how to get this into orbit.

[putnamto]

my plan is to get this to the mun in a few easy steps.

1. strap it to a big enough rocket to get an HKO
2. send another rocket to refuel the first rocket.
3. fly first rocket to mun.
4. land.

im going to strap horizontal engines on this to assist with landing it but im in a connundrum. the crane arm is to big to fit into a fairing. it can be folded up to fit but this isnt possible in the VAB.

ive had two ideas,
1 send the main part of the vehicle in one launch, then send the crane part with the refueler and attach them in orbit with construction ports, this i think is my most sound idea(i think)
2 take the entire thing apart and layer it like a sandwich inside of the fairing then peice it together in orbit.

any ideas guys?

[StrandedonEarth]

You don't have to have a fairing. Brute force it straight up and turn to the horizon at around 40-50km. Inefficient but effective.

Balance problems? Launch 2, one on each side.

[putnamto]

ok, i can get it to orbit kerbin.

how do i force the construction ports to only attach in one orientation though? i was able to dock effectively but the crane module was upside down, after undocking to try and flip it i ran out of monoprop.

[Geonovast]

1 minute ago, putnamto said:

how do i force the construction ports to only attach in one orientation though

Use this.  Lets you rotate after it's docked, and is more precise than the Konstruction rotate.

Leave the rotation snap OFF on the construction ports, dock like they're regular ports, rotate slowly, then weld when it's where you want it.

Edited April 17, 2018 by Geonovast

[putnamto]

im not upping to 1.4.1 yet, i dont want to lose some mods that i love.

i see on the github theirs a version of the mod for 1.3.1, do you think this one also supports the konstruction ports?

[Geonovast]

3 minutes ago, putnamto said:

i see on the github theirs a version of the mod for 1.3.1, do you think this one also supports the konstruction ports?

It should, I'm still playing 1.3.1 and it works fine with the Konstruction ports.

Using Konstruction 0.3.0.0 and DockRotate 1.3.1.4, works fine together.

[putnamto]

4 hours ago, Geonovast said:

It should, I'm still playing 1.3.1 and it works fine with the Konstruction ports.

Using Konstruction 0.3.0.0 and DockRotate 1.3.1.4, works fine together.

this worked like a charm, but it wont let me weld the parts now, it says this port is the root port. i dont even?

[Gargamel]

1 hour ago, putnamto said:

it says this port is the root port.

Been there, done that.  When you built the ship, you used a docking part as a root part.   Probably when you attached the lifter from the subassembly, the docking port on the lifter was a root part.  You can't delete a root part in an active vessel.

Unless somebody comes up with a solution to rerooting inflight, you're SOL.  Just do what I did, and learn from the mistake.....

[putnamto]

4 minutes ago, Gargamel said:

Been there, done that.  When you built the ship, you used a docking part as a root part.   Probably when you attached the lifter from the subassembly, the docking port on the lifter was a root part.  You can't delete a root part in an active vessel.

Unless somebody comes up with a solution to rerooting inflight, you're SOL.  Just do what I did, and learn from the mistake.....

its not the root part though, i reloaded the save and checked the vehicle in the VAB the probe core is the root

what i read in the Konstruction topic is that if you send a craft up with two mated docking ports, and you undock them the dock closes to the original root becomes the new root.
 
if i cant find a solution im just going to cheat a copy of the thing up their and call it a day.

[maja]

26 minutes ago, putnamto said:

if i cant find a solution im just going to cheat a copy of the thing up their and call it a day.

Can't you use KAS/KIS to attach the crane to the body when it's landed on the Mun?

[putnamto]

1 minute ago, maja said:

Can't you use KAS/KIS to attach the crane to the body when it's landed on the Mun?

never thought about that, i may try it.

 

[Mikki]

You can use KIS and KAS, aswell as DockRotate! Works awesome!

[maja]

1 hour ago, putnamto said:

never thought about that, i may try it.

 

Try it. I'm able to assemble entire base with KAS, USI Konstruction and one Kerbal. When you learn how to do it, then it's fun. Look at this: https://imgur.com/a/Mm0HG

[putnamto]

10 hours ago, maja said:

Try it. I'm able to assemble entire base with KAS, USI Konstruction and one Kerbal. When you learn how to do it, then it's fun. Look at this: https://imgur.com/a/Mm0HG

The  construction  vehicle  with  the  legs  is  to  buggy  for  me  to  use its  physics  freak  out  all  the  time

[maja]

14 minutes ago, putnamto said:

The  construction  vehicle  with  the  legs  is  to  buggy  for  me  to  use its  physics  freak  out  all  the  time

This is from KSP 1.3.1. I didn't tested it in the latest version yet, but it was freaking a little bit back then. The solution is to deploy legs before landing and have them as wide as possible. It's better on the Mun then on the Kerbin.

[putnamto]

*sigh* for once i would like to have a headache free moment with this game.

so i get this into a 80k ap, 75k pe orbit, i have 3k+dv left, i set my manuever for my mun burn, the manuever says 800dv, i do my burn aaaaaaaaaaaand im out of dv  and not even halfway their.

the strange thing is the green meter on the right of my nav ball decreases slower than my mechjeb dv reading, this has happened twice while manual piloting, and also twice when letting mechjeb do the burn.

what is up with this?

just tried again, my navball said 800 dv for the burn and 22 seconds, mechjeb said i had 4800 dv left.

as soon as i started the burn the timer jumped to almost 4 minutes but the navball dv total didnt change, this burn actually made it to the mun but with only 700 dv left.

what do you think im doing wrong this time?

Edited April 20, 2018 by putnamto

[blakemw]

The way I would do it is to add a pair of boosters to the side of the vehicle so it can deliver itself through some 1000m/s or so (note: I always do tail-first landings, and land using a procedure I call a "hover-tip" which is what it sounds like, works well on low-gravity worlds, so the boosters should point tailwards rather than down).

Then I would strap the entire thing to the *base* of a Twin-Boar SSTO, at the base it won't cause center-of-pressure problems and the Twin-Boar will have no troubles delivering it to orbit, probably Mun's orbit, a Twin-Boar can get quite a bit dV out of a single stage if the payload mass is negligible. If you want extra dV can add some hammers to give the launcher a bit of a kick off the pad, they get decoupled before the drag starts to ramp up.

 

Btw I have a suspicion the probe core has the wrong rotation, vehicles kind of work when the probe core is facing up, but they work a lot better when it's facing forward.

Edited April 20, 2018 by blakemw

[putnamto]

ive gotten it to a high munar orbit with 1.9k dv left and my manuevers are still acting weird.

unless 1994-380=-142 my math may be off, but last i checked thats....well way off.

[blakemw]

Complex vessels can be confusing for deltaV calculators. They are not perfect. That's one of the merits of very simple serial staging, you'll get deltaV values of utmost trustability.

Edited April 20, 2018 by blakemw

[putnamto]

4 minutes ago, blakemw said:

Complex vessels can be confusing for deltaV calculators. They are not perfect. That's one of the merits of very simple serial staging, you'll get deltaV values of utmost trustability.

I  figured  that  much, that's  why  I  simplified  my  craft  to  the  point  where  the  launcher  stage  is  just  the  engine, fuel  tanks  and  srbs.

Then  the  transfer/lander  stage  is  just  the  payload, a fuel  tank, a  terrier  and  the  landing  gear.

I  had 1994 dv  left  in  my  lander  stage  and  when  I  set  up  my  maneuver  for  landing  it  said 300 dv.

Comparing  mechjeb  dv to  the  maneuvers  dv, I'm  burning  at  a  rate  of 10-1, for  every  one  tick  of  dv  on  the  maneuver  mechjeb  is  going 10.

Ill  post  pictures  of  the  simplified  version  later  today.

[blakemw]

It could be that MJ is assuming you are going to decouple some mass which according to MJ's calculations is dead mass (like a spent booster), this can especially happen when the root part isn't in the final stage, something which always makes dV estimations wildly inaccurate.

Edited April 20, 2018 by blakemw

[putnamto]

4 minutes ago, blakemw said:

It could be that MJ is assuming you are going to decouple some mass which according to MJ's calculations is dead mass (like a spent booster), this can especially happen when the root part isn't the final stage, something which always makes dV estimations wildly inaccurate.

  that's probably it, above  the  root  is  a  decoupler  with  the  payload, the  payload  has  no  engines  besides  monoprop.

Lol, this  is  literally  the  fourth  construction  vehicle  I've  left  floating  in  space.

[putnamto]

https://imgur.com/a/aVeUVMi

heres an album of all my attempts.

im going to go back to square one and retry the making orbit, then refueling idea i had in the begining.

any suggestions on a good refuelling ship design?

[putnamto]

you ever just want to say love this game and uninstal it

[putnamto]

*claps like a moron*

i built a bran new launcher completely from scratch, launched, made orbit, transfered to the mun and landed, WITH NO RELOADS!!

this crane is awesome, but a bugger to use lol, if i have the magnet power to high and pick something up the velocity can almost send it back into orbit.

and its not very useful for picking up tiny things.

https://imgur.com/a/7K5BpMe

thank you everyone for your helpful input and suggestions, you are all greatly appreciated.

EDIT: and i learned a much easier, more practical way to land on the mun, i used to circularize my orbit to high then drop my pe below the ground and burn a crap ton of fuel to land.
this time i had a 10k circular orbit, then just burned retro lock at my pe and landed with 300 dv to spare.

 

Edited April 21, 2018 by putnamto