments for KAS (source: https://www.patreon.com/posts/real-looking-22437770)

He used bezier curves, but for hanging cables it should probably be the cosh funtion instead.

[AlphaMensae]

6 minutes ago, infinite_monkey said:

Hey @AlphaMensae, do you think you could create cable umbilicals, so they are bent and not just straight pipes? Looking something like these:

 

I think it could be done technically, as @IgorZ showed in his experiments for KAS (source: https://www.patreon.com/posts/real-looking-22437770)

 

He used bezier curves, but for hanging cables it should probably be the cosh funtion instead.

Sorry, no. There would be no way to make them adjustable in length, and the animation would be a nightmare, let alone modeling them. The straight pipe-likle approach was for ease of modeling and animating. I use Wings 3D, and don't have any fancy tools like that, not that I'd use them anyway.

[infinite_monkey]

29 minutes ago, AlphaMensae said:

Sorry, no. There would be no way to make them adjustable in length, and the animation would be a nightmare, let alone modeling them. The straight pipe-likle approach was for ease of modeling and animating. I use Wings 3D, and don't have any fancy tools like that, not that I'd use them anyway.

I see, thanks anyway!

[CaptKordite]

I've just started playing around with Launch Pads in preparation for blogging a Tantares playthrough and found that the N1 would just sort of drop. I guess as physics is enacted, the weight of the N1 is too much for the attachment node and it just falls into the flame pit. I tried putting a bunch of stock clamps underneath it but it wasn't enough. Am I doing something wrong?

[AlphaMensae]

38 minutes ago, CaptKordite said:

I've just started playing around with Launch Pads in preparation for blogging a Tantares playthrough and found that the N1 would just sort of drop. I guess as physics is enacted, the weight of the N1 is too much for the attachment node and it just falls into the flame pit. I tried putting a bunch of stock clamps underneath it but it wasn't enough. Am I doing something wrong?

Make sure that a launch base or stand is not the root part.

[CaptKordite]

1 hour ago, AlphaMensae said:

Make sure that a launch base or stand is not the root part.

I loaded the N1 (390 ton), attached the base, and launched. It take a moment and then drops. I loaded up a Proton rocket (132 ton) and it was stable. So, I offloaded fuel from the N1 thinking there may be a mass point but that wasn't it. I emptied out most of the fuel from the N1 to the point where it was lighter than the Proton and it still dropped. As it got lighter it wobbled more before disconnecting from the attachment point but it still just dropped. It's not mass.

I tried another experiment. I loaded up a NRAP Test Weight, loaded it up to 1,000 tons, and attached a Launch Base. When physics kicked it it dropped a bit, bounced, wobbled, flipped around, and ended up hanging upside down like it was on a string. The attachment node held. I loaded up an Energia (just short of 900 ton) and it behaved like the NRAP weight. It fell over because it only had the one attachment point at the base but it held. Eventually it failed and broke but it held for a few minutes.

Another experiment. I removed the payload. I removed the next stage. Then the next. Each time it would wobble and then drop straight down. Until I had only the first stage and engine. That sat stable.

I guess I'm doing it right. It's just something about the N1.

[AlphaMensae]

26 minutes ago, CaptKordite said:

I loaded the N1 (390 ton), attached the base, and launched. It take a moment and then drops. I loaded up a Proton rocket (132 ton) and it was stable. So, I offloaded fuel from the N1 thinking there may be a mass point but that wasn't it. I emptied out most of the fuel from the N1 to the point where it was lighter than the Proton and it still dropped. As it got lighter it wobbled more before disconnecting from the attachment point but it still just dropped. It's not mass.

I tried another experiment. I loaded up a NRAP Test Weight, loaded it up to 1,000 tons, and attached a Launch Base. When physics kicked it it dropped a bit, bounced, wobbled, flipped around, and ended up hanging upside down like it was on a string. The attachment node held. I loaded up an Energia (just short of 900 ton) and it behaved like the NRAP weight. It fell over because it only had the one attachment point at the base but it held. Eventually it failed and broke but it held for a few minutes.

Another experiment. I removed the payload. I removed the next stage. Then the next. Each time it would wobble and then drop straight down. Until I had only the first stage and engine. That sat stable.

I guess I'm doing it right. It's just something about the N1.

Which N1?  I've launched the Tantares N1 just fine (it's in the v2.0 trailer).  BDB and DECQ's Saturn Vs, and the SOCK shuttle as well,

Make sure to autostrut everything.

[CaptKordite]

1 hour ago, AlphaMensae said:

Which N1?  I've launched the Tantares N1 just fine

The Tantares N1 straight from his craft file folder.

I'll have to try autostruct tomorrow. I've never used it before and just figured out ways to not need it. Took some experimentation, though.

[AlphaMensae]

7 minutes ago, CaptKordite said:

The Tantares N1 straight from his craft file folder.

I'll have to try autostruct tomorrow. I've never used it before and just figured out ways to not need it. Took some experimentation, though.
 

I've always used KJR, but in KSP 1.8.x and up, there's a major problem with KJR (both the Continued and Next forks) and launch clamps....and since my launch stands and bases are launch clamps, I've been forced to drop KJR and use the stock autostruts instead.

The autostruts can work nicely, you just have to use them properly. Don't autostrut everything to the root part or heaviest part; instead, just do root or heaviest part for the first 2 or 3 parts, then create a chain of grandparent part autostruts. Makes everything rock-solid without causing problems.

[AlphaMensae]

The new Vanguard Launch Stand is almost done!  

 

Alternate configuration:

 

There's also a configuration without the side umbilicals/hold-downs for the Vanguard bare engine variant or 0.9375m tank; will add another hold-down botk option for 1.25m tanks.

[AlphaMensae]

More colliders added, including the ladders:

 

Just need to tweak the tower attach nodes and update the dark gray and red color textures (all I'm doing for now until the layout is finalized), and it will be good to go.

Next will be the Vanguard tower, which will be a 1-piece tower but with a half-height variant. The base plate, whatever the top is like and the front tube-frame thing will be toggleable so multiple tower parts can be stacked (obviously not with the tier 1 launch pad  ).

[AlphaMensae]

And the Vanguard Launch Stand is now on the AlphaDev brance of the GitHub!

I added the 1.25m tank hold-down options, but caution: Do not use en engine with a full 1.2m cylinder collider, like with the stock Reliant and Swivel, or they will explode from collider clipping with the hold-down structure and/or deck. I did add an option to turn off the hold-down structure so other hold-downs can be used, but the exhaust hole is 0.95m in diameter, and while the deck colliders don't go all the way to the hole's edge, it's not much, so a too-wide engine collider needs to clear the deck.

I tested the BDB Redstone engine, and it works fine.

Now for the Vanguard tower!

[CaptKordite]

On 2/19/2020 at 9:20 PM, AlphaMensae said:

The autostruts can work nicely, you just have to use them properly.

Yea, I guess I still haven't figured it out. I tried all sorts of things without any success. Some failures were more spectacular than other. I tried the Unbreakable Joints cheat and the flailing around like the Wacky Waving Inflatable Tube Guy until the payload detached and was thrown ten kilometers. Ditching Blok A seemed to work, though when the craft loaded there was a moment where the whole thing sort of shivered. I guess it wasn't bad enough to break the attachment node and, besides, Blok B and Blok V are enough for the L3 moon mission.

[AlphaMensae]

The Vanguard Service Tower is now done and on the AlphaDev branch of the GitHub!

 

As I had mentioned, the tower has a half-height (9m) variant, and the base frame and top can be separately toggled off, allowing multiple towers to be stacked (within pad height limits of course). The red&white color scheme is a new texture option as well, and is the default.

Next up is the Titan II-GLV launch stand, and the remake of the current Titan II-based Tier 2 tower into a full Titan II GLV specialty service tower, with single-piece and modular section variants.

[AlphaMensae]

Oh, a note about the RO basic patch that's in the Extras folder of the download: Do not use it with RP1, as RP1 has it's own .cfgs apparently, and it overwrites the simple patch I've included.

Someone else as having the problem of the MLP parts not showing up in RO+RP1, and that is why.

[AlphaMensae]

I also forgot to make the front tubular thing (looks like a net in some of the images) for the Vanguard tower in the rush to complete it.   Fixed that oversight, and the updated tower is now on the AlphaDev branch of the GitHub.

It's in both height variants, and can be turned of as well.

[TK-313]

On 2/22/2020 at 6:29 AM, CaptKordite said:

Yea, I guess I still haven't figured it out. I tried all sorts of things without any success. Some failures were more spectacular than other. I tried the Unbreakable Joints cheat and the flailing around like the Wacky Waving Inflatable Tube Guy until the payload detached and was thrown ten kilometers. Ditching Blok A seemed to work, though when the craft loaded there was a moment where the whole thing sort of shivered. I guess it wasn't bad enough to break the attachment node and, besides, Blok B and Blok V are enough for the L3 moon mission.

Try autostrutting each part to its grandparent from Block A or B upwards to the capsule, then from the LES downwards to the capsule (probably including the decouplers). Works for me.

Also, if you want the launch to look nice without Block A making the rocket OP to interplanetary, try some 2.5-3.2 scaled solar system. Perfect fit

Edited February 25, 2020 by TK-313

[AlphaMensae]

The new Titan II Launch Stand is done and now on the AlphaDev branch of the GitHub.

It's based mostly on the stand used at LC-19 at the Cape for the Titan II GLV, which isn't shown in most images I looked at since it's buried behind all kinds of stuff. For the details, I based it on a mish-mash of the stands at the Cape and Vandy with some of my own ideas.

 

It's designed so the hold-down bolts on the top mounting blocks line up with the corresponding holes on the supports that are on the new LR-87 engine in Bluedog Design Bureau. The Titan II actually sat flush on those blocks, so the bolts will be hidden, but they are there.   The attach node for the stand is placed so the BDB LR-87 will sit flush when placed. There's also a configuration for standard 1.875m tanks or engines.

 

Next up is the remake of the current "Tier 2 Service Tower", which was already styled after the Titan II GLV one, but it can be a lot better. Single-piece and modular versions will be available, as it's going to be another of the Special Service Towers, but still located in the MLP Launch Stands custom texh node.

[nasaholic]

Any future plans for ISRO hardware to go along the recently released Chrayol's PSLV mod?

[alberro+]

Could the F9 erector from Tundra be implemented? I.E, add the revamped tower that's on Pad 39 at KSC?