Remove or Fix the Stayputnik

[Greep]

Well, I've used the stayputnik, and it's pretty great

Problem though: is this REALLY what we want new players' first encounter with unmanned probes to be? Lack of SAS and reaction wheels essentially means newbies have two big obstacles to overcome... I mean SAS is solved with piloting skills and torque is solved (sort of) by slapping on an inline reaction wheel... But it feels weird.

[thereaverofdarkness]

I think you guys forget the advantage to the probe cores in general: less mass! Sure, it has no piloting skill. But it also has no pilot mass! You can easily do the probe missions by strapping a Stayputnik to the top of a crewed rocket: it's tiny mass will not significantly impact the range of the craft. But it's also useful right from the start to reduce rocket mass and also to protect pilots in a dangerous mission. Makes sense you should have to give up a bit for that advantage. I think the later probe cores should be far more expensive than they are. Heck, I'd be more than willing to pay 100,000 for an OKTO2 with full piloting capabilities if I can just slap it on top of my level 2 pilot's command pod while I send him out on a training mission.

[Superfluous J]

I hate to suggest a mod when someone is complaining about stock, but there is now a very slick modification that addresses this exact thing in Tweakable Everything. Check out the latest changelog for more.

[Wallygator]

I hate to suggest a mod when someone is complaining about stock, but there is now a very slick modification that addresses this exact thing in Tweakable Everything. Check out the latest changelog for more.

Just checked it out. Really nice. I think that makes total sense. Going to install it.

[ghpstage]

I think you guys forget the advantage to the probe cores in general: less mass! Sure, it has no piloting skill. But it also has no pilot mass! You can easily do the probe missions by strapping a Stayputnik to the top of a crewed rocket: it's tiny mass will not significantly impact the range of the craft. But it's also useful right from the start to reduce rocket mass and also to protect pilots in a dangerous mission. Makes sense you should have to give up a bit for that advantage. I think the later probe cores should be far more expensive than they are. Heck, I'd be more than willing to pay 100,000 for an OKTO2 with full piloting capabilities if I can just slap it on top of my level 2 pilot's command pod while I send him out on a training mission.

As far as I can see kerbals in a pod don't add towards its mass at all, it weighs 8.4 tons occupied or not. An empty command pod with a probe on top is heavier than a manned one!

On EVA the kerbal does weight 0.09 tons however, so this might be a bug.

Yes probes are light, don't require a pilot and some have inbuilt SAS functions, and as a result are useful for some things. But there are very real balance problems between manned and unmanned missions.

The pod after all, comes with a vast array of features,

• High crash tolerance
  
• Monopropellant storage
  
• No constant power drain
  
• A sizeable battery (with no constant drain its enough for Mun and Minmus landings!)
  
• An internal torque system that's both as strong as, and more power efficient than, the dedicated reaction wheel.
  
• Internal science instrument that transmits at 100% efficiency and can be with EVA is re-usable.
  
• EVA for a whole heck of a lot more science from EVA reports and samples.
  
• EVA allows use of the pods storage for masses of science data, safeguarding it in a single hard shell, and allowing better re-usability and saving power
  
• Onboard unlimited supply of jetpack fuel
  
• Kerbals passengers skills such as SAS
  

Did I miss any?

When you strip out the monopropellant, most of this is available right at the start of the game with later upgrades unlocking the rest, in a 0.8 ton package, for a paltry cost of 588 credits. For reference, the inline reaction wheel that's worse than the command pods own costs 600 by itself!

[CaptainKipard]

May be in a sense that it can fullfill satellite contract.

That doesn't answer the question.

[Superfluous J]

That doesn't answer the question.

Yes it did.

[CaptainKipard]

Yes it did.

o.O

The question was "in what sense" the context was "uncontrollable probe". I have no idea what that means so I asked, given that every other part is uncontrollable. What does it mean to have a "probe" that you can't control. That's just a structural part or a battery.

[Anquietas314]

o.O

The question was "in what sense" the context was "uncontrollable probe". I have no idea what that means so I asked, given that every other part is uncontrollable. What does it mean to have a "probe" that you can't control. That's just a structural part or a battery.

I think it's quite obvious Kesa meant a "probe" part that counts for the purposes of the satellite contract, but is otherwise uncontrollable. How is that unclear to you?

[CaptainKipard]

How is that unclear to you?

All I wanted was an answer to my question. Don't be an ass.

Edited December 29, 2014 by Cpt. Kipard

[Vanamonde]

Don't be an ass.

Advice everyone needs to hear from time to time. No need to get angry at each other over this, guys.