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Dientus

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    So what song is stuck in your head today?

    in The Lounge

    Posted

    Yes! I am going to watch this movie again next!

    1 hour ago, adsii1970 said:

    Yes, the entire soundtrack was by Queen.

    Another rock band also wrote an entire soundtrack - Toto:

     

    I ran out of likes :blush2:

     

    I will let the next song that popped into my head marinade for a little bit so I don't hog the thread ;p

    Common sense, Litigation, and Hot Coffee

    in The Lounge

    Posted

    21 minutes ago, DeadJohn said:

    I already wrote "The costs of cleanup are so high that government has to step in when the people at fault can't be fined enough to pay for it." After a business goes bankrupt due to the cost of cleanup, someone still needs to pay for the rest of the remediation.

    .

    If you have ever dealt with bankruptcy Court you know the judge has to okay your bankruptcy. Doubly so with a business, and not being able to "afford something" is not always a valid reason a lot of the time. There exists many examples where small businesses have polluted the land and EPA fines cannot be removed and they cannot be dismissed through bankruptcy, this I have seen in can cite an example if you need one.

     

    To continue, In my true to life example of an individual, this person had no option to go bankrupt there was no choice. They were forced to pay a certain amount regardless. And that is what I am saying can be applied to big business as well. The government paying for the cleanup is like the company taking out a loan and them making the payments back to the government is to pa y back that loan for their own mess so that they are responsible. Another example, even though the cause was different, the bailouts of 2008. They are an exact example of what I mean where corporations took bail out money (loan) from the government, however had to pay that money back over time. I see no difference in application for toxic spills and there are many examples where big corporations took money from the government to later pay them back...  so we may end up having to agree to disagree on this one.

     

    25 minutes ago, DeadJohn said:

    I agree that happens and it is a bad thing. We disagree on the cause, though. You seem to be blaming government because it's too powerful. I blame a government that doesn't exert its power enough, to imprison the people in charge of grossly misbehaving businesses.

    Maybe I didn't word what I was trying to say correctly, while yes I am against big government, in my examples I don't blame the government being too big I blame the law not being applied equally to all parties involved. Because the corporation is big enough to fund campaigns, and pay people to sit at the Capitol building and lobby for what is in their best interest, with the government being so big that it can act independently of its people which the government of USA can and does very often do ever since world war II, this is what I believe to be a big Factor. If the government were truly applying the law equally to everyone and doing its best to act upon the word of the people, then big corporations would be held more liable.

     

    But I fear even in my ideal scenario, the businesses would truly never pay all of it themselves instead it would still fall on the buyers of their goods and or services. However this would help close up a lot of loopholes and rid some of the unchecked power that the government and corporations who fund it have.

     

    Admittedly no solution is perfect because you always have that wild card thing called a human involved, but people being held accountable, and understanding what they are responsible for, self-responsibility and common Sense, then I honestly believe it would be far better than it currently is.

     

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