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The Void UPDATE I'm done with this 1/4/17


Spaceception

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BIG UPDATE: I'm done writing this, I'm sorry, but it doesn't feel original, I don't have ideas like I do for other novel ideas, and among other things, I just can't write this anymore

You can still read what I wrote, but I'm not writing it anymore, who knows? I might pick it back up in the future, but I don't have any ideas or inspiration for it.

Chapter 1 | Go down a bit(Outdated)

Chapter 2 | Go down a bit(Outdated)

Chapter 3 | Near the top(Outdated)

 

Big thanks too:

@Findthepin1

@Bill Phil

And @Atlas2342 for being my proof/betareaders,

 @ProtoJeb21 For (A very short time) being a "Planetary system consultant"/Betareader

Cody, from the AlternateHistoryHub, who's helping me with the Alternate history. (Obviously)

And to you guys, for reading it, giving me feedback, or even helping me out when I have a question.

Edited by Spaceception
Huge update
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With anti matter catalyzed fusion you would simply drop the heavy bombs and do it directly in an fusion engine, you can scale the blast down into the ton range or less.
With orion /medussa you want to use as large bombs as posible as the efficiency goes up, nuclear bombs has an fixed cost in casing, explosives and triggers, for the more effective fusion bomb you will need an lower efficent fision bomb who would be most of the weight until large bombs.
With anti matter catalyzed fusion you only have the fusion part and the antimatter and perhaps reaction mass.


I doubth you would be able to get 25% c with it, then you have to use matter anti matter reaction. 
 

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3 minutes ago, magnemoe said:

With anti matter catalyzed fusion you would simply drop the heavy bombs and do it directly in an fusion engine, you can scale the blast down into the ton range or less.
With orion /medussa you want to use as large bombs as posible as the efficiency goes up, nuclear bombs has an fixed cost in casing, explosives and triggers, for the more effective fusion bomb you will need an lower efficent fision bomb who would be most of the weight until large bombs.
With anti matter catalyzed fusion you only have the fusion part and the antimatter and perhaps reaction mass.


I doubth you would be able to get 25% c with it, then you have to use matter anti matter reaction. 
 

What about 17%? And how many will I need? (You can just give me the weight) Also, it's thermonuclear bombs.

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6 hours ago, Spaceception said:

What about 17%? And how many will I need? (You can just give me the weight) Also, it's thermonuclear bombs.

http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/enginelist.php
List various engines. 
Medusa is 50-100.000 s, this however assume small bombs, it should scale up for larger bombs,
However 25% c is hard, it probably require something more like avatar / venturestar, downside is that the ship will use more energy than sunlight reaching earth, you are an class 1+ civilization, and yes this have the backstory in avatar break down. 

Go for Medusa, an fancy version of an nuclear bomb and 2.5% c. Sleeper ship, crew don't age more than an year during trip. Not frozen, think hedgehog during winter. 
This is something who could be build around 2070

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6 hours ago, Spaceception said:

Also, I simulated the system idea I have, what do you think?

 

Like your system, note that the goldilock zone is small so earth 3 will not fit, cheat and give it an thick atmosphere say 4 bar, this will make flight easy.
And yes life will pass at least from earth 2 to 3. 

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6 hours ago, Spaceception said:

This is what the spacecraft will (Very roughly, mind you) look like, (Keep in mind, the sail is not to scale, the 2 cylinders will be 25 meters wide, and 55 meters long):

 

Um, you use a scanner please? I can't see anything you wrote on it...

58 minutes ago, magnemoe said:

Like your system, note that the goldilock zone is small so earth 3 will not fit, cheat and give it an thick atmosphere say 4 bar, this will make flight easy.
And yes life will pass at least from earth 2 to 3. 

Also, small red dwarfs are often flare/variable stars that would eventually kill off complex life from a really bad solar flare (and these stars's solar flares are much more dangerous than the Sun). Really, the more massive a red dwarf, the better off life is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LS-VPyLaJFM

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Would a star the size of Wolf 359 be big enough to have gas giants? I wouldn't think they have the mass to spare. A brown dwarf is basically a giant gas planet anyway. :)

I like your system, especially how small it is. Makes interplanetary travel pretty easy compared to our own planets. Watch out for Borg, though. ;)

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2 minutes ago, Halo_003 said:

High contrast version:

 

sFvlx2L.jpg

 

Sorry for my horrible arrows lol.

Hmm, it looks like you would need a nuclear reactor and radiators to go with it (and radiators for the crewed area.)

Also, why is the navigation area on the back? I know you can't really put it on the front, but still- if it's just to use a part of the ship that would go unused otherwise, why give it a coupula? Windows are another failure point that adds complexity. You'd also probably want to place a lander somewhere to do useful stuff once you get there.

Just asying.

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9 hours ago, fredinno said:

Hmm, it looks like you would need a nuclear reactor and radiators to go with it (and radiators for the crewed area.)

Also, why is the navigation area on the back? I know you can't really put it on the front, but still- if it's just to use a part of the ship that would go unused otherwise, why give it a coupula? Windows are another failure point that adds complexity. You'd also probably want to place a lander somewhere to do useful stuff once you get there.

Just asying.

I said it was really rough :) Also, I wanted windows so they wouldn't turn into religious cult crazies thinking the ship was fake and all that (That might make for an interesting story, focusing on that, but no) .

I also forgot that a Medusa Starship had to be designed backwards in a way :D

11 hours ago, magnemoe said:

http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/enginelist.php
List various engines. 
Medusa is 50-100.000 s, this however assume small bombs, it should scale up for larger bombs,
However 25% c is hard, it probably require something more like avatar / venturestar, downside is that the ship will use more energy than sunlight reaching earth, you are an class 1+ civilization, and yes this have the backstory in avatar break down. 

Go for Medusa, an fancy version of an nuclear bomb and 2.5% c. Sleeper ship, crew don't age more than an year during trip. Not frozen, think hedgehog during winter. 
This is something who could be build around 2070

What about 17%? Also, I intended for the crew to be awake the entire time, not asleep.

Also, I wanted the "Anti-matter catalyzed NPP Medusa sail" Because I wanted to be creative with my story, instead of using clichés such as using Proxima as the parent star, or some sort of slow ship that requires generations of people/

11 hours ago, magnemoe said:

Like your system, note that the goldilock zone is small so earth 3 will not fit, cheat and give it an thick atmosphere say 4 bar, this will make flight easy.
And yes life will pass at least from earth 2 to 3. 

Earth 2 is near the inner edge of the HZ, and Earth 3 is just outside of it, plus there are other planets that could help stabilize things.

9 hours ago, Mitchz95 said:

Would a star the size of Wolf 359 be big enough to have gas giants? I wouldn't think they have the mass to spare. A brown dwarf is basically a giant gas planet anyway. :)

I like your system, especially how small it is. Makes interplanetary travel pretty easy compared to our own planets. Watch out for Borg, though. ;)

I was considering putting a dwarf gas giant in, I might do that.

That's what I intended :)

Edited by Spaceception
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10 hours ago, fredinno said:

Also, small red dwarfs are often flare/variable stars that would eventually kill off complex life from a really bad solar flare (and these stars's solar flares are much more dangerous than the Sun). Really, the more massive a red dwarf, the better off life is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LS-VPyLaJFM

I know, but 1, Wolf 359 is more stable than say Proxima, and 2 if the planet has a strong magnetic field (And is lucky enough), it could survive its parent stars' wild activity long enough for the star to stabilize.

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1: Medusa sail. The sail is made out of Graphene, for strength.

2: Cables. The cables connecting the sail to the ship is made from Carbon nanotubes

3: The directional tube for the bombs. Again, these are made of Carbon nanotubes, with a magnetic confinement system

4: Bomb package. the bomb package contains all of the bombs for the acceleration/deceleration parts of the mission

5: Radiation shield. The radiation shield is 5 meters thick with saltwater, and protects the crew from radiation sickness

6: The habitat modules. The habitat modules contain the life support systems, crew quarters, and miscellaneous stuff such as a mess hall, and rec area (I'll be going into more detail with these later)

7: Capula. The capula is for making sure the crew doesn't go crazy thinking they're still on Earth and whatnot

8: Navigation. This module is for making sure they don't end up at the center of the Milky Way

9: Nuclear reactor/radiators. These nuclear reactors are for making sure they have plenty of power for the ~35 year cruise from Earth to Wolf 359. 

10: Spaceplane. Obviously, there will be more than one on the hab module, but I put it there so you'd know where it's going

What do you think of the  (Still rough) design of the Starship?

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3 hours ago, Spaceception said:

I said it was really rough :) Also, I wanted windows so they wouldn't turn into religious cult crazies thinking the ship was fake and all that (That might make for an interesting story, focusing on that, but no) .

I also forgot that a Medusa Starship had to be designed backwards in a way :D

What about 17%? Also, I intended for the crew to be awake the entire time, not asleep.

Also, I wanted the "Anti-matter catalyzed NPP Medusa sail" Because I wanted to be creative with my story, instead of using clichés such as using Proxima as the parent star, or some sort of slow ship that requires generations of people/

Earth 2 is near the inner edge of the HZ, and Earth 3 is just outside of it, plus there are other planets that could help stabilize things.

I was considering putting a dwarf gas giant in, I might do that.

That's what I intended :)

Well the rocket equation will give you an dV of 2.3*1000 km/s using an medusa and 10/1 mass faction. Should be simple the bombs are heavy and easy to store. 
Problem is that this is only 0.76% of c. 

With anti matter plasma core you can get 2.3*7800 km/s and 10/1 mass faction or 6% of c, 3 in practice as you need to brake. 

http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/enginelist.php#amplasma
http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/enginelist.php#id--Pulse--Orion

 

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7 minutes ago, magnemoe said:

Well the rocket equation will give you an dV of 2.3*1000 km/s using an medusa and 10/1 mass faction. Should be simple the bombs are heavy and easy to store. 
Problem is that this is only 0.76% of c. 

With anti matter plasma core you can get 2.3*7800 km/s and 10/1 mass faction or 6% of c, 3 in practice as you need to brake. 

http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/enginelist.php#amplasma
http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/enginelist.php#id--Pulse--Orion

 

Okay, then the Medusa is too slow for my purposes, so... A pure Anti-Matter rocket then, I could easily get to 17% c, I just don't know how much Anti-Matter I'll need for it.

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1 hour ago, Spaceception said:

Okay, then the Medusa is too slow for my purposes, so... A pure Anti-Matter rocket then, I could easily get to 17% c, I just don't know how much Anti-Matter I'll need for it.

I have two questions.

 

1. How would you store antimatter? Would it basically go inside a normal fuel tank which has supermagnets added to it, ie a magnetic containment field?

2. Is there really a need for a navigation module? Ideally you want to cut weight where possible, so I think it would make sense to have a single command and control center, all of your systems are likely to be digital anyways, so have a computer control the ship's path/acceleration/systems, etc. 

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12 minutes ago, Halo_003 said:

I have two questions.

 

1. How would you store antimatter? Would it basically go inside a normal fuel tank which has supermagnets added to it, ie a magnetic containment field?

2. Is there really a need for a navigation module? Ideally you want to cut weight where possible, so I think it would make sense to have a single command and control center, all of your systems are likely to be digital anyways, so have a computer control the ship's path/acceleration/systems, etc. 

Magnetic containment field.

I guess not, but seeing as I'll have to completely redesign the Starship, my old design is outdated :)

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7 hours ago, Spaceception said:

Also, I wanted windows so they wouldn't turn into religious cult crazies thinking the ship was fake and all that (That might make for an interesting story, focusing on that, but no) .

That's not really useful when you need to go as fast as you can. 1 year spent on the ship (by the crew) is not enough time for them to become religious crazies if they are selected properly, rather than selecting entirely conspiracy theorists.

A window might be useful for observations, but you really need a manned lander to make the trip worth it.

7 hours ago, Spaceception said:

Earth 2 is near the inner edge of the HZ, and Earth 3 is just outside of it, plus there are other planets that could help stabilize things.

Only problem is that the habitable zones of smaller stars are narrower. I can't see this working unless you gave them alternate planet types (like we did to Venus in the alt.) or alternate biology (using ammonia, for example) for them to have life. Also, they'd be tidally locked. Have fun! (tidal locking tends to screw life over) :rolleyes:

8 hours ago, Spaceception said:

What about 17%? Also, I intended for the crew to be awake the entire time, not asleep.

Also, I wanted the "Anti-matter catalyzed NPP Medusa sail" Because I wanted to be creative with my story, instead of using clichés such as using Proxima as the parent star, or some sort of slow ship that requires generations of people/

That raises the question of Gs. How high are the Gs for the acceleration of the spacecraft? Is it comfortable for the crew?

7 hours ago, Spaceception said:
18 hours ago, fredinno said:

 

I know, but 1, Wolf 359 is more stable than say Proxima, and 2 if the planet has a strong magnetic field (And is lucky enough), it could survive its parent stars' wild activity long enough for the star to stabilize.

You'd need a REALLY good field for that. I'd recommend gas giant exomoons, or super-earths.

4 hours ago, Spaceception said:

1: Medusa sail. The sail is made out of Graphene, for strength.

2: Cables. The cables connecting the sail to the ship is made from Carbon nanotubes

3: The directional tube for the bombs. Again, these are made of Carbon nanotubes, with a magnetic confinement system

4: Bomb package. the bomb package contains all of the bombs for the acceleration/deceleration parts of the mission

5: Radiation shield. The radiation shield is 5 meters thick with saltwater, and protects the crew from radiation sickness

6: The habitat modules. The habitat modules contain the life support systems, crew quarters, and miscellaneous stuff such as a mess hall, and rec area (I'll be going into more detail with these later)

7: Capula. The capula is for making sure the crew doesn't go crazy thinking they're still on Earth and whatnot

8: Navigation. This module is for making sure they don't end up at the center of the Milky Way

9: Nuclear reactor/radiators. These nuclear reactors are for making sure they have plenty of power for the ~35 year cruise from Earth to Wolf 359. 

10: Spaceplane. Obviously, there will be more than one on the hab module, but I put it there so you'd know where it's going

What do you think of the  (Still rough) design of the Starship?

A capsule is more mass-effiecient, unless it's something like Skylon.

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8 minutes ago, fredinno said:
8 minutes ago, fredinno said:

That's not really useful when you need to go as fast as you can. 1 year spent on the ship (by the crew) is not enough time for them to become religious crazies if they are selected properly, rather than selecting entirely conspiracy theorists.

A window might be useful for observations, but you really need a manned lander to make the trip worth it.

Only problem is that the habitable zones of smaller stars are narrower. I can't see this working unless you gave them alternate planet types (like we did to Venus in the alt.) or alternate biology (using ammonia, for example) for them to have life. Also, they'd be tidally locked. Have fun! (tidal locking tends to screw life over) :rolleyes:

That raises the question of Gs. How high are the Gs for the acceleration of the spacecraft? Is it comfortable for the crew?

You'd need a REALLY good field for that. I'd recommend gas giant exomoons, or super-earths.

A capsule is more mass-effiecient, unless it's something like Skylon.

 

It's a 33-37 year trip.

It's supposed to be a colony ship.

I'll mess with inclinations, also, day/night cycles can be on habitable planets around red dwarfs,

Luck?

It'll be something like Skylon.

1-2 g continued acceleration.

I won't be able to reply to much in a while, my mom needs my computer :)

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6 hours ago, Spaceception said:

It's a 33-37 year trip.

It's supposed to be a colony ship.

I'll mess with inclinations, also, day/night cycles can be on habitable planets around red dwarfs,

Luck?

It'll be something like Skylon.

1-2 g continued acceleration.

I won't be able to reply to much in a while, my mom needs my computer :)

For the planet it will be tidal locked, it might still have an wobble like moon have, making it an moon or have an double planet will give you an day night cycle. 

For the lander, you have fusion, you use an thermal turbojet in the atmosphere fusion then outside, might add some reaction mass if your pure fusion TWR is too low, also for final decent on bodies without air.
If you can build an starship, vtol orbital crafts are old and boring technology. 
Make it like DC-X, but with jets along the rim, you might also want an plane with the same technology for trips, it also need to have vtol functionality think F35, it will however have far lower payload capacity than the dropship. 

 

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You want to slow down?

Yes: put 34% of light speed as the deltav in the Dv equation, put your empty mass in the correct spot, and get an estimate of the Isp of an antimatter drive. Solve for total mass.

No: do the same, but use 17% as deltav

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