I'm sorry, I... I just don't like ARM... :(

[Naten]

I really have been dreading this, an update I'd dislike...

Well, the ion engines are more powerful than the LV-1... I don't even have to wait for satellite movement burns. It just... doesn't seem fair.

Also, now it feels like if I start a new sandbox, I'm going to have to deal with 30 E-classes en route to Kerbin with a collision course. It's almost like the poor Kerbals are enduring the smite of some sort of deity, out there with a hatred for Kerbalkind...

If I make a space station, then I'll want it to be like the near-future space programs of ours; the ISS, and doing stuff with it, as well as satellites. Well, then lookie there. Asteroids up for grabs! Let's build a bigger rocket; no cost means bigger is better! WOOOOT! I really don't want a Space Launch System. It's an almost "premade" rocket, with like 6 parts... and it's all just for asteroids... Forget the near future, at least the near part about halfway. We'll probably do it at some point, but I don't want another Mun. It's just not the same anymore.

Also, the gameplay has changed. It really seems like if you make a big rocket out of like 6 SLS parts, up you go into orbit with a 90 ton payload. Giggleplex did it. It's just too easy. Nerf stuff, pleeeees...

I guess I don't have the right to complain...

SQUAD, I love what you're doing with the game and I love you people for your hard work, but can you make the ARM like a "mission pack" like it was kinda said it would be? Like how a demo isn't the whole thing, this would be a free expansion to download with people with KSP, something like that? Or, I'll ModuleManage away at your part.cfg's to balance them like before. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE this game... but I feel it's no longer the same...

[nAssailant]

Blasphemy!

I disagree. I'm loving the new update, and not just the new parts. The improved rocket stability and maneuver nodes were probably more exciting to me than the "claw", larger parts and asteroids (though I love those, too). The game is vastly improved because of those things I just mentioned. Also, if you don't like the new parts, no one is making you use them. You can just ignore the asteroids as well if they aren't your cup of tea.

Embracing change and new things is a necessary part of KSP and all things in general. When I first got the game 2 years ago, it was in a vastly different state than it was now. Things like docking and new planets changed KSP, for me, from what is was then to what it is now, and that isn't at all a bad thing.

[CaptainKipard]

How many parts would you like the SLS to be made of. Is 10 ok?

Joking aside can you restate all of that in a more objective way, because I don't quite understand a lot of it.

I'll give you one thing though; about the asteroids. It seems like impact events happen too often. I don't actually know how realistic that is. Time for some googling.

Edit.

Well that went quick. You were right.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impact_event#Frequency_and_Risk

[Naten]

I agree... The poor Kerbals preventing collisions, their salary must be equal to that of a neurosurgeon who plays professional football, american or not... at least his family gets to eat .-.

[ScottyDoesKnow]

I understand where you're coming from. I agree that it does seem too easy to put huge payloads into orbit due to the new parts. I think they overdid it on the joint strength too. I can hang a 4000t ship off 6 small launch clamps, I can ascend 640t to LKO at 4x physics acceleration. I mindlessly cloned stages on that lifter to make a 1600t lifter that hangs off the edges of the launch pad (no launch clamps used) and flops around before launch, but never breaks.

Combining the new parts and the joint strength make it dead simple to put massive payloads in orbit, which I think takes away the incentive for smaller, more efficient lifters and docking together ships or refueling in orbit.

This may well be fixed when they actually put costs into the game (don't necessarily need balanced parts if you can balance with cost), but that's probably not any time soon.

[FlowerChild]

Couldn't agree more OP. 0.23.5 essentially broke the game from my perspective, and took it from extremely fun to distinctly non-fun in a single update.

People used to admire the stuff Whackjob did precisely because it was crazy and difficult to pull off. Now lifting insane weight is trivial, taking a lot of the skill out of the game, and the fun along with it.

[The Silent Majority]

I really have been dreading this, an update I'd dislike...

Well, the ion engines are more powerful than the LV-1... I'm going to have to deal with 30 E-classes en route to Kerbin with a collision course.

Also, the gameplay has changed. It really seems like if you make a big rocket out of like 6 SLS parts, up you go into orbit with a 90 ton payload. Giggleplex did it...

SQUAD, I love what you're doing with the game and I love you people for your hard work, but can you make the ARM like a "mission pack" like it was kinda said it would be? Like how a demo isn't the whole thing, this would be a free expansion to download with people with KSP, something like that? Or, I'll ModuleManage away at your part.cfg's to balance them like before. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE this game... but I feel it's no longer the same...

Personally I disagree, I enjoy the new pack, (though admittedly mostly because I have playable frame-rates now).

Concerning the Ion engine and l-v1, that is incorrect, the LV-1 was buffed as well.

With the asteroids, just don't track them and they will disappear.

Why is it incredible that giggleplex did it? He is a great builder, especially with shuttles (IMHO)

I do agree that the SLS parts are overpowered compared to pre .235 parts, but they are very realistic.

it's also nice to have them as they are though, if only because they are overpowered. (again IMHO) (I do enjoy challenge, trust me, but sometimes I just want a nice, easy launch)

The costs have always been like that, so why complain now?

(as I understand it, money is coming in .24)(this may be incorrect though)

The SLS tanks have an 8:1 (I think, haven't done the math) fuel:mass ratio, making them less efficient than pre-patch tanks.

Of course, you are free to your opinion (that sounded less condescending in my head, sorry, really don't mean it like that )

Have a nice day

Edited April 4, 2014 by The Silent Majority

[Nemrav]

You know, E-class is pretty rare, and you don't have to click track if you don't want to go up and get an asteroid or have an impart etc....

There were a ton of optimisations and if you hate these new parts and asteroids, you can go right ahead, all the new parts are in a folder in the gamedata aswell as the asteroids and you can go delete them.

Also as for the new parts, you know they would be size 1 if we nerfed the fuel lines a bit... then we would have no use for smaller tanks would we... and the sls that you are campaining against would be supreme, in-fact we could nerf ions to realistic thrust... have fun increasing your orbit.

oh well, if anything your solution will be to go to the configs and such and nerf the parts...

[Naten]

Yup, and that's what the SLS is meant to do. Can I have a Saturn V to go, please? Oh, yeah, in the fairing, put a whole space station in there. Yep, just RP-1/LOX for the F-1's, and then the rest is hydrolox. Kthxbai.

Really, why did you include a haxing tool in the game? The debug menu was enough! Plox nerf! D:

(Squad, I still love your game, sorry... )

[Red Iron Crown]

How many parts would you like the SLS to be made of. Is 10 ok?

I know you're kidding, but it feels like going against the modular, lego-like flavor of KSP to have a fuel tank integrated into an engine. Same with combining engines into a multi-engine adapter, without giving us the adapter by itself.

[Naten]

Concerning the Ion engine and l-v1, that is incorrect, the LV-1 was buffed as well.

What is this, an engine for tarantulae?

[The Silent Majority]

why cry (not actually, referring to the emoticon)? wasn't that a complaint?

[HeadHunter67]

Yup, and that's what the SLS is meant to do. Can I have a Saturn V to go, please? Oh, yeah, in the fairing, put a whole space station in there.

They did that, this one time...

[regex]

I tell you one thing, it's awesome not having to strut the living crap out of my launchers just to keep the engines from wobbling around like mad. With reasonable part counts for my lifters I can now add more detail to the stuff in space. Plus the performance improvements... I'd have to say this was the best update I've experienced.

Sorry you feel that way, OP, hope you backed up your older versions.

[The Silent Majority]

They did that, this one time...

That was the joke... (you're probably making a joke that's flying over my head here, if so, sorry)

Edited April 4, 2014 by The Silent Majority

[Naten]

They did that, this one time...

Naaw, who needs that puny tube with a defunct solar panel. (No, I still love you Skylab )

Let's launch the whole Mir!

[Vanamonde]

I get what is being said about the simplification of construction brought by the larger parts, but the same things were being said when we got the larger parts with the orange tank and Mainsail. Players did then what they're going to do now; use just as many of the larger parts to make even bigger things.

[The Silent Majority]

I get what is being said about the simplification of construction brought by the larger parts, but the same things were being said when we got the larger parts with the orange tank and Mainsail. Players did then what they're going to do now; use just as many of the larger parts to make even bigger things.

^^^^^

Imagine what Whackjob will do with these

[malkuth]

Pretty sure that you don't have to do anything with the Asteroids if you don't want to.. They won't end your game if they hit kerbin.

I guess its possible that maybe after 120 sim years you might have a large collection of naturally Captured Asteriods buggering down your save file I guess. Maybe?

[The Silent Majority]

Pretty sure that you don't have to do anything with the Asteroids if you don't want to.. They won't end your game if they hit kerbin.

I guess its possible that maybe after 120 sim years you might have a large collection of naturally Captured Asteriods buggering down your save file I guess. Maybe?

not unless you track them

[Kaptain]

Some of ARM is awesome, and Some of ARM makes me "face-palm". There is "premade" feeling of building with some of these parts. The liquid fuel booster with engines and all. the Escape tower...people have built plenty of escape towers before, no need for this all in one deal. might as well add a premade lander with RCS, Fuel, engines and solar panels... yuck. Theres other things though that are sweet. The new large size is awesome, and the new SRBs are cool.

Plus, LOL at asteroids slowing down to 100m/s and just plopping down on kerbin. atleast mine did, then it rolled down a hill, breaking off what was left of the vehicle attached to it. It was hilarious to me.

[The Silent Majority]

I do agree with the "premade feeling" though, especially the liquid boosters, though I have no problems with the other tanks and engines (though I wish we had gotten individual K-25's, realistic or not, contradicting with my statement on the "real life" factor of these parts earlier)

I'll stop spamming now, sorry.

[NovaSilisko]

Going to have to agree with the balance issues... though, I will concede that it works better in career than in sandbox. It would be nice to have a three or more "tiers" of parts to use, with progressively better statistics and nicer appearances. The normal stock parts would be tier 2, these new parts would be tier 3.

I think a better way to balance the ion engine might've been to shrink it, keep its thrust the same, make it weigh only 0.25x as much, then mount it on a 0.625m metal plane to make it still attach better (or even don't - and make it radially attachable for more fun). That way the old thrust works much better, and its smaller size helps communicate that it's NOT intended for anything but the smallest spacecraft.

[stevism]

i'll admit, i don't really think it added *that* much to the game compared to the hype....

but to be fair, it's a 0.23.5, not a 0.24. it feels appropriate for that. a lot of really nice tweaks were added that are more "ah yes, that should've been there"

but i agree with the whole "really...premade escape tower? premade engines+fuel? what the...?" sentiments. And as it stands now, there is 0 incentive for using the escape tower....just revert the flight and be glad that you can.

but i think that's going to be an important addition once career mode gets reputation or whatever...and you can't revert flights. that should be kind of interesting.

just my 2 cents...keep up the great work Squad

[malkuth]

Some of ARM is awesome, and Some of ARM makes me "face-palm". There is "premade" feeling of building with some of these parts. The liquid fuel booster with engines and all. the Escape tower...people have built plenty of escape towers before, no need for this all in one deal. might as well add a premade lander with RCS, Fuel, engines and solar panels... yuck. Theres other things though that are sweet. The new large size is awesome, and the new SRBs are cool.

Plus, LOL at asteroids slowing down to 100m/s and just plopping down on kerbin. atleast mine did, then it rolled down a hill, breaking off what was left of the vehicle attached to it. It was hilarious to me.

That not really fair. Because A lot of people will not install mods.. No matter how many of what someone builds... Just saying.