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Work-in-Progress [WIP] Design Thread

GusTurbo

By GusTurbo
in KSP1 The Spacecraft Exchange

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Rune

Rune

Posted
Posted
Hi Kurotenshi,

I have just started to update my constellation mission with the new wing parts.

Your ascent module payload lander shown looks to be a similar size to my one. So it will be what I have done here:

http://cloud-4.steampowered.com/ugc/532875304925862488/75BAC5C0925E404D7FE0945639184CE5775E73CB/

This is the new fairing for the propulsion stage but I just reused the same fairing for the aeroshell landers but shortened.

And for the craftsmen out there, can you spot why this faring was harder than it looks?

MJ

If I had to bet, I'd say the same reason I had problem with mine: the wings that would be easy to place like that in two halves generate lift and screw with the ascent, so you have to first build a two-part ring (whose dimensions are difficult to calculate, too) that you can attach the other kind of rectangular wings to. Did I get it right?

Rune. You sure did, looks very good.

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Majorjim!

Majorjim!

Posted
Posted
If I had to bet, I'd say the same reason I had problem with mine: the wings that would be easy to place like that in two halves generate lift and screw with the ascent, so you have to first build a two-part ring (whose dimensions are difficult to calculate, too) that you can attach the other kind of rectangular wings to. Did I get it right?

Rune. You sure did, looks very good.

LOL, yup you are right mate. I was too eager to show my fairing and I hadn't tested it properly.. :blush:

I was struggling to get the wings to line up so I made an off center frame from the bottom to the top of the payload so I could attach the wings so they where centered.

Turns out those wings are, as you said, not good for fairings! Huge explosions followed.

Yup the bottom (still off center) ring then the other type of wings seems the only way.

*Reminder to self* test before posting. :D

MJ

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Majorjim!

Majorjim!

Posted
Posted
For smaller fairings, I used structural panels to create attachment points for the panels. I beams were used instead for larger fairings.

Yeah been trying that. any kind of bottom ring of parts to build up from. Panels where so much easier!

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Majorjim!

Majorjim!

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Posted
I guess everything comes with a price :P Wings have less weight and result in lower part counts for fairings, but placement and aerodynamics complicates things. It's a worthwhile trade-off though, IMO

Yup, there's always a compromise..

I will make a faring for my constellation aeroshell landers and report back.

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Rune

Rune

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Yup, there's always a compromise..

I will make a faring for my constellation aeroshell landers and report back.

Those are going to see some wind in the direction that matters... I predict a fairing that wants to point to the sky instead of staying under the payload, I think. It might work to increase drag, though, if you can keep it stable with, say, more reaction wheels torque. It would be stable in principle, too, but only if things were shadowed by others in stock KSP (I ran a quick stability analysis in my head, might have gotten it wrong but I think it's an unstable configuration of forces).

For smaller fairings, I used structural panels to create attachment points for the panels. I beams were used instead for larger fairings.

I actually used cubic struts to get finer control on the distance and placement. And I only built a couple of "wings" around the decoupler that holds the fairing, you only need to get halfway to the last panel's position, no need to close the circle. I think I used something like three on each side to get a 3.75m straight fairing (no bulge). The best part about them is the thickness allows you to hide small defects, too.

Rune. Actually, if you don't care that your faring peels like a banana, you can always build with x8 symmetry from the tank itself much easier. But the best part about a fairing is how it opens up!

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Majorjim!

Majorjim!

Posted
Posted (edited)
Those are going to see some wind in the direction that matters... I predict a fairing that wants to point to the sky instead of staying under the payload, I think. It might work to increase drag, though, if you can keep it stable with, say, more reaction wheels torque. It would be stable in principle, too, but only if things were shadowed by others in stock KSP (I ran a quick stability analysis in my head, might have gotten it wrong but I think it's an unstable configuration of forces).

I'm not exactly sure what you are saying Rune. Are you talking about wind effects on a Duna bound aeroshell?

The payload will be pointed along its direction of travel for most of the reentry. If it causes odd effects I will stick to the panel fairing as it works so well and

zero wind effect.

Edited by Majorjim
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Rune

Rune

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Posted
I'm not exactly sure what you are saying Rune. Are you talking about wind effects on a Duna bound aeroshell?

The payload will be pointed along its direction of travel for most of the reentry. If it causes odd effects I will stick to the panel fairing as it works so well and

zero wind effect.

Yup, I meant at the end, when you have bled off most of the horizontal velocity, the fairing will be falling mostly horizontal, right? Or at least with an appreciable angle of attack. In those cases, they will see some air (the component of velocity perpendicular to the long axis, in this case vertical speed) and create lift. Anyhow, Duna's low air density, a few reaction wheels, and you shouldn't have much trouble. Perhaps the worst thing will be to get rid of them, since they will be lifting and the rest of the craft won't. The end result, if I get the force diagram right in my head, is half a fairing would like to stay on top during the descent, not under. Two halves should give symmetrical forces (additional drag only on the vertical axis! I think that's the good part) and solve it... ditch the top and bottom at the same time, maybe?

Rune. With separatrons! The effects on those looks really cool now.

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Majorjim!

Majorjim!

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Posted
Yup, I meant at the end, when you have bled off most of the horizontal velocity, the fairing will be falling mostly horizontal, right? Or at least with an appreciable angle of attack. In those cases, they will see some air (the component of velocity perpendicular to the long axis, in this case vertical speed) and create lift. Anyhow, Duna's low air density, a few reaction wheels, and you shouldn't have much trouble. Perhaps the worst thing will be to get rid of them, since they will be lifting and the rest of the craft won't. The end result, if I get the force diagram right in my head, is half a fairing would like to stay on top during the descent, not under. Two halves should give symmetrical forces (additional drag only on the vertical axis! I think that's the good part) and solve it... ditch the top and bottom at the same time, maybe?

Rune. With separatrons! The effects on those looks really cool now.

Yeah they are cool looking now!

I see what you mean. I was thinking that too. Only a test will tell. I changed out the wings for the other ones and no issues now.

Just need to choose how many separating pieces now. The animation I saw had the engine payload fairing separate into four. And three for the aeroshells.

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Redshift OTF

Redshift OTF

Posted
Posted

Oh yes, I'm liking that design a lot. I love how you've hidden the engines inside the housing. In case you didn't know you can hide almost all of the jet engine inside other structures. The thrust from a jet comes from the centre of the jet but is extremely thin, like the equivalent of 1 pixel thick so as long as that is showing the rest of the jet can be hidden.

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Gue__1

Gue__1

Posted
Posted

A start at a X-33 rocket/plane thingy. It is very early testing, might be a dead end :sticktongue:

It is supposed to have a vertical liftoff and land like a plane.

yDA8GOj.png

WuKxjBb.png

Is there a show content code in this forum, images are very big?

Gue

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SpaceXray

SpaceXray

Posted
Posted
A start at a X-33 rocket/plane thingy. It is very early testing, might be a dead end :sticktongue:

It is supposed to have a vertical liftoff and land like a plane.

http://i.imgur.com/yDA8GOj.png

http://i.imgur.com/WuKxjBb.png

Is there a show content code in this forum, images are very big?

Gue

Holy cr*p that is se*y as hell....

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ScriptKitt3h

ScriptKitt3h

Posted
Posted

E6vmLeE.png

gCocVwm.png

X-37B inspired spaceplane, launched on top of a rocket. However, I keep having issues when attempting to land (mainly in lack of glide control, and the fact that it drops like a rock at low alt.)

p7Gzbpt.png

If I can fix that issue, it might turn out as a great mini-shuttle (with a cargo bay to boot!)

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Majorjim!

Majorjim!

Posted
Posted
Looking good! But wouldn't you want more of a smooth joint with the nosecone on top?

Rune. Just my usual nitpicking so it is even more awesome when you are done with it :)

Thanks man. Yeah the top isn't finished yet.

Also the fairing will be moved inwards a little which will improve that a bit.

When done it should be the same width as the current one. Hopefully!

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