[1.0.5 - Alpha 6] Dang It! (12 september 2015)

[xxjetterxx]

Oh gosh, drown with WD40. that is the best.

[Ippo]

...

Right click... but I guess you tried it already. That's very weird. Send me the new output log by email please.

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Oh gosh, drown with WD40. that is the best.

Oh, yeah, about that: native english speakers, is it "drown with" or "drown IN"?

[Ippo]

Hey mate, I tried the new version still have the same issue (Can`t take spare parts on EVA), It shows the engine reliability and stuff, the command pod even has the spare parts. I got to the point of checking the cache on steam (downloaded 10 files), remove all the mods I had and leave only yours still the same issue. I wonder now If there is a problem on my procedure. When you EVA you say to click on the command pod, that means Left click/ Right click with the mouse?

I poked the code with a stick and uploaded an update: I seriously hope it is fixed now.

[nebuchadnezzar]

Oh, yeah, about that: native english speakers, is it "drown with" or "drown IN"?

[skykooler]

But to be 100% correct, it should be "drown in".

[Robotengineer]

Could you also add one that says "Fix with Duck-tape"?

[Helix935]

hmm could this be used with EVA suits by implementing events like eva propellant leaks or broken suits?

[GunTuga]

hmm could this be used with EVA suits by implementing events like eva propellant leaks or broken suits?

This is a very good idea, but the EVA propellants problems need to be well though, to make it annoying while broken, but being able to return to the ship. Broken Suits could have a timer like event, where you need to return really fast to the ship before running out of oxygen

[Daishi]

This mod looks amazing! Wondering if i could suggest something (to ruin your day even more)...

Could you make a part failure "explosive", wherein it critically disables itself and affects surrounding parts with damage (which you can then get out and repair)?

For example, those fuel tanks exploding and damaging their neighbouring O2 and generator equipment? Connection wise, they're all attached to the parent core in the center of the stack, so I'm not sure how you'd get your mod to identify what part is sitting next to each other.

[frizzank]

yes things exploding when failing to fix them would be fun. Also great mod.

[Helix935]

This is a very good idea, but the EVA propellants problems need to be well though, to make it annoying while broken, but being able to return to the ship. Broken Suits could have a timer like event, where you need to return really fast to the ship before running out of oxygen

to make it annoying while broken make it lose eva propellant within a short time span depending on the amount like about 30 seconds per 0.05 eva propellant to at least be reasonable as to its loss and so that people aren't left with abandoned kerbals lying around in space

Edit: i realized that it is not meant to be truly life threatening so how about having it only bleed off all the EVA propellant except for about 1.00

Edited June 5, 2014 by Helix935

[goldenpeach]

You can't even imagine how happy I am right now.

I was quite bored and this mod will surely birn a lot more challenge(including in design challenge: it will make me think about redundancy).

On the other hand, I'm angry at you: I know I won't stop myself playing until very late in the night(I should go in bed soon normally)...

(this was a joke by the way, I'm not angry(however, the part about playing KSP late is not a joke)).

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Also, it will give a useful reason to my escape tower and free return trajectory

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A nice feature would be inspecting a part on EVA: just to have an idea of the reliability of a part before using it before a critical phase of the mission.

Edited June 5, 2014 by goldenpeach

[Helix935]

oh wait here is another idea for a random failure...

micrometeorites impacting the glass in IVA (may or may not actually have glass cracks develope in IVA, could just have the mini IVA screen turn off instead) which would obstruct vision and can potentially kill unless of course the kerbal repairs it within a reasonable amount of time and has reinforcements in place

[BFGfreak]

A feature I wouldn't mind having would be a Part Diagnostic where I can determine in advance if something isnt' working. Now it won't be a crystal ball, but it could give me a ballpark idea of the condition of a part at which point I can send someone on EVA to physically inspect it to determine if it was a false reading or if it needs some fixing.

[VaporTrail]

Another possible malfunction: a "stuck open" RCS throttle valve.

Basically while a RCS thruster is firing, the valve that closes to shut it off, doesn't. Tumble fun time.

To fix, requires shutting off RCS functions (R key), disabling the RCS port (secondary shutoff valves, right-click part), stabilizing your ship (either through reaction wheels slowing the resulting tumble, or reactivating RCS and manually flying it), and performing repairs in EVA.

The other side of the coin is a stuck shut throttle valve.

One thing about EVA propellant leaks: realistically, if your EVA propellant leaks quickly through a puncture, it's probably going to be a thruster, not just a leak... which means your kerbal's going to be doing a dutchman really quickly. Think pinwheel firework in space... A slow leak is possible, that doesn't produce quite as much thrust (making getting back to an airlock difficult, not freaking impossible) but that route isn't going to be a really quick resource drain.

Depends really on what you're using for EVA propellant. If you're using silver-catalyzed hydrogen peroxide (which is a monoprop) then all you've got to deal with is liquid H202 boiling to vaccum and generating thrust that way, and then you're not going to get too much thrust. A pressurized-gas system that develops a fast leak is going to be a serious problem.

[Ippo]

But to be 100% correct, it should be "drown in".

Ok thanks, fixing it now

Could you also add one that says "Fix with Duck-tape"?

All leaks are fixed with DucT tape right now

hmm could this be used with EVA suits by implementing events like eva propellant leaks or broken suits?

It's not very complicated to do (I only need to add the leak module to the EVA suit), but it would be very complicated to balance for the reasons you guys already discussed in the other posts. Also, right now I have no idea how I could have the leak apply some thrust.

I like the idea of leaving an "emergency reserve" of EVA fuel... still, I think that this might be more suited for the later deadly expansion.

Could you make a part failure "explosive", wherein it critically disables itself and affects surrounding parts with damage (which you can then get out and repair)?

Exploding parts are, at the moment, purposefully left out. Myself, I wouldn't mind: but I'm trying to blend in with the noob friendly accessible philosophy of the game. Otherwise, it would only be geared towards advanced players, while I'm thinking more of the average player with an interest in realism. Me, basically

[Ippo]

A feature I wouldn't mind having would be a Part Diagnostic where I can determine in advance if something isnt' working

Already planned. I was actually thinking about having your whole ship glow, each part in a different color from green to red in accordance to how close you are to its EOL: but I'm open to other interface suggestions, ofc.

Another possible malfunction: a "stuck open" RCS throttle valve.

I was thinking about that just the other day, even though I was thinking about brakes tbh. It's definitely not a priority, but down the road I'll see for what parts it makes sense to have multiple failure behaviours.

Depends really on what you're using for EVA propellant. If you're using silver-catalyzed hydrogen peroxide (which is a monoprop) then all you've got to deal with is liquid H202 boiling to vaccum and generating thrust that way, and then you're not going to get too much thrust. A pressurized-gas system that develops a fast leak is going to be a serious problem.

Uh, the second one. Zillophone. Next question.

[Daishi]

Exploding parts are, at the moment, purposefully left out. Myself, I wouldn't mind: but I'm trying to blend in with the noob friendly accessible philosophy of the game. Otherwise, it would only be geared towards advanced players, while I'm thinking more of the average player with an interest in realism. Me, basically

Shame - but we all turn into advanced players eventually so that's no excuse

Would be cool down the track though, especially with lifesupport mods. Maybe have a settings menu where you can toggle things on and off in the Kerbal Space Center screen?

[GunTuga]

Also don`t know if it was suggested but right now Im sending ships with some extra A.I. pods to get more Spare parts (Very useful on Space stations), maybe adding a new item to store Spare parts would be good

[Ippo]

Shame - but we all turn into advanced players eventually so that's no excuse

Would be cool down the track though, especially with lifesupport mods. Maybe have a settings menu where you can toggle things on and off in the Kerbal Space Center screen?

Not to boast, but I think I'm laying down a framework that is quite clever. Basically there is only one abstract module (ModuleBaseFailure) that does all the job: all you need to do to create a new failure module is to override just 3 methods*, and you are good to go.

So it would be very easy, for me or anyone else, to make an "expansion pack" that adds new failures or support for a particular mod. (inb4 EA Games)

*and a handful of properties

Also don`t know if it was suggested but right now Im sending ships with some extra A.I. pods to get more Spare parts (Very useful on Space stations), maybe adding a new item to store Spare parts would be good

Take a look at page 3, we already have a volounteer

[Daishi]

+1

(eagerly awaits the results of the boasty-framework-EAness)

[Quiana]

Shame - but we all turn into advanced players eventually so that's no excuse

Would be cool down the track though, especially with lifesupport mods. Maybe have a settings menu where you can toggle things on and off in the Kerbal Space Center screen?

I too wouldn't mind it if we had, say, a config to turn it into a 'deadly reentry' style system for failures.

On that note, a possible suggestion for cfg use. For spare parts, perhaps a nice add-on would be configs to put in KAS support. Example: Filling KAS containers with a 'spare part' instead of merely putting it in Capsules. It would encourage you to always carry spare parts or 'mission critical' replacements if necessary due to explosions (if implemented). Might even be able to extend the spare parts concept into 'Duct tape' for leak repairs, electrical components for alternator, and so on.

EDIT: And going on from that point, I realize certain spares would be heavier/lighter. This would let you configure each vessel with the kind of spares you'd expect to need due to failures. Lots of fuel storage? Probably going to need a lot more duct tape even if it's lighter. Significant engine amount? Better pack more of their replacements.

Edited June 5, 2014 by Quiana
Because MOAR IDEAS

[Dielos]

Hi,

Haven't played KSP for a while waiting for the 0.24 update, but this mod made me change my mind, and I'm reinstalling as we speak. Great idea! It will sure make KSP interesting again! I have a couple of questions though...

1. You state in the OP that parts that fail start to glow. Is it possible to disable this somehow? I don't like things glowing magically. I haven't tested the mod yet, so it might be almost unnoticeable, in that case forget this.

2. Spare parts can leak too? I imagine spare parts tugged away in a container, so unless the door pops open, which would make them fly off all at once, I'm not sure if I find that realistic.

3. No idea how to mod, so not sure if this is possible, but it would be really cool to somehow bind this with Chatterer, so that when a failure occurs, the comms would start to go crazy...

4. I guess failures only affect active vessels, right? Those RemoteTech sat's I got everywhere, once in orbit they will never be affected unless I focus on them?

As soon as I have it installed and tested, I'll give some feedback. And looking forward to maintenance, as I imagine keeping space stations running might be quite hard right now.

Edited June 5, 2014 by Dielos
forgot one question, added to the list...

[goldenpeach]

I have found a bug: a fuel tank leak actually reduce the fuel consumption(not increasing it).

It mean that, if you don't drain resource from that tank(i.e: not using a engine(or anything else that need the resource) connected by any mean to that tank) you don't lose any fuel.

Also, if you're using RCS, the reduction is enough to make fuel consumption to reach 0(or below, but the game doesn't don't allow negative consumption). In that case, the RSC can't be used anymore, even if you still have RSC fuel and functional RSC.

Is my report clear enough or is it impossible to understand?

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Also, an option to disable the part glow when a failure occur would be cool: just to make you search for the failure(especially if you make the deadly failure mod for your mod).

(Also, an option to disable the warning would also be cool: it's your responsibility to realize that there is something wrong )

Edited June 5, 2014 by goldenpeach

[Ippo]

Might even be able to extend the spare parts concept into 'Duct tape' for leak repairs, electrical components for alternator, and so on.

That was an idea in the dev thread, but they talked me out of it for simplicity's sake

1. You state in the OP that parts that fail start to glow. Is it possible to disable this somehow? I don't like things glowing magically. I haven't tested the mod yet, so it might be almost unnoticeable, in that case forget this.

Sorry, right now the glow thingy is still hardcoded. Since I see there is an interest in a more immersive gameplay though, I'll make sure to include it asap.

Same goes for all the notifications, actually: as of now, they can't be neither turned off nor customized. (They could be, before I had this incredible, awesome, clever idea on how to structure the code... and it took away a functionality that now my users want. Nice )

2. Spare parts can leak too? I imagine spare parts tugged away in a container, so unless the door pops open, which would make them fly off all at once, I'm not sure if I find that realistic.

No, spare parts cannot leak. At the moment, Electric Charge, Solid Fuel and Spare Parts are the only resources that are excluded from leaking. I'm looking for a run-time blacklist solution, so that you can exclude modded resources too.

3. No idea how to mod, so not sure if this is possible, but it would be really cool to somehow bind this with Chatterer, so that when a failure occurs, the comms would start to go crazy...

I DO hope it's possible But I'll leave that for much, much later.

4. I guess failures only affect active vessels, right? Those RemoteTech sat's I got everywhere, once in orbit they will never be affected unless I focus on them?

Failures can only happen on active vessels, yes. However, tanks (and any component set to "always active") will still accumulate age.

Is my report clear enough or is it impossible to understand?

Nope, sorry, I didn't really understand it Oo Could you please elaborate? I'd love to see your output log, if you are ok with that. When a tank fails, I disable both in and out transfers: could it explain your problem?