[1.12.*] Deadly Reentry v7.9.0 The Barbie Edition, Aug 5th, 2021

[blu3wolf]

Are you familiar with Kelvin temperature scale? 300 K would be 27°C or 80°F. That's a room temperature basically.

Fixed that for you.

[Ser]

Are your part flashing red or do they keep glowing red ?

If they flash it is certainly a bug with F10 disabled.

But if they stay red it might be because these parts are actually really hot and then they glow a little even with F10 disabled, this is intended and stock.

I might be wrong though.

It's glowing constantly. It's not stock because when removing DR and loading the save the glowing's gone. Bringing DR back and the glowing appears again.

Seems like it appears only when Temperature gauges are on. But switching them off doesn't remove the glow.

[Starwaster]

Re: ModularFlightIntegrator / FAR issues. This was my fault. DRE was being compiled against the ModularFlightIntegrator project files instead of the compiled dll that's distributed from Sarbian's site (this is what CKAN uses) and with FAR. AFAIK that shouldn't have caused issues but did. Next update will correct this. (

Under some conditions when pressing F10 (enabling Temperature Gauges) and disabling them, the gauges themself hide but the vessel's wings and control surfaces are still highlighted.

Easy reproducing.

http://i.imgur.com/3vYlXUT.png

Stock KSP issue; nothing I can do about it but AFAIK, next KSP round of fixes will include the the temperature gauge so they should get this as well.

Ok if Ksp is measuring in F rather than C it makes perfectly sense. But in this case I don't get wy it's colored as dark red in the thermal Debugger.

Exept Kerbals have a brodelt visual spectrum in the red wavelength of course ������

Besides the issue that the fairings cooking parts inside stays. But if I understood Starwasters post that is on the todo list. Now it makes sense that a launch at night works perfectly with Dr and in daytime the payload becomes frech fried kerbal stew

KSP measures temperature in Kelvin so 300 K is ~80 F. Which is pretty damned hot especially at night, but you're on the equator so what can you expect.

Re: fairings

The fairing issue that I'm correcting only takes care of parts not being shielded against convection. Fairings don't actually 'radiate' heat to other object; no KSP parts do. Radiated heat just vanishes into the environment. Parts in the fairing will still pick up temperature increases through conduction, so the entire vehicle will eventually balance its heat out. This is mostly to cover parts cooking in fairings during flight because they were thought to be unshielded.d

- - - Updated - - -

Re: ModularFlightIntegrator / FAR issues. This was my fault. DRE was being compiled against the ModularFlightIntegrator project files instead of the compiled dll that's distributed from Sarbian's site (this is what CKAN uses) and with FAR. AFAIK that shouldn't have caused issues but did. Next update will correct this. (

Under some conditions when pressing F10 (enabling Temperature Gauges) and disabling them, the gauges themself hide but the vessel's wings and control surfaces are still highlighted.

Easy reproducing.

http://i.imgur.com/3vYlXUT.png

Stock KSP issue; nothing I can do about it but AFAIK, next KSP round of fixes will include the the temperature gauge so they should get this as well.

(I refer only to the glow persisting after removing the gauges, which is a bug. Parts glowing on the launchpad are because they are half or higher of their maxTemp. I'll do another pass over the temps and make sure everything is above 600 maxTemp which should stop the gauges)

Ok if Ksp is measuring in F rather than C it makes perfectly sense. But in this case I don't get wy it's colored as dark red in the thermal Debugger.

Exept Kerbals have a brodelt visual spectrum in the red wavelength of course ������

Besides the issue that the fairings cooking parts inside stays. But if I understood Starwasters post that is on the todo list. Now it makes sense that a launch at night works perfectly with Dr and in daytime the payload becomes frech fried kerbal stew

KSP measures temperature in Kelvin so 300 K is ~80 F. Which is pretty damned hot especially at night, but you're on the equator so what can you expect.

Re: fairings

The fairing issue that I'm correcting only takes care of parts not being shielded against convection. Fairings don't actually 'radiate' heat to other object; no KSP parts do. Radiated heat just vanishes into the environment. Parts in the fairing will still pick up temperature increases through conduction, so the entire vehicle will eventually balance its heat out. This is mostly to cover parts cooking in fairings during flight because they were thought to be unshielded.d

[Enceos]

I did, with default of 40 convection and my peak was 1300+

I didn't set it to 100. So I was very nearly getting at 40 what you got at 100. That's why I needed to see the MM cache file next, to see if anything was making your setup different from mine, and your experience different from mine.

Are you sure you were testing it with default values of KSP 1.0.2 in Physics.cfg?

I changed some values there now, and it still has a huge impact on reentry temperatures.

-- update --

Also, did you note that below 28km alt temperature starts dropping?

One more thing, since DRE tweaks down maxTemps, it should also tweak down the heatProduction of Sepratrons and Vernor engines (at least Squad ones). Currently if 6 sepratrons are blowing on a fuel tank for more than 1.5 sec, fuel tank explodes.

Edited May 15, 2015 by Enceos

[LostOblivion]

Hey, Starwaster. I just noticed that in the part.cfg for the heat shields in DRE it says "pyrolysisLossFactor 1000 // Needs to be cut to 1/10th for DRE", that is without the = between the label and the value. I see you set this to 1/10th of the original value in the ModuleManager code anyway, but thought I'd let you know.

[Starwaster]

Are you sure you were testing it with default values of KSP 1.0.2 in Physics.cfg?

I changed some values there now, and it still has a huge impact on reentry temperatures.

Physics.cfg values are overridden by DRE. Some of those values don't appear in the debugging menu. If you changed something in the file that is overridden then the changes had no real impact. Some relevant values may not be getting overridden and some that are don't appear in the debug menu. (such as densityExponent which is being used to force reentry heating to begin earlier and higher)

Hey, Starwaster. I just noticed that in the part.cfg for the heat shields in DRE it says "pyrolysisLossFactor 1000 // Needs to be cut to 1/10th for DRE", that is without the = between the label and the value. I see you set this to 1/10th of the original value in the ModuleManager code anyway, but thought I'd let you know.

Thanks, the missing = is obviously a typo. Corrected for the next update.

The 1/10th factor is obsolete as of the most recent update. I'm keeping the default of 1000 or shields will deplete too fast and possibly not dissipate enough heat.

[Enceos]

@Starwaster Also, did you note that below 28km alt temperature starts dropping even while the speed is above 2200m/s?

One more thing, since DRE tweaks down maxTemps, it should also tweak down the heatProduction of Sepratrons and Vernor engines (at least Squad ones). Currently if 6 sepratrons are blowing on a fuel tank for more than 1.5 sec, fuel tank explodes.

[Starwaster]

@Starwaster Also, did you note that below 28km alt temperature starts dropping even while the speed is above 2200m/s?

Nope, haven't noticed that. Either the information isn't valid for the build I'm using (which update you'll see soon) or there's something else happening in that situation and I can't comment on it because I don't have sufficient context. What you see might be normal or it might not. There are 3+1 heat models at work every frame and they have to work at a faster rate then real life because Kerbin is so ridiculously tiny.

One more thing, since DRE tweaks down maxTemps, it should also tweak down the heatProduction of Sepratrons and Vernor engines (at least Squad ones). Currently if 6 sepratrons are blowing on a fuel tank for more than 1.5 sec, fuel tank explodes.

Fuel tanks are getting a +200 buff across the board. Maybe that will be enough to save your fuel tanks but I can't help feeling that maybe people who point six blow torches at their fuel tanks should expect a bad day. Have you tried NOT pointing six blowtorches at your fuel tank? (ok that was a little sarcastic, but remember Challenger... these things are dangerous and you should take care with them)

[jstnj]

Fuel tanks are getting a +200 buff across the board. Maybe that will be enough to save your fuel tanks but I can't help feeling that maybe people who point six blow torches at their fuel tanks should expect a bad day. Have you tried NOT pointing six blowtorches at your fuel tank? (ok that was a little sarcastic, but remember Challenger... these things are dangerous and you should take care with them)

I've always abided by the "no more than 7 blowtorches" rule when dealing with volatile and flammable fuel tanks.

[Starwaster]

Update: 7.0.3 Release Candidate 1 (pre-release so it shouldn't show up on CKAN)

So, the upshot of this is that things are going to buildup heat much faster so be careful what's pointing into the airstream. That first item right there is why this is marked Pre-Release. There's probably going to be consequences and I'm probably going to have to do an exemption for small parts.

• Calculate what pecentage of skin is actually facing the shockwave and use only that percent for thermalMass
  
• Add OnDestroy() and null the FlightIntegrator cache
  
• Added additional check for part.ShieldedFromAistream
  
• Buffed fuel tank maxTemp
  
• Fixed typo in DRE heat shields
  

https://github.com/Starwaster/DeadlyReentry/releases/tag/v7.0.3.RC1

Edited May 15, 2015 by Starwaster

[Clythoris]

https://github.com/Starwaster/DeadlyReentry/releases/tag/v7.0.3.RC1

I spotted the newest release about half an hour ago, but it still cannot be downloaded [except for the source code].

[Starwaster]

I spotted the newest release about half an hour ago, but it still cannot be downloaded [except for the source code].

How do I hate Github. Let me count the ways...

ok, take 2.... trying this again....

Edit: Ok, fixed.

To be fair, the fault wasn't entirely with GitHub. I had attached the file and it was uploading but I was busy making sure everything was in the release notes that I wanted so I didn't notice GitHub complaining about the file.

The solution? I renamed it .... to the EXACT same file name. Exactly the same. For some reason, adding things to zip files through Windows, something happens to them where Github has trouble telling what file it is. Since all I did was remove then add the .zip extension back... well whatever. Fixed now.

Edited May 15, 2015 by Starwaster

[Clythoris]

How do I hate Github. Let me count the ways...

ok, take 2.... trying this again....

Working now.

[Hodo]

Haven't tested the current version which came out this morning to me. But the last version if I revert back to launch the craft instantly overheats and explodes on reload. But if I return to SPH then launch after that it is fine. It is like it retains its previous speed before the revert happened.

[Starwaster]

Haven't tested the current version which came out this morning to me. But the last version if I revert back to launch the craft instantly overheats and explodes on reload. But if I return to SPH then launch after that it is fine. It is like it retains its previous speed before the revert happened.

I added code to try to eliminate that by uncaching the flight integrator when a part / PartModule is destroyed. If the problem is because of data being cached, that should take care of it. Unfortunately I can't know that for sure until enough eyes are on the problem and reporting if it happens again.

[Svm420]

So I was able to get to orbit. The the return since I am using a resized system orbital seed was 4400ish m/s. From an apoapsis of 76km I set my periapsis to 33km. Had sounding rocket experiments, thermo and barometers surface attached. This was in the Almach ballistic capsule from Tantares. I had a parachute on top of the capsule facing retrograde during reentry. Well got to about 40ish km and the parachute overheats even though I though it should be protected from the airstream do to facing away I watch the thermal debug read out and convection was high on the parachute till loss. Anyway survived re etry without using any of my 75 ablator I brought with me. In fact the capsule temp never got above 300 and skin was usually a little lower somehow. Most of the reentry the skin was 6. something K. So something maybe off. Quick question during game creation the slder for re entry heat. Does that effect DR? Maybe that is the difference we are all seeing. I had mine to 90%.

[Starwaster]

So I was able to get to orbit. The the return since I am using a resized system orbital seed was 4400ish m/s. From an apoapsis of 76km I set my periapsis to 33km. Had sounding rocket experiments, thermo and barometers surface attached. This was in the Almach ballistic capsule from Tantares. I had a parachute on top of the capsule facing retrograde during reentry. Well got to about 40ish km and the parachute overheats even though I though it should be protected from the airstream do to facing away I watch the thermal debug read out and convection was high on the parachute till loss. Anyway survived re etry without using any of my 75 ablator I brought with me. In fact the capsule temp never got above 300 and skin was usually a little lower somehow. Most of the reentry the skin was 6. something K. So something maybe off. Quick question during game creation the slder for re entry heat. Does that effect DR? Maybe that is the difference we are all seeing. I had mine to 90%.

Yes, that will affect Deadly Reentry. Remember that it's tied into the stock thermal system. It uses the same physics globals and those get scaled by difficulty.

[Svm420]

Yes, that will affect Deadly Reentry. Remember that it's tied into the stock thermal system. It uses the same physics globals and those get scaled by difficulty.

I am setting it to 1 aka 100% effects and will report back with results Thanks!

[Starwaster]

Ok, update time on the issue of parts exploding when loading in. This is very obviously not fixed yet in the last update but I am able to reproduce it on a regular basis.

Loading a ship on the ground when the current vessel is in orbit reproduces pretty regularly. So if you're going to load in a vessel try to do it from the space center.

It is not caused by cached Flight Integrators. (that was disappointing because there's a number of ways that could be fixed)

It is not caused by cache PartThermalData objects (also disappointing)

So I'm still looking into this. The explosion definitely happens in DRE code when it looks at skin temperature. Which doesn't check the cheat options for ignoring maxTemp. (next update will check that for sure to allow further workaround or troubleshooting)

[almagnus1]

So after playing around with deadly reentry, I notice that engines tend to have a very short lifespan as I can't figure out how to cool them down, so once an engine fires, and it's generated all the heat it can stand, it explodes.

While this generally isn't a problem with rockets, it has lead to some interesting situations with aircraft... and then I installed FAR, and this went from amusing yet annoying to automated parts cannon cause engine explosion => aircraft breakup.

So how does one cool off the engines, and what are some tips to help me stop blowing stuff up?

[Svm420]

So after playing around with deadly reentry, I notice that engines tend to have a very short lifespan as I can't figure out how to cool them down, so once an engine fires, and it's generated all the heat it can stand, it explodes.

While this generally isn't a problem with rockets, it has lead to some interesting situations with aircraft... and then I installed FAR, and this went from amusing yet annoying to automated parts cannon cause engine explosion => aircraft breakup.

So how does one cool off the engines, and what are some tips to help me stop blowing stuff up?

What version of DR are you using?

[Sokar408]

I apologize if this has been addressed and I have missed it, but DR's heat shields seem to have another type of Ablator, then the stock ones. Does this mean that I should only use the ones from DR, or how does these work together?

[Svm420]

I apologize if this has been addressed and I have missed it, but DR's heat shields seem to have another type of Ablator, then the stock ones. Does this mean that I should only use the ones from DR, or how does these work together?

Both work perfectly!

[Starwaster]

Hah! Found the cause of the problem. In the very first frame, I'm checking to see if skinTemperature is initialized already. If not it grabs it from vessel.externalTemperature. Somewhere along the way it's grabbing the velocity from KrakensBane.GetFrameVelocity which is probably using data from the previous frame.

So, problem will be fixed in update sometime tonight.

@almagnus1, make sure you have the latest update. An earlier update had some obsolete engine heat production values

[Sokar408]

Both work perfectly!

But then why add a new resource? Also the 1.25 shield from DR has twice the AblatorShielding as the 1.25 stock shield has of Ablator. Does this mean that AblatorShielding is half as effective at dissipating heat?