[1.4.1] Fuel Tanks Plus 2.0.2 (2018-03-14)

[Nnimrod]

Has anyone released texture packs for this? One of the best thing about procedural parts was getting to customize aesthetics a huge amount, thanks to the several texture packs for PP. Downside aesthetically was the extremely simple models that you get when you make a procedural fuel tank, a problem that @NecroBones stuff does not have.

[NecroBones]

 

Updated:

1.9.2 (2016-05-07) - Fuel Switching Tweaks.
 - Added InterstellarFuelSwitch 2.0.2 flags to re-tie radial tank texture to fuel type.
 - Reduced dry mass of radial tanks when containing MonoPropellant, to better match stock tanks (Firespitter and InterstellarFuelSwitch).

 

6 hours ago, Nnimrod said:

Has anyone released texture packs for this? One of the best thing about procedural parts was getting to customize aesthetics a huge amount, thanks to the several texture packs for PP. Downside aesthetically was the extremely simple models that you get when you make a procedural fuel tank, a problem that @NecroBones stuff does not have.

 

Adding more colors to these tanks is pretty hard from a "third party" perspective, because they're actually mesh-swtiching rather than texture switching, which allows for customized rims and pipes for each color, and it allows packing lots of different colors into the same texture. It's not impossible, but pretty hard when you have to add alternate meshes.

 

What additional colors/patterns would you like to see? We have less of a memory constraint now that 64bit is available, so I can always add some more.

 

[sentania]

Would it be possible to add a patch that converts the nuclear fuel tanks to Lqd Hydrogen and implement the cyrotank module when the appropriate near future mods are installed?

I can work on a patch, but it probably won't be for a few days.

[NecroBones]

46 minutes ago, sentania said:

Would it be possible to add a patch that converts the nuclear fuel tanks to Lqd Hydrogen and implement the cyrotank module when the appropriate near future mods are installed?

I can work on a patch, but it probably won't be for a few days.

 

Possibly, though if you're using Nertea's CryoEngines/CryoTanks, those patches should apply and add it anyway. I usually expect the mods that are adding new fuels to do that, so I add exclusions to keep it from applying my patches.

 

[sentania]

@NecroBones  I was referring to the simple boiloff side of cyro tanks,....

 

something like this:

@PART[TPtank*Nuke]:NEEDS[SimpleBoiloff]
{
    MODULE
    {
      name =  ModuleCryoTank
  		FuelName = LqdHydrogen
  		// in % per hour
  		BoiloffRate = 0.05
  		// in Ec per 1000 units per second
  		CoolingCost = 0.08
    }
}

 

[Nnimrod]

4 hours ago, NecroBones said:

 

Updated:

1.9.2 (2016-05-07) - Fuel Switching Tweaks.
 - Added InterstellarFuelSwitch 2.0.2 flags to re-tie radial tank texture to fuel type.
 - Reduced dry mass of radial tanks when containing MonoPropellant, to better match stock tanks (Firespitter and InterstellarFuelSwitch).

 

 

Adding more colors to these tanks is pretty hard from a "third party" perspective, because they're actually mesh-swtiching rather than texture switching, which allows for customized rims and pipes for each color, and it allows packing lots of different colors into the same texture. It's not impossible, but pretty hard when you have to add alternate meshes.

 

What additional colors/patterns would you like to see? We have less of a memory constraint now that 64bit is available, so I can always add some more.

 

Interesting. I can come up with some suggestions, I know a bare/unpainted metal would probably be popular.

[NecroBones]

7 hours ago, sentania said:

@NecroBones  I was referring to the simple boiloff side of cyro tanks,....

 

something like this:

[...]

 

Huh, yeah I could add something like that. I might need to see if that's all that's needed, or whatever.

 

[AccidentalDisassembly]

Necro, I'm attempting to create a set of ModuleManager patches for myself that copy your parts and create intermediate sizes (like 1.875m) without the use of TweakScale (although that would be an equally good solution, really).

However, I'm running into a problem. Here's an example of a patch I use - FTP, B9 Part Switch, and Interstellar Fuel Switch are installed. The first config duplicates the Oscar dome tank, the second duplicates a longer Oscar tank.

Spoiler

+PART[TPcone0m1]
{
    @name = 9375_TPcone0m1
    @rescaleFactor = 1.5
    @TechRequired = propulsionSystems
    @entryCost *= 1.3
    @cost *= 1.3

    @title = OscarPlus 0.9375 Fuel Dome
    @description = A smallish fuel tank for your smallish fuel tank needs.

    @mass *= 3.375 

    @RESOURCE[LiquidFuel]
    {
        @amount *= 3.375
        @maxAmount *= 3.375
    }
    @RESOURCE[Oxidizer]
    {
        @amount *= 3.375
        @maxAmount *= 3.375
    }
}

Spoiler

+PART[TPtank0mL01875]
{
    @name = 9375_TPtank0mL01875
    @rescaleFactor = 1.5
    @TechRequired = propulsionSystems
    @entryCost *= 1.3
    @cost *= 1.3

    @title = OscarPlus-E 0.9375 Fuel Tank
    @description = A smallish fuel tank for your smallish fuel tank needs.

    @mass *= 3.375 

    @RESOURCE[LiquidFuel]
    {
        @amount *= 3.375
        @maxAmount *= 3.375
    }
    @RESOURCE[Oxidizer]
    {
        @amount *= 3.375
        @maxAmount *= 3.375
    }
}

New parts have correct sizes/node placement/whatever, but there's some sort of crazy texture-switchy issue as you can see in this picture. Two things happening:

1. The funny overlapping/Z-fighting-whatever you call that on the upper tank

2. The dome tank at the bottom should have (maybe?) been the same gray color as the normal Oscar dome, but it started white. However, when moused over, it becomes gray again as seen in the picture.

Picture:

Do you happen to know what I'm doing wrong here? If you'd like, once these actually work, you'd be welcome to include my completed configs as optional extras or something (if that interests you).

 

[NecroBones]

43 minutes ago, AccidentalDisassembly said:

[...]

New parts have correct sizes/node placement/whatever, but there's some sort of crazy texture-switchy issue as you can see in this picture. Two things happening:

1. The funny overlapping/Z-fighting-whatever you call that on the upper tank

2. The dome tank at the bottom should have (maybe?) been the same gray color as the normal Oscar dome, but it started white. However, when moused over, it becomes gray again as seen in the picture.

[...]

Do you happen to know what I'm doing wrong here? If you'd like, once these actually work, you'd be welcome to include my completed configs as optional extras or something (if that interests you).

 

 

Yep, if you look inside the folders for each of the diameters, there's a file in there with the color-switching configs. It explicitly defines the list of part names (with wildcards) to apply to. So if you give the parts names that match the existing patterns, that will solve it. Otherwise you'd have to add a set of configs to handle those, which could just be a duplicate of the existing ones. The problem with duplicating it, is that you'd have to update it in the future if I add more color schemes.

 

I hadn't taken into account the possibility that people might want to add parts to the list. I could probably come up with something a little more flexible. But in the meantime, the patterns you'd need to follow are "TPcone0m*" and "TPtank0mL?????" for those tanks. The first one has a pretty broad wildcard, so you could add your custom "9375" tag to the end of that. For the cylindrical tanks, it's looking for exactly 5 characters after the "L", because it was trying to avoid applying to the older parts that had shorter names but no color-switching.

[NecroBones]

1 hour ago, AccidentalDisassembly said:

Do you happen to know what I'm doing wrong here? If you'd like, once these actually work, you'd be welcome to include my completed configs as optional extras or something (if that interests you).

 

 

Actually I do have a plan to make this a little more flexible. I'm out of time tonight, but tomorrow I can probably make the change rather quickly. I can add variables to the parts, that are used instead of the part names, such that duplication will simply make it "just work".

[AccidentalDisassembly]

12 minutes ago, NecroBones said:

 

Actually I do have a plan to make this a little more flexible. I'm out of time tonight, but tomorrow I can probably make the change rather quickly. I can add variables to the parts, that are used instead of the part names, such that duplication will simply make it "just work".

If it's a complicated change, I can also just add the appropriate sizes to TweakScale and be done with it, that would work too!

The reasoning behind all of this in my mind was (optional) size compatibility with things like 0.9325/1.875 engines from HGR or BlueDog or whatnot, I'd rather have nifty texture-switching tanks of all sizes than 92385902852 new tanks from every mod I install. But, of course, TweakScale is basically built for that, heh.

Edited May 10, 2016 by AccidentalDisassembly

[NecroBones]

1 minute ago, AccidentalDisassembly said:

If it's a complicated change, I can also just add the appropriate sizes to TweakScale and be done with it, that would work too!

 

Nah, the plan should be super easy, and will make it more flexible for myself too.

[FreeThinker]

Heads up, I updated IFS with a fix  to resolve an issue when using the latest Tweakscale version, that cause tanks to be too light or heavy , or send you to the black void

[NecroBones]

9 hours ago, NecroBones said:

 

Nah, the plan should be super easy, and will make it more flexible for myself too.

 

Updated:

1.9.3 (2016-05-10) - Tweaks.
 - Altered the color-switching rules to be based on variables rather than part names, for more flexibility and support for part duplication.

 

@AccidentalDisassembly, now the part duplicating should work with the color-switching, without you needing to do anything else, as long as the part names start with "TP". So the extra numbers you're adding should go at the tail end instead of the front of the names. There's a variable added to each part that tells it which color switching rule to give it, and that variable should get properly duplicated for your additional tanks.

 

4 hours ago, FreeThinker said:

Heads up, I updated IFS with a fix  to resolve an issue when using the latest Tweakscale version, that cause tanks to be too light or heavy , or send you to the black void

 

Great! I'll be sure to grab the update.

 

 

[AccidentalDisassembly]

3 hours ago, NecroBones said:

 

Updated:

1.9.3 (2016-05-10) - Tweaks.
 - Altered the color-switching rules to be based on variables rather than part names, for more flexibility and support for part duplication.

 

@AccidentalDisassembly, now the part duplicating should work with the color-switching, without you needing to do anything else, as long as the part names start with "TP". So the extra numbers you're adding should go at the tail end instead of the front of the names. There's a variable added to each part that tells it which color switching rule to give it, and that variable should get properly duplicated for your additional tanks.

 

Awesome, thanks! I'll give it a whirl and see if I can come up with some interesting configs for 0.9375, 1.5, 1.875.

 

EDIT: Works quite well. Very easy to make new sizes.

I took it one step further and tried to play with the default texture given to the new size of tank (start it with Juno instead of Oscar) by reconfiguring your patch.

Spoiler

objects = TPtank0m-White;TPtank0m-Checkered;TPtank0m-Black;TPtank0m-Red;TPtank0m-Grey

OR begin the B9 switcher list with this as the first one:

SUBTYPE
        {
            name = Juno
            transform = TPtank0m-White
        }

 

It works fine when PLACED in the editor - starts on right texture, switches fine, no graphical errors - but the parts list, on the other hand, shows no texture on the sides:

I am guessing that that's not something that can be solved because the model itself is pointing to the red/gray textures to begin with (?), is that accurate? Just curious, not a real issue.

Edited May 10, 2016 by AccidentalDisassembly

[NecroBones]

39 minutes ago, AccidentalDisassembly said:

 

[...]

It works fine when PLACED in the editor - starts on right texture, switches fine, no graphical errors - but the parts list, on the other hand, shows no texture on the sides:

[...]

I am guessing that that's not something that can be solved because the model itself is pointing to the red/gray textures to begin with (?), is that accurate? Just curious, not a real issue.

 

That's right, the model is compiled with an "Icon_Hidden" tag placed on all of the meshes that are intended to be hidden from the icon. I don't think there's a way to modify those with MM, unfortunately.

 

[NecroBones]

6 hours ago, AccidentalDisassembly said:

I am guessing that that's not something that can be solved because the model itself is pointing to the red/gray textures to begin with (?), is that accurate? Just curious, not a real issue.

 

I forgot to mention, you can dynamically add search tags pretty easily. I saw that you were also editing the display names and descriptions etc too.

To add a search tag:

	@tags = #$tags$ something

... which would add "something" to the end of the tags list.

 

I'm trying to think of how to modify the icon though. The simplest thing probably would be to add icon-only overlays via additional "MODEL { }" sections. Obviously that means making compiled models for that. The simplest thing would probably be a ring of text around the tank that says something like "0.9375m" or "S-1.5" or something along those lines. Heh.

 

[AccidentalDisassembly]

31 minutes ago, NecroBones said:

 

I forgot to mention, you can dynamically add search tags pretty easily. I saw that you were also editing the display names and descriptions etc too.

To add a search tag:

	@tags = #$tags$ something

... which would add "something" to the end of the tags list.

 

I'm trying to think of how to modify the icon though. The simplest thing probably would be to add icon-only overlays via additional "MODEL { }" sections. Obviously that means making compiled models for that. The simplest thing would probably be a ring of text around the tank that says something like "0.9375m" or "S-1.5" or something along those lines. Heh.

 

Hah, yeah, that would do it!

I forgot about all the possibilities of MM patches with # and $ and ^= and such, but tried to re-learn a few things in creating these preliminary configs:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/59567837/FTP_Create09375mTanks.cfg

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/59567837/FTP_Create1875mTanks.cfg

The first copies FTP's and Squad's 0.625m parts (tanks and decouplers) and rescales them to 0.9375m with (hopefully) appropriate masses. No tags though, didn't think about that. The second one down-scales FTP and Squad Rockomax parts (including Squad tanks and decoupler) to 1.875m.

The configs are completely redundant if you have Tweakscale, but hey!

Doing this made me think of something that I put together a while back when attempting to learn how to make parts for KSP (because rescaling of adapters doesn't produce something desirable under many circumstances). It's a set of adapters meant to cover uncommon tank-to-tank ratios with both long and short fuel tanks - If you're looking for random things to add to FTP, a set of adapters covering many eventualities could be useful (though for a pretty limited audience, admittedly). It works best with tweakscale, but could be used via MM configs similar to the ones I'm doing to produce adapter parts that cover just about every mod's unusual sizes. The parts include short and long versions of:

1. Tank with 1:2 ratio (1.25 - 2.5)
2. Tank with 2:3 ratio (2.5 - 3.75) --- also covers 
3. Tank with 3:4 ratio (3.75 - 5) --- also covers 0.9375m-1.25m / 1.875m-2.5m, 7.5m-10m
4. Tank with 4:5 ratio (5-6.25) --- also covers 1m(Kosmos)-1.25m, 

With a 5:6 ratio adapter (6.25 to 7.5, also 1.25 to 1.5, 3.125 to 3.75) and a 3:5 ratio adapter, I think you could (with tweakscale) cover almost any needed adapter.

Anyhoo, thought that could be an interesting addition to FTP that would make for a kind of universal mod-to-stock adapter compatibility. I have some crappily-textured models I can send you if you DO find that idea interesting. They cover the four ratios listed, but not 5:6 or 3:5. Probably have the blender files somewhere too.

 

 

[NecroBones]

 

Cool, I like what you did with those configs. Regexing the names was a great idea too!

 

Yeah, I'll have to think about adapters. I have some in there now, for the most common cases. The further we get from common use, the more cautious I get, because I also have had a lot of requests to keep the menu count down. One of the best things I ever did in this mod was to consolidate the parts into color-switches, instead of having them as separate tanks, which they were originally. Not only did it save space in the menus, and make things more user-friendly, but it liberated me to add more tank sizes and more color choices at the same time. So more adapters isn't necessarily a problem. I just need to decide how much is too much, and what's likely to be used.

 

 

[AccidentalDisassembly]

2 minutes ago, NecroBones said:

Yeah, I'll have to think about adapters. I have some in there now, for the most common cases. The further we get from common use, the more cautious I get, because I also have had a lot of requests to keep the menu count down. One of the best things I ever did in this mod was to consolidate the parts into color-switches, instead of having them as separate tanks, which they were originally. Not only did it save space in the menus, and make things more user-friendly, but it liberated me to add more tank sizes and more color choices at the same time. So more adapters isn't necessarily a problem. I just need to decide how much is too much, and what's likely to be used.

Indeed, part spam sucks... I wonder, because I don't know how the mesh / texture switching works, if it wouldn't be possible to create one part that mesh switches to become X adapters - like an adapter that is 1.25m on the top, and mesh switches so the bottom becomes either 1.5, 1.875, 2.5, 3.75, whatever... Can node size change on mesh switchery? That could result in having very few parts in the list, maybe...

[NecroBones]

 

That's an interesting idea. As far as I can tell, KSP doesn't really care that much about the node size. So it's probably possible. But combining it with color-switching might not be as practical, since it would either need a lot more meshes (number shapes, times number of paint schemes), or the color changes would have to be from a separate series of textures via texture switching. Those textures could probably be reasonably small though, since adapters would be a fairly simple in design. Something to think about in any case.

 

[White Owl]

On 5/7/2016 at 6:40 AM, NecroBones said:

What additional colors/patterns would you like to see? We have less of a memory constraint now that 64bit is available, so I can always add some more.
 

If you're considering taking requests...

In one of your mod threads, quite some time ago I asked about adding a polished bare metal texture, similar to the Atlas texture in Procedural Parts. Another option I frequently want on all sorts of spacecraft is crinkly gold mylar insulation. Back when I was building most things with PP due to RAM limits, I used those two textures on almost every rocket. I really think they would work well with your parts.

[Paranoid Shark]

Hi @NecroBones,

I really like your mods, however because I have MRS and Fuel Tanks Plus installed I have quite a few duplicate (or very similar) parts. How would I go about making it so I don't have duplicates?

Thanks,

Kit

[NecroBones]

8 hours ago, White Owl said:

If you're considering taking requests...

In one of your mod threads, quite some time ago I asked about adding a polished bare metal texture, similar to the Atlas texture in Procedural Parts. Another option I frequently want on all sorts of spacecraft is crinkly gold mylar insulation. Back when I was building most things with PP due to RAM limits, I used those two textures on almost every rocket. I really think they would work well with your parts.

 

Yeah those would probably be pretty popular. I think both need normal maps to work. It's doable, I just need to think about how to pull it off. I think most people pull material samples from google searches, etc. So far I've managed to avoid that.

 

3 hours ago, Paranoid Shark said:

Hi @NecroBones,

I really like your mods, however because I have MRS and Fuel Tanks Plus installed I have quite a few duplicate (or very similar) parts. How would I go about making it so I don't have duplicates?

 

If you know which MRS tanks you don't want, you can go in and delete those individually, since nothing shares assets in MRS. Or, you can use the MRS "Lite" package which leaves out the fuel tanks.

 

[Paranoid Shark]

On 5/12/2016 at 6:28 PM, NecroBones said:

If you know which MRS tanks you don't want, you can go in and delete those individually, since nothing shares assets in MRS. Or, you can use the MRS "Lite" package which leaves out the fuel tanks.

Thanks,

As for requests, Can we have some stripes (like MRS) in Fuel Tanks plus? Also, would it be possible to have 2.5m textures for 1.25m tanks? I would love to be able to make my rockets the same colour and texture all the way up!