[1.12.*] Deadly Reentry v7.9.0 The Barbie Edition, Aug 5th, 2021

[Starwaster]

Does this have 5m heatshields?

One of the ADEPT shields (link on front pate) has one that undeployed is about 4m (slightly larger than 3.75m tank) and deploys out to almost 10m.

Other than that; Procedural Heat Shields. (part of the Procedural Parts mod)

[Surefoot]

Airbrakes in their essence don't have enough dragging area to decelerate the vehicle as fast as chutes do. You can confirm this visually.

Certainly, but every bit helps, also proper aibrakes will resist supersonic speeds and heating while those chutes even made out of gold foil will melt out quick. On previous versions i tried to build some with structural panels and infernal robotics, but oldFAR didnt account for them properly and the movable joint was too weak. I place a lot of hope into nuFAR and its voxelized model, hope it interacts the right way with moveable parts...

@Starwaster is the ADEPT shield still maintained and working in 1.0 ?

[Starwaster]

Certainly, but every bit helps, also proper aibrakes will resist supersonic speeds and heating while those chutes even made out of gold foil will melt out quick. On previous versions i tried to build some with structural panels and infernal robotics, but oldFAR didnt account for them properly and the movable joint was too weak. I place a lot of hope into nuFAR and its voxelized model, hope it interacts the right way with moveable parts...

@Starwaster is the ADEPT shield still maintained and working in 1.0 ?

See the ADEPT thread, towards the back. I posted a MM styled patch that will make them compatible with 1.0, stock heating. When I release DRE, I'll probably have a DRE specific patch for them.

[Svm420]

Certainly, but every bit helps, also proper aibrakes will resist supersonic speeds and heating while those chutes even made out of gold foil will melt out quick. On previous versions i tried to build some with structural panels and infernal robotics, but oldFAR didnt account for them properly and the movable joint was too weak. I place a lot of hope into nuFAR and its voxelized model, hope it interacts the right way with moveable parts...

@Starwaster is the ADEPT shield still maintained and working in 1.0 ?

Thats not true at all ferram has stated oldFAR accounted for exposed parts changing. Try it by getting in a stable low altitude flight and reach your max vel. Put landing gear out and your speed drops. It accounts for shape changes.

[Starwaster]

Thats not true at all ferram has stated oldFAR accounted for exposed parts changing. Try it by getting in a stable low altitude flight and reach your max vel. Put landing gear out and your speed drops. It accounts for shape changes.

It may have been supposed to be that way, but it is very true that there were some parts that FAR did NOT recognize as having changed shape.

A prime example being DRE's inflatable shield. The stock animation module had (and still has) problems with it, FAR had problems with it and the new Aero system in 1.0 has problems with it. For both FAR and KSP 1.0 Aero, the solution was the same. Deploy, Quicksave, Quickload.

In 0.90 you can also see this in the VAB. Use FAR's analysis tools on the inflatable then inflate it (still in the VAB). The profile remains the same. Save as a craft then reload the craft (you can do this with the inflatable as the sole part). Only after reloading is FAR able to recognize that something had changed. I was in the process of creating some special configs to deal with the situation but I don't remember if I ever updated with them.

In any case, I asked someone to take a look at the inflatable and we'll see if it can be fixed.

[Hodo]

Is DRE working for 1.0.2? I know I could read and see but just wondering didnt see anything dating back to the 2nd of May.

[Starwaster]

Not yet, I'm working on it. What I have is mostly workable but not yet ready for release. I have to make sure passive shields like inflatables and non-ablative will work well because they wont have a dedicated shield module at all.

[futrtrubl]

Are you touching how engine heat works with newDRE? I was just wondering if it might be better for engine heat to affect skin temperature instead of part temperature.

[Starwaster]

I'll make sure engines aren't negatively impacted but that's all I'm planning for them right now

Edit:

BTW, the possibility does exist that you may have to jettison a shield because it has soaked up too much heat which is now conducting into the interior of your ship faster than it can convect and radiate away

Edited May 5, 2015 by Starwaster

[futrtrubl]

BTW, the possibility does exist that you may have to jettison a shield because it has soaked up too much heat which is now conducting into the interior of your ship faster than it can convect and radiate away

Just like reality. Awesome!

Yeah, engines are complicated. Or rather can be with thing like regenerative cooling.

[jrandom]

BTW, the possibility does exist that you may have to jettison a shield because it has soaked up too much heat which is now conducting into the interior of your ship faster than it can convect and radiate away

So... that would give us a reason to make layers of shields! Like a shark-tooth artichoke!

... that has to be my weirdest analogy ever.

[drtedastro]

I'll make sure engines aren't negatively impacted but that's all I'm planning for them right now

Edit:

BTW, the possibility does exist that you may have to jettison a shield because it has soaked up too much heat which is now conducting into the interior of your ship faster than it can convect and radiate away

Sounds great starwaster...

Looking forward to getting my hands on this...

Best of luck and cheers for all of your work..

[Mighty1]

I loved this mod in 0.xx versions and this may be a stupid question so bash me if you like but... With the new 1.0.x heat and heatshields how will DRE be different from stock? Is there a valid reason in installing it?

[smunisto]

I loved this mod in 0.xx versions and this may be a stupid question so bash me if you like but... With the new 1.0.x heat and heatshields how will DRE be different from stock? Is there a valid reason in installing it?

Like all things SQUAD in the past when they decided to implement people's mods in KSP - the heating model they implemented is half-cooked with blood still dripping out of it. Even at 120% heating and FAR the only way to actually get in danger of running out of Ablator or destroy your craft with overheating is if you intentionally do it.

DRE, like FAR and some other mods, will always offer a much higher quality of implementation than stock. You can also paraphrase the previous statement as: "It will make the game harder than Stock", rather than "SQUAD sucks".

[Quiana]

Like all things SQUAD in the past when they decided to implement people's mods in KSP - the heating model they implemented is half-cooked with blood still dripping out of it. Even at 120% heating and FAR the only way to actually get in danger of running out of Ablator or destroy your craft with overheating is if you intentionally do it.

DRE, like FAR and some other mods, will always offer a much higher quality of implementation than stock. You can also paraphrase the previous statement as: "It will make the game harder than Stock", rather than "SQUAD sucks".

We could give them a little credit, as it is the heating method itself is relatively what we wanted. What they forgot to accommodate (or purposely left out) is the very reason heat-shields exist. Skin heating. Their model accurately depicts how general heating would work, distributing through the mass of the craft. It's only during the re-entry phases that this model fails to work as it applies heat until the entire mass is heated to failure, rather than what Star is working on where it will calculate the failure of the outer skin which would in turn more than often destroy the parts during reheating. This is why we still need DRE, but we can use the stock model for the most part in general heating applications. I'm sure there will be others who hook into the radiator concepts for heat management to a much better degree than Squad foresaw.

[xXIndestructibleEVAXx]

Hey, how is development going? This is one of the last three mods that I'm waiting to update before I play. Not trying to rush you, tho, you're doing great work here.

[Starwaster]

Like all things SQUAD in the past when they decided to implement people's mods in KSP - the heating model they implemented is half-cooked with blood still dripping out of it. Even at 120% heating and FAR the only way to actually get in danger of running out of Ablator or destroy your craft with overheating is if you intentionally do it.

Those aren't fair statements to make. Yes, the current stock implementation is lacking, but really only in one area. Aside from that, for the most part it is a reasonably accurate model of heat for a game. There's also (and I apologize for saying this but...) there's a certain amount of ignorance involved which I don't feel free to dispel but you really don't know what you're talking about here

I loved this mod in 0.xx versions and this may be a stupid question so bash me if you like but... With the new 1.0.x heat and heatshields how will DRE be different from stock? Is there a valid reason in installing it?

The stock system has a lot going for it but even taking into account slow reentry speeds that are common for stock Kerbin, it doesn't raise temperatures of a craft's parts nearly as much as it should be. As mentioned previously, this is because a part's entire mass is involved when it should instead be using a small portion of it.

Hey, how is development going? This is one of the last three mods that I'm waiting to update before I play. Not trying to rush you, tho, you're doing great work here.

Sorry that things are taking me longer than I anticipated. Development is proceeding and at least 90% of the code is actually done. Things got slowed down a bit moving over to a new system that will allow ferram4 and I to override the Flight Integrator that is responsible for aero-thermo dynamics without either of us accidentally interfering with the other's work. That system is complete and both of our code bases are utilizing it now. Right now I'm engaged in trying to complete the remaining 10% of code that DRE needs, finish with the config file work that will modify individual parts (i.e. converting the original config work over to the new system) and track down a possible bug where rockets explode on the pad after reversion to launch or VAB. (which I think is DRE but might have been something else...)

[xXIndestructibleEVAXx]

Good to hear! This, FAR, and Persistant Rotation are the only mods I'm waiting to update!

[LORDPrometheus]

Glad to hear an update is in the works after this I only need FAR and Remote tech

[Mighty1]

I tried the new heat and shield system in stock and all i can say is that i am looking forward to the release of this mod. I thought that it would go obsolete but no, it is hanging on with awesomeness it provides.

[UnanimousCoward]

Glad to hear an update is in the works after this I only need FAR and Remote tech

Remote Tech is updated now.

Personally, I'm waiting on this, FAR, and the remaining Near Future mods before I start a serious career. (KAX, B9, KW, KSPX, MkIV spaceplane, EVE, Scatterer and the new KSPRC would all be nice as well...)

[Starwaster]

Status report:

Integrating past features such as G Force damage and fire damage.

(G Force damage is integrated and working properly. Many Kerbals... died.... to bring you this information)

Also tweaking ablation settings...

[Clythoris]

(G Force damage is integrated and working properly. Many Kerbals... died.... to bring you this information)

You experimented on the cute lizard aliens? Monster!

[jrandom]

You experimented on the cute lizard aliens? Monster!

They were genetically engineered to like being experimented on!

[Astrospeak]

Even at 120% heating and FAR the only way to actually get in danger of running out of Ablator or destroy your craft with overheating is if you intentionally do it.

DRE, like FAR and some other mods, will always offer a much higher quality of implementation than stock. You can also paraphrase the previous statement as: "It will make the game harder than Stock", rather than "SQUAD sucks".

On another thread, there's a very tiny tweak to stock that seems to make 120% feel nice and deadly… except for the thermometer memory leak, I'm really happy with the (slightly tweaked) stock thermal mechanics, although I'll probably try out DRE to compare.