[1.0.5] FASA 5.44

[MaverickSawyer]

Ok, just found a visual glitch... the Mini LR-91 exhaust effect is a LONG ways behind the actual engine. Don't know why I missed that before.

[frizzank]

I have to fudge the proportions some so they will fit the stock part sizes, it's the lesser of two evils. It would be much more frustrating if all the parts were in perfect proportions but never really fit most of the stock parts or any other mod. Also Kerbals are short and wide so it messes with things as well.

I look at it as the Kerbal versions of NASA craft. I launch the classic ships only once or twice and then I find out how crazy I can get with boosters and landers.

[wasmic]

I have to fudge the proportions some so they will fit the stock part sizes, it's the lesser of two evils. It would be much more frustrating if all the parts were in perfect proportions but never really fit most of the stock parts or any other mod. Also Kerbals are short and wide so it messes with things as well.

I look at it as the Kerbal versions of NASA craft. I launch the classic ships only once or twice and then I find out how crazy I can get with boosters and landers.

I think I might actually end up using the Saturn I-B and the Apollo CSM a lot, for servicing stations. Anyway, I believe you already know that wer're all looking forward to what you and DennyTx are making.

[Kerbal01]

THAT monster? o.O Dear god... What kind of booster would that make?

it was conceptualized as a first stage booster for the saturn v.

[tmikesecrist3]

Well I think that I am going to remove the apollo mission pack, one your comoing up with one... and the Advanced Gemini pod could have done every thing that appollo did and do it cheaper and the perposed big gemini would be better then appollo was for soporting the operation of a space station

[MaverickSawyer]

it was conceptualized as a first stage booster for the saturn v.

I know... but this is KSP we're talking about here. SOMEONE is going to make it into a case of "MOAR BOOSTERS". Like, 6 of them attached radially to the S-I stage. (Jeb, I'm looking at you. )

[NathanKell]

Well, the plan did call for four. What's another 2? I'm sure Tom Paine would find a use for them, he shoehorned everything *else* crazy into IPP.

[tmikesecrist3]

This may seem odd, but I just reached a new mile stone is my space program, I just did the first rendevous and docking with an agina target ..... I hope I get some research points for it, but for some reasion I dont think I will.

[frizzank]

I know... but this is KSP we're talking about here. SOMEONE is going to make it into a case of "MOAR BOOSTERS". Like, 6 of them attached radially to the S-I stage. (Jeb, I'm looking at you. )

I see no problem with that. I mean how else are you suppose to get 750t into orbit on one go?

[tmikesecrist3]

Why would one want to lift 750 t in to orbert in one go, that would not be vary effisant

[metalmouth7]

Well, a manned flyby of Eve or Duna would be a good start for such a mission. You could even do a Dry Workshop version of the old Apollo Manned Venus Flyby, with some more useful science packages. You could even decelerate and launch some surface packages.

[tmikesecrist3]

would it not be cheaper esseyer and more effisant to lift it in parts and assimble in orbert?

like we did with iss and Mear

[tmikesecrist3]

I wonder what kind of things could I do with an advanced Gemini (gemini centar?) I could go to mun maybe mimens but what else? I know it was a compeating bid for the appollo system?

[NathanKell]

In this case Gemini-Agena. Frizzank isn't making a Centaur...

You could do lunar orbit Gemini with twin Agenas, actually, EOR. For a free return lunar flyby, even Transtage is enough.

http://falsesteps.wordpress.com/2012/11/17/gemini-lunar-flyby-always-the-bridesmaid/

[tmikesecrist3]

he has the parts for at lest the CSM for the centar.... so I could porbly put something like the capablatys togeather form the parts he gave me to come up with something like it....

[frizzank]

In this case Gemini-Agena. Frizzank isn't making a Centaur...

You could do lunar orbit Gemini with twin Agenas, actually, EOR. For a free return lunar flyby, even Transtage is enough.

http://falsesteps.wordpress.com/2012...he-bridesmaid/

Transtage works just fine as a substitute.

[NathanKell]

No, the issue there is frizzank thought transtage was the name of a type of stage rather than a particular stage, and thus called his model of the Transtage the Centaur instead. The name was fixed for the Transtage, but not for the small extra tank ("Centaur CSM") that he made to go with it.

Centaur is a rather different beast. It *is* possible to make one with real Centaur performance: use a stretchy tank of balloon cryo mode, fill it with LH2/LOx, and stick two RL-10s (from SFJackBauer's RealEngines patch) on it.

This is more or less like what a Centaur that would have been used as TLI stage for Gemini would have looked like (minus the GTV docking adapter they'd have stuff on the front):

Here's the modified Centaur (with GATV docking adapter on the front) with Gemini:

EDIT: Frizzank: It works in KSP because it takes a quarter of the deltaV, so a Transtage works for that.

And yes, I know you're not making a Centaur, and that's fine, not saying you should.

Edited January 12, 2014 by NathanKell

[CaptRobau]

DennyTx and your Apollo Program made me dive into the real Apollo Program and into the various designs that were considered. Some very interesting stuff.

All of the historic designs can be created with just the following stages: the S-I, S-IV, S-IB, S-IVB, S-II, S-IC. When those are combined with already existing parts such as the various Titan boosters and the Centaur Transtage you can cover the majority of the planned designs such as the Saturn INT-11, 12, 13, 18, etc.

I would also argue for adding a mounting plate for the F-1 engines as well. The Saturn INT-20 for example planned to have only 3 or 4 (because 5 was too much for that smaller design) F-1 on its first stage. This is also makes the Saturn V-B, V-C and V-D designs easier to make. Those had a stage-and-a-half approach, similar to the Atlas. A central F-1 was the sustainer engine. The other 4 were mounted on a Fairing Decouper which was dropped when the single F-1 was enough to accelerate the craft.

Edited January 12, 2014 by CaptRobau

[123nick]

for some reason the agena flight pack is giving null reference exceptions, has no collison mesh, may have over abundance of thrust, and other wierd stuff. dont know whats going on but it happend only after i updated my gpu driver

edit: may have been happening before i updated the gpu, but im not sure.

edit 2: i think i found the bug. i had 2 module manager ddls, 1.5.5 and 1.5.6 and i switched to the most recent one. should fix most problems

Edited January 13, 2014 by 123nick

[GoldForest]

Could you work on a Nova Rocket after the Saturn V? Seen here.

http://mix.msfc.nasa.gov/IMAGES/HIGH/9902050.jpg

It was a proposed plan to take astronauts to mars. It's not said how many crew it would have held, but I believe it would have carried a crew of four based on the picture. It looks like the crew module is just a tad bit bigger then the Saturn V crew module.

I am currently working on a mod which is based on it, but I have no moding experience and no experience with Unity. I've attempted and failed multiple times on getting the model to render, and be solid inside the game.

[MaverickSawyer]

No, the issue there is frizzank thought transtage was the name of a type of stage rather than a particular stage, and thus called his model of the Transtage the Centaur instead. The name was fixed for the Transtage, but not for the small extra tank ("Centaur CSM") that he made to go with it.

Centaur is a rather different beast. It *is* possible to make one with real Centaur performance: use a stretchy tank of balloon cryo mode, fill it with LH2/LOx, and stick two RL-10s (from SFJackBauer's RealEngines patch) on it.

This is more or less like what a Centaur that would have been used as TLI stage for Gemini would have looked like (minus the GTV docking adapter they'd have stuff on the front):

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8d/Centaur-D_rocket_stage.jpg

Here's the modified Centaur (with GATV docking adapter on the front) with Gemini:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6e/GeminiCentaur.svg/956px-GeminiCentaur.svg.png

EDIT: Frizzank: It works in KSP because it takes a quarter of the deltaV, so a Transtage works for that.

And yes, I know you're not making a Centaur, and that's fine, not saying you should.

AHA!!!! I was wondering when someone else would notice this little gem...

Yes, Transstage was originally built as an orbital tug for multi-deployment missions. It used two AJ-10 engines from the Delta second stage to provide power, and it had internal RCS and guidance packages.

As NathanKell put it, Centaur is a very different animal all together. Originally created to serve as a high-energy upper stage for Atlas-derived launchers, it has since been used on many other launchers, including the Titan IIIEs used to launch the Voyager spacecraft. A Centaur derivative is still in use today as the upper stage of the Atlas V.

So, given that frizzank has made both the Transstage and the Agena upper stages, I personally feel that a Centaur would be a very good addition. If it were up to me to make one, it would likely be very impact-sensitive, have a very low dry weight, and a VERY good fuel supply, and have nodes for both one and two engine configurations (since it has been flown in both versions). But, if Frizzank, doesn't make one, I'm not going to complain. The pack has plenty of other cool parts to use.

[zakkpaz]

i know its got to annoy frizz and Denny, but I like the fact that everyone's coming up with ideas. the best thing about this mods is that none of the parts are single use, unlike some other historical reaction mods.

anyway it seems like the most useful thing for expanding Saturn V usefulness would be the C-5N stage with a NERVA engine, it wouldn't requiter to much work and would add just enough Delta V for maned launch to Duna or Eve

[NathanKell]

GoldForest: Nova was actually the name for the inhouse Saturn-like booster NASA was developing while Von Braun's ABMA team was developing Saturn ("the one after Jupiter"). They had the same performance. When Saturn was picked, Nova then became the name for post-Saturn megaboosters. An interesting note about that picture: note how LOR clearly hadn't won yet; the Apollo CSM is shown in direct ascent configuration with its retrograde / landing stage below it. It may also be back when they were still planning to put a Centaur on top of the S-IVB and below the CSM.

That reminds me Frizzank. How about this: why not embrace FASA's "might have been" side and do *alternate* Apollos instead? The GE Apollo D-2 ("America's Soyuz") and Martin M410 are both really amazing Apollos, each of which would probably have been better, long term, than the (essentially) Max Faget's-word-is-law one we got.

GE Apollo D-2.

Martin M-410. (Right side: Lunar landing variant with retrograde / landing stage below the service module.

Note that the front isn't a capsule, it's a lifting body:

[MaverickSawyer]

i know its got to annoy frizz and Denny, but I like the fact that everyone's coming up with ideas. the best thing about this mods is that none of the parts are single use, unlike some other historical reaction mods.

anyway it seems like the most useful thing for expanding Saturn V usefulness would be the C-5N stage with a NERVA engine, it wouldn't requiter to much work and would add just enough Delta V for maned launch to Duna or Eve

http://i.imgur.com/bq42v.jpg

Do you have a larger version of the lower right image? I want to make sure I'm reading that right...

[zakkpaz]

Do you have a larger version of the lower right image? I want to make sure I'm reading that right...

sadly no, but the only difference between it and the normal S-IVB is the engine