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Kerbal Space Program 1.10.1 is live!

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On 7/28/2020 at 1:23 PM, dok_377 said:

Hollow fairings are not fixed, flag bodylift isn't fixed, flag colliders are not fixed either, even the fuel transfer is not fixed. Really? Like, really. I can understand why the first three might not be considered significant enough, but the last one? The fuel transfer which isn't working properly? One of the core features of the game. This is not funny. 

The fuel transfer bug https://bugs.kerbalspaceprogram.com/issues/25680 is annoying as mentioned.  Wish this bug would get fixed sooner. What I found for a work that seems faster then the other work arounds mentioned is to go into game settings advanced tab, and do a turn off/turn on cycle of the "Parts transfer obeys  crossfeed rules" setting. Need to save the setting between on/off. 

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On 7/28/2020 at 9:03 PM, James M said:

So dok_377 mentioned the fuel lines are still not fixed... Can anyone else confirm this? I'm not saying he's wrong but I'm not exactly close to my PC to check. I'd like to play KSP again if they are fixed as I have a DOMA mission postponed until further notice no thanks to that bug. 

Did you read the bug? There's a simple workaround. I appreciate that @dok_377 is irritated at it not being fixed, but the devs have limited resources, and when there's a simple workaround like timewarping a second, that makes it a pretty low severity issue. Whereas fairings were just plain broken in modded installs.

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On 7/28/2020 at 3:08 PM, dok_377 said:

Half of the confirmed bugs are not fixed. As usual. 

Half?

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4 minutes ago, XLjedi said:

Half?

I'm trying to be somewhat nice here. It's not half. Not even half of the half. 

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9 minutes ago, dok_377 said:

I'm trying to be somewhat nice here. It's not half. Not even half of the half. 

You are a scholar and a gentle-kerbal.

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On 8/1/2020 at 7:27 AM, linuxgurugamer said:

There is a small mod by @sarbian called DebugStuff which will display the transform colliders, sounds like exactly what you need

A part's colliders have nothing to do with drag cubes for a part.

I've heard some talk of drag cube issues. But the only one I can find in the bug tracker is the engine plates. Which have been fixed in 1.10.1.

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On 7/28/2020 at 5:35 PM, JPLRepo said:

It was. Though should be fixed now. But I can't guarantee what might happen with various mods.

Basically there was a change made in 1.10.0 for open ended fairings that caused issue for all mod fairings. Which has now been resolved in 1.10.1.

Has that been reported on the bug tracker? first I've heard of it.

I'll have to test the mods in question.  I should see if it's been fixed by this change first. 

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On 8/1/2020 at 10:23 AM, panarchist said:

Did you read the bug? There's a simple workaround. I appreciate that @dok_377 is irritated at it not being fixed, but the devs have limited resources, and when there's a simple workaround like timewarping a second, that makes it a pretty low severity issue. Whereas fairings were just plain broken in modded installs.

The timewarp workaround only fixes one third of the effects the change caused.  The other two effects it does not fix are: {1} One-to-Many transfers involving 3 or more tanks don't work anymore, making fuel balancing impossible; {2} It broke the use of fuel hoses to route around blockages like heat shields, meaning you now must play with that difficulty option turned off, as its rules are broken.)  These are problems in *stock* gameplay, not even modded.

Unlike dok_377, I don't mind that the fix didn't come out immediately.  It's probably an issue with dirty cached data and those can be hard to trace without just throwing away the entire caching idea entirely.  But I do want to quash this narrative that says it's low severity because of the workaround.  The workaround doesn't really fix all the issues this change caused, so please don't move it to the backburner.

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On 7/29/2020 at 5:08 AM, dok_377 said:

Half of the confirmed bugs are not fixed. As usual. 

Give them a break, they work really hard on this and have a lot on their plate, and prioritise the biggest issues first

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11 hours ago, Sad+Lonely said:

and prioritise the biggest issues first

Fuel transfer is not the biggest issue, huh. You said it, not me. 

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16 hours ago, Sad+Lonely said:

Give them a break, they work really hard on this and have a lot on their plate, and prioritise the biggest issues first

 

4 hours ago, dok_377 said:

Fuel transfer is not the biggest issue, huh. You said it, not me. 

My best guess is that they still haven’t found the solution. Some big bugs take a while to fix. Maybe you can direct them a solution or find the cause of the bug. Or like what I do, find a way around it. For example I encountered a bug yesterday that made construction of the rocket harder. What I did was just adjust where I was placing parts (since the bug was when hovering over the fairing the rocket boosters move with it)

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On 8/5/2020 at 5:20 PM, Steven Mading said:

The timewarp workaround only fixes one third of the effects the change caused.  The other two effects it does not fix are: {1} One-to-Many transfers involving 3 or more tanks don't work anymore, making fuel balancing impossible; {2} It broke the use of fuel hoses to route around blockages like heat shields, meaning you now must play with that difficulty option turned off, as its rules are broken.)  These are problems in *stock* gameplay, not even modded.

Unlike dok_377, I don't mind that the fix didn't come out immediately.  It's probably an issue with dirty cached data and those can be hard to trace without just throwing away the entire caching idea entirely.  But I do want to quash this narrative that says it's low severity because of the workaround.  The workaround doesn't really fix all the issues this change caused, so please don't move it to the backburner.

Ah - yeah, that would definitely be a problem. I mean, you could still work around the 3+ tanks issue, but it would be a real pain in the neck. I'm feeling like the remaining issues might spawn a .2 release - it's been a while since they did that.

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Asking anyone out there but has anyone had the parts suddenly no exist out of nowhere in your game. Like one quicksave later they're all gone?

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3 hours ago, bishobe644 said:

now when does console get the update

 

Considering we still haven't gotten the ducted fans on console yet sometime between next year and never.

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Posted (edited)
On 7/28/2020 at 3:23 PM, dok_377 said:

Hollow fairings are not fixed, flag bodylift isn't fixed, flag colliders are not fixed either, even the fuel transfer is not fixed. Really? Like, really. I can understand why the first three might not be considered significant enough, but the last one? The fuel transfer which isn't working properly? One of the core features of the game. This is not funny. 

Please tell me someone put at least 1000 flags onto a ship to get into orbit. You could make a flying base with it.

Haven't done flying bases in ages. I used to have a ship that could float across duna. It was great. I want one of those to exist again. They make great surface explorers and delivery ships. Could go good with a massive hauler ship to deliver goods. If only we had bases to deliver too.

Edited by Arugela

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I know I'm just screaming into the wind here, but since a 1.10.2 release is obviously not coming, I'd like to officially request that 1.11 just be bug fixes? Just fix bugs. We don't need a lot of new stuff - at least not as much as we need bug fixes. I know that the partnership with the Indian Space Research Organization for 1.11, or whatever the plan is, is expected to gain a lot of Twitter follows, but please just do a release where you just fix existing stuff and you don't introduce a lot of new stuff that will just break more existing stuff.

I know there is no way that's going to happen. I know the bean counters will never let it happen. I especially know it's more fun to work on new stuff instead of fixing stuff someone else broke. I know whatever lowly employee ends up reading this isn't just powerless to make it happen - they're also powerless to tell me "nah we're not going to do that." But I just wanted to log the request for the record.

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19 minutes ago, decimal-simplex said:

... I'd like to officially request that 1.11 just be bug fixes? Just fix bugs. We don't need a lot of new stuff ...

I agree, and we've been saying exactly this for years. Definitely since 1.0

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1 hour ago, decimal-simplex said:

I know I'm just screaming into the wind here, but since a 1.10.2 release is obviously not coming, I'd like to officially request that 1.11 just be bug fixes? Just fix bugs.

You are so spot on with this comment.

I think it was manageable for a while but now you can see minor and major bugs in every single corner of the game.

Well said....hope they listen...i really do.

Edited by Boyster

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4 hours ago, decimal-simplex said:

I'd like to officially request that 1.11 just be bug fixes?

As much as I love bug fixes, remember that not all the devs are programmers.

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3 hours ago, Boyster said:

hope they listen...i really do.

Lol. We've been asking for a bugfix-only no-new-stuff release for years.
What we get, every single time, is a release with a bunch of SNS and a bunch of new bugs, a hotfix or two that almost but not quite get it into a reasonable state, then silence until the next major release full of unasked-for new stuff and more new bugs.

 

2 minutes ago, Deddly said:

remember that not all the devs are programmers.

So throw some new textures in there if that's what needs to happen, just don't introduce broken new features, and don't break existing ones. Put the programmers on the bugs, not implementing half-baked new mechanics or facilitating glow in the dark suits.

The only reason people ask for a buxfix release is because major releases have been, for several years now, consistently introducing as many (or more) bugs as they fix.
Stop dropping obviously broken and inadequately tested .0 releases and stop walking away from regressions (fuel transfer anyone?) to wait for more shiny content, and people will stop asking.


When we say "stop with the new stuff, just fix the bugs", what we mean is "bugs clearly aren't getting the priority we think they should, please focus on them".
That's with the unwritten assumption that Squad actually has competent programmers who could fix the bugs, but are being diverted to other things or rushed into introducing technical debt.
If that diversion is supporting some other aspect of the team, then somebody needs to look closely at the composition of their workforce and the tasks they are being assigned to, because product quality is suffering for it.
If there truly is a lack of manpower or time, then releases need to be delayed until they can be tested and the bugs fixed. It's not rocket science, it's project management.
 

Game settings have not applied properly on startup on GNU/Linux since 1.7.3, and joystick support was broken for a similarly ludicrous length of time. Fuel transfer looks like it isn't going to be fixed before the next major release, despite it being a longstanding and much-used core feature.
Is this situation because "not all the devs are programmers" too?

It seems to me far more likely someone cares more about shiny new stuff than about fixing regressions, but then I can only judge from what I see, no?
What I see is comets, which nobody asked for, old bugs going unfixed, and new bugs now also going unfixed.

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Fair enough. 

I do like the comets, though. 

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6 minutes ago, Deddly said:

I do like the comets

So do I, I'd just much rather have working fuel transfer and settings that actually set.
All three of those things need programmer hours, no prizes for guessing which ones I'd like to see them spent on.

Edited by steve_v

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46 minutes ago, steve_v said:

So do I, I'd just much rather have working fuel transfer and settings that actually set.
All three of those things need programmer hours, no prizes for guessing which ones I'd like to see them spent on.

Yeah I do know the feeling. I too have my "pet bugs" that seriously affect my gameplay, and I know what it's like when others don't seem to think it's an issue. Hold in there, I expect they'll get there in the end, just in a different order of priority than yours or mine. 

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