[1.12.*] Deadly Reentry v7.9.0 The Barbie Edition, Aug 5th, 2021

[Yarbrough08]

I have been away for a while and realized a lot has changed; however, I was curious if certain variables were still available..

I was curious about:
direction, reflective, as well as loss and dissipation curves (since I noticed the lossExp which I would assume is the loss exponent, but I prefer not to ass/u/me).

[Starwaster]

[quote name='Yarbrough08']I have been away for a while and realized a lot has changed; however, I was curious if certain variables were still available..

I was curious about:
direction, reflective, as well as loss and dissipation curves (since I noticed the lossExp which I would assume is the loss exponent, but I prefer not to ass/u/me).[/QUOTE]


Sounds like you are referring to the heat shield module. As of KSP 1.0, Deadly Reentry no longer implements its own heat shield. Instead, it extends the stock heat shield. I don't think ANY of the old parameters are valid anymore. But especially not reflection or direction. Those were used primarily for space plane types which do not use the heat shield module (not in stock and not in DRE) and instead have their part thermals modified to allow them to survive reentry. (stock does it by increasing thermal mass so that they can soak in extra heat and increasing emissivity so that they will emit heat better. DRE does the opposite and reduces thermal mass so that space plane skin acts more like space shuttle tiles)

Currently we're still not updated for 1.0.5 as I was busy with some Real Fuels coding, but now I'm done there and will pick up DRE again.

(it is still possible to install the current version but the plugin is not fully functional and will throw exceptions. The configs will work and preliminary testing of them suggests they should mostly work with 1.0.5 but some changes to conductivity were made that will likely need attention)

[Yarbrough08]

@Starwaster: Yes, I was referring ModuleHeatShield. In my 2-Kerbal pod I had been relying on those parameters to keep the pod and the heat shield in one piece instead of two separate pieces. I had read in the OP that DRE was only tweaking stock parameters to make re-entry more interesting, but I also noticed that in the current version the included DRE heatshields still uses ModuleHeatShield so I was curious. I suppose I will have to slice my pod in two - I'm sure Jeb will be happy :P ...

Thank you for your quick response..

[Starwaster]

New update for Deadly Reentry. This is 7.3.0 Release Candidate 1

https://github.com/Starwaster/DeadlyReentry/releases/tag/v7.3.0-rc1

7.3.0 RC1 Changelog

• KSP 1.0.5 compatibility update
• Code cleanup of extraneous DRE 7.1.0 skin remnants.
• Fire damage reinstated
• Repairing of damage now requires an engineer on EVA - the more badly damaged the part, the greater the skill required.
• Damaged parts have lowered tolerance to further overheating and may break loose easier. (skinMaxTemp, breakingForce and breakingTorque are all reduced)
• Part configuration patches tweaked.
• It's still the Melificent Edition.
• Almost reinstated DRE specific menu options.

[Nnimrod]

3 hours ago, Starwaster said:

New update for Deadly Reentry. This is 7.3.0 Release Candidate 1

https://github.com/Starwaster/DeadlyReentry/releases/tag/v7.3.0-rc1

7.3.0 RC1 Changelog

• KSP 1.0.5 compatibility update
• Code cleanup of extraneous DRE 7.1.0 skin remnants.
• Fire damage reinstated
• Repairing of damage now requires an engineer on EVA - the more badly damaged the part, the greater the skill required.
• Damaged parts have lowered tolerance to further overheating and may break loose easier. (skinMaxTemp, breakingForce and breakingTorque are all reduced)
• Part configuration patches tweaked.
• It's still the Melificent Edition.
• Almost reinstated DRE specific menu options.

Awesome! One step closer to RP-0 being ready.

[Starwaster]

btw folks, the point of doing this as a prerelease is to test things. Certain things might need rebalancing.

A rule of thumb that I've used for skinMaxTemp is that skinMaxTemp / 0.85 = <assumed material melting point> (not flammability since I'm assuming that there won't be much if any flammable material on the outside of anything meant for hypersonic operation, be it planes or reentry vehicles, so in spite of it being 'fire damage' it's probably really melting)

Reentry I'm not TOO concerned about. Shields survive just fine, including deployables I've tested. Ballutes work. (see front page for the ballute link). Planes work just fine as long as you keep their reentry shallow and 30-40 degree pitch up.

So that leaves ascent. If things routinely catch fire during ascent then I need to know what it was, how fast you were going, altitude and if possible convection / radiation fluxes and skin temperature. Try to rule out user error on your own; if you think maybe you were going too fast then you probably were

[Phineas Freak]

Small bug report: when reloading the Module Manager database, Deadly Reentry duplicates the stock toolbar icon.

Before reloading:

Spoiler

<IMAGE REMOVED BY USER>

After reloading:

Spoiler

<IMAGE REMOVED BY USER>

KSP version: 1.0.5.1028

Installed mods: Deadly Reentry [7.3.0 RC1], Module Manager [2.6.13]

Output log

Edited November 16, 2016 by Phineas Freak
Remove image and log file links

[Benji]

Hi.

I'm having extreme trouble with my reentry with a rss/ro - deadly re-entry moded 1.0.5 .

I tried a 2m and a 3m heatshield under a mk1 pod.

Coming from LEO (150 km) and a periap at 65 km. At an altitude of 70 km only 10 (pieces ? ) of the ablator are used, then the burning starts, then quickly the heatshield explodes. A second later the pod is on fire and explodes.

I tried the procedural heatshield. But it explodes at about 1000 K.

I also set the reentry-heating in the ksp menu to 0 %. But still. Everything explodes between 64 an 62 km.

 

Sadly my career game is ended by these circumstances. All money was burned in simulations.

[MAV3RICK]

Hey @Starwaster, could we get this updated in CKAN as well please? Many thanks!

[NathanKell]

CKAN does not index pre-releases. Once enough people have reported not having problems with this pre-release, I'm sure @Starwaster will be willing to make it a full release, with any needed fixes.

[Naten]

Huh, seems like my capsule without an external shield (the mk 1 capsule with 100 ablative shield) heats up really fast and soon explodes during reentry. Way faster than before; I only needed the shield when I was coming back from the Mun!

[Starwaster]

1 hour ago, Naten said:

Huh, seems like my capsule without an external shield (the mk 1 capsule with 100 ablative shield) heats up really fast and soon explodes during reentry. Way faster than before; I only needed the shield when I was coming back from the Mun!

By design, the Mk1's integrated shield isn't intended to for anything except LKO.

(that said, I've been able to survive a return from the Mun while testing this update and gave up trying to  ensure failure... so it is possible, just really hard. And I'm happy with it that way)

(And yes, @MAV3RICK, @NathanKell is correct, it's not on CKAN because it's currently in pre-release status. In fact, I'm not happy with fire damage; it happens too fast and needs some reworking. I think once that's done I can take it out of pre-release)

 

Edited December 11, 2015 by Starwaster

[Naten]

I mean when returning from LKO. in a new career mode my first orbital mission came into the atmo, and heated up to red really fast. I checked the ablator, only about 15 left, and going rown quick.

[Starwaster]

Then you were probably too shallow

Edited December 12, 2015 by Starwaster

[MAV3RICK]

10 hours ago, Starwaster said:

(And yes, @MAV3RICK, @NathanKell is correct, it's not on CKAN because it's currently in pre-release status. In fact, I'm not happy with fire damage; it happens too fast and needs some reworking. I think once that's done I can take it out of pre-release)

Ah, understand now. Many thanks!

[Starwaster]

Oops sorry missed a few posts here:

On 12/8/2015, 8:32:47, Phineas Freak said:

Small bug report: when reloading the Module Manager database, Deadly Reentry duplicates the stock toolbar icon.

Before reloading:

  Reveal hidden contents

After reloading:

  Reveal hidden contents

KSP version: 1.0.5.1028

Installed mods: Deadly Reentry [7.3.0 RC1], Module Manager [2.6.13]

Output log

 

 

Yeah I think I know why that is. I'll take a look at it.

On 12/9/2015, 5:17:39, Benji said:

Hi.

I'm having extreme trouble with my reentry with a rss/ro - deadly re-entry moded 1.0.5 .

I tried a 2m and a 3m heatshield under a mk1 pod.

Coming from LEO (150 km) and a periap at 65 km. At an altitude of 70 km only 10 (pieces ? ) of the ablator are used, then the burning starts, then quickly the heatshield explodes. A second later the pod is on fire and explodes.

I tried the procedural heatshield. But it explodes at about 1000 K.

I also set the reentry-heating in the ksp menu to 0 %. But still. Everything explodes between 64 an 62 km.

 

Sadly my career game is ended by these circumstances. All money was burned in simulations.

@Benji Ok this is what I'm talking about when I say too shallow. That is WAY too shallow and dramatically increases your total heat loading. You're spending too much time in the upper atmosphere where you're experiencing significant heating and not enough braking. Make your periapsis 20km. That should serve you well in most circumstances over Kerbin. And probably Laythe too. (Eve you'll want higher because the dense atmosphere means earlier and greater braking forces)

[Naten]

12 hours ago, Starwaster said:

Then you were probably too shallow

 

Any shallower and I would be in orbit.

[Starwaster]

8 hours ago, Naten said:

Any shallower and I would be in orbit.

Sigh.

BEHOLD.

Note the image below. See how there's narrow corridor? Imagine your capsule is flying along that corridor. See one side of the corridor (higher) where it says 'overshoot boundary'? That's shallow! You're not getting enough braking. (drag too low) and depending on circumstance will fly back out of the atmosphere and either off into deep space (if orbit is actually hyperbolic) or have to make another reentry pass. Or, worse case scenario? You burn up because you slowly baked to death in the upper atmosphere.

See undershoot boundary? That's steep. You encounter greater drag forces a lot sooner. That can also result in burning up if the shield heats up faster than it can shed heat. That's one possibility but another likely scenario is that your Kerbals can suffer lethal G-forces. ('deceleration too high' as it says)

Stock Kerbin is so forgiving that I'm not even sure there is a corridor you need to hit. (it's not a tangible thing in either case). With Deadly Reentry, from LKO or a Mun/Minmus return, your target periapsis is ~20-30 km. The higher you go towards 30, the tougher things are going to be. Above 30 and you're probably going to burn up your shield and not have anything left. The lower you make your periapsis, the more G-forces your Kerbals will suffer. (if you aim right for the ground like it says for 'deceleration too high' and they'll be crushed into a thin green and red paste. It won't be an open casket funeral)

 

edit: 20km isn't 'engraved in stone btw, it's really about the angle you come in at. I'd say the corridor is 10-30 and 20 is right in the middle. But even that could be too shallow if you're returning from a very low altitude. So the point is you want to get to where the sir is thicker and you can get to serious braking.  

Edited December 13, 2015 by Starwaster

[Benji]

18 hours ago, Starwaster said:

Oops sorry missed a few posts here:

 

Yeah I think I know why that is. I'll take a look at it.

@Benji Ok this is what I'm talking about when I say too shallow. That is WAY too shallow and dramatically increases your total heat loading. You're spending too much time in the upper atmosphere where you're experiencing significant heating and not enough braking. Make your periapsis 20km. That should serve you well in most circumstances over Kerbin. And probably Laythe too. (Eve you'll want higher because the dense atmosphere means earlier and greater braking forces)

Okai.
As I wrote. Kerbin is not the problem. It's Earth I'm dealing with.

So, I tried periapsae at 30, 20, 10, 5, -10 km.

 

But everything keeps exploding at about 64 km and 7 km/s.

Edited December 13, 2015 by Benji
Some Characters add to clarity.

[Starwaster]

2 hours ago, Benji said:

Okai.
As I wrote. Kerbin is not the problem. It's Earth I'm dealing with.

So, I tried periapsae at 30, 20, 10, 5, -10 km.

 

But everything keeps exploding at about 64 km and 7 km/s.

Crap ok, sorry... I somehow missed that it was RSS / RO and Earth.... (in spite of you having said so, and saying LEO and such ...) so your originally chosen PE was probably ok.

make sure that RO is updated to the latest version (10.6.0 as of this writing)

If it is and you're still having trouble then post in the RO thread because RO overrides DRE's shield settings.

[Naten]

16 hours ago, Starwaster said:

BEHOLD.

In versions before 1.0.5, I was able to safely reenter the atmosphere with this mod when I was returning from LKO. Now, the capsule begins losing the heat shield at a crazy rate before it even enters the mesosphere. I understand the window is small, but Kerbin's uppermost atmosphere shouldn't make it burn up almost instantly. In the image I posted, the capsule was returning from LKO, along a descent path that should've worked before, and it explodes before it even enters the stratosphere. It's not right, and based on the other posts, it's happening with RSS too.

[Starwaster]

2 hours ago, Naten said:

In versions before 1.0.5, I was able to safely reenter the atmosphere with this mod when I was returning from LKO. Now, the capsule begins losing the heat shield at a crazy rate before it even enters the mesosphere. I understand the window is small, but Kerbin's uppermost atmosphere shouldn't make it burn up almost instantly. In the image I posted, the capsule was returning from LKO, along a descent path that should've worked before, and it explodes before it even enters the stratosphere. It's not right, and based on the other posts, it's happening with RSS too.

THE other post is using RO which overrides DRE shield settings.

RSS is a special case and unless a player uses RSS without RO then I have to shift responsibility to RO which I exercise zero control over (in heat shield issues)

Edited December 13, 2015 by Starwaster

[Starwaster]

Deadly Reentry 7.3.1, Melificent Edition: The SIATPWWEFPD update.

Updating to 7.3.1 and making this a full release, so it should show up on CKAN whenever their crawler gets to indexing it.

https://github.com/Starwaster/DeadlyReentry/releases/tag/v7.3.1

Change Log!

v7.3.1 - The SIATPWWEFPD update.
* Added skill check for damage above 0.75 (requires engineer with skill level 5)
* No fire damage if CheatOptions.IgnoreMaxTemperature == true
* No G-Force damage if CheatOptions.UnbreakableJoints == true
* Only run toolbar code once. (addresses duplicates created when database reloaded)
* Tweaked Mk1 Pod thermals (max temp, heat shield) to address complaint that the pod is burning up too easily.
* Updated RSS fallback heat shield configs

v7.3.0
* KSP 1.0.5 compatibility update
* Code cleanup of extraneous DRE 7.1.0 skin remnants.
* Fire damage reinstated
* Repairing of damage now requires an engineer on EVA - the  more badly damaged the part, the greater the skill required.
* Damaged parts have lowered tolerance to further overheating and may break loose easier. (skinMaxTemp, breakingForce and breakingTorque are all reduced)
* Part configuration patches tweaked.
* It's still the Melificent Edition.
* Almost reinstated DRE specific menu options.

Edited December 14, 2015 by Starwaster

[Benji]

On 13.12.2015, 15:36:22, Starwaster said:

Crap ok, sorry... I somehow missed that it was RSS / RO and Earth.... (in spite of you having said so, and saying LEO and such ...) so your originally chosen PE was probably ok.

make sure that RO is updated to the latest version (10.6.0 as of this writing)

If it is and you're still having trouble then post in the RO thread because RO overrides DRE's shield settings.

As of RO 10.7 the issue is resolved. Nevertheless, thanks a lot.

[ThatOneBritishGuy...]

Pardon me for my ignorance, but can someone point me to some documentation on this mod. Looking over the changelog, there's been a lot of changes in th past two versions and I feel like I need to know what exactly this "fire damage" is (among other things). Thanks in advance for any help.