Ziv

hehe, why?

Hi, 1, Hardest question of all. LLL is best for big Expedition-like missions but have a lot of part which have advantages to the general stock parts. But NovaPunch has a small nuke too... and with LLL parts it would look very different. But it's fun to play. So it can give many advantages but can be big fun... hard decision. Okay, let's do it, it's allowed! 2, Good question. No, it has to be a fully reusable one. 3, Just to make people think about points, fuel weights, etc... it's just a little trap. But at the end most of the people will use it anyway, I guess. 4, Yes, FAR can be used. Hm, yes, good idea with the tonnage penalty! And so you doesn't have to optimize launches into big ones.

SCIENTISTS HAVE FOUND A NEW RESOURCE: KETHANE!

...aaand prepare for.... the Kethane JOOL-5 Challenge!

teh_orph: you long time lurker and first time JOOL-5 mission poster! Nice (and complex) job, you made me confused about my own rules! Not only with the Command Seats but with the rescue mission too! I considered the rescue mission like a refueling with spare seats... and highly ethic that you didn't let your Kerbals float in the space helplessly! And for the Command Seats, well... at first I would have said it's not too elegant to sit your Kerbals in the Space for 833 days without at least a little warm Pod (not to mention a Hitch-hiker Unit with Board Games and Toothbrushes)! But the mandatory Command Pod rule is written only for the low-mass sub-challenge and anyway: this Challenge is about making this huge mission on low-budget and hey, you nailed that one out to the maximum! And the Kerbals knew this before assigning to this mission so I accept this solution. But to put their head into the fuel tank well... you tortured them well. I really like to see a version with ion engines! You are the first one. And this allowed you to have a small ship like this and visit other bodies too, pretty cool (and patient) solution. That was funny that you were not able to brake into orbit around Gilly! Yeah, deltaV is not everything, you need a reasonable TWR/burning time too. I also saw your design flaws but it's usually like this: you only realize some things on the field only. Good job, thank you for participating!

yeah sorry, I didn't see the word 'back'. By the original challenge rules you had to bring back all the scientific instruments which required a lot of effort like placement, more fuel, parachutes and landing back them at Kerbin, and most importantly: lot of parts. So it was very hard to do and needed a lot of parts which could lead to bad lagging. So I gave the opportunity to bring less scientific parts and a Mobile Lab for lower part count but yes, you need to bring back the lab to keep it in balance somewhat...

Hey, your question came in the best time because I'm planning to start a Kethane version in this challenge too (in normal levels Kethane is not present). For the Kethane version the Science Lab will be optional only (but for extra points). MechJeb is allowed in normal and Kethane versions too.

This lamp is cool, thanks! Yeah, I know I still owe you all a Kethane version... I was just too busy and cannot prepare it well yet.

Hm, nobody used Xenon engines yet in any JOOL-5 mission so I'm very interested in your experiences! Can you tell us more with pictures too?

if you install enhanced navball it could help, did you try it? You may use the TAC Fuel Balancer too if there's balance problems... but OK, you can send an other similar lander with probe if you want it very much.

Congratulation Cupcake for finishing the JOOL-5 mission, and for the funny movies!! Wasn't your Kerbal afraid standing next to the launch pad? That's dangerous, didn't you tell him? Very creative main ship, lander, piloted tug and rovers by the way. I loved to see them, this is why I started this Challenge.. to see and share great ideas! Maybe you should have started with the smaller moons if you put the whole ship in and out of orbit every time. I loved your little rover probes with the camera on the front too. What mods did you use for that and for the clip making? And literally bombing off half of your main ship with the tug to save weight is just hilarious and awesome. The dresscode is Spacesuit, and no need for snacks, this party is on me! Great stuff!!!

sdj64: Nice job with the 56 tons plane version for the low-mass challenge! the part clipping was discussed... and yeah, I guess you had a lot of trouble with the lander that way. But otherwise nice try with the limits of the game. I liked your radio antenna landing gear! And good idea to land high at Laythe with the nuke. And most importantly: great one with the wings!! What was your weight in orbit? Nice job, you are in the Hall of Fame for the low-mass challenge too with impressive 56 tons!

Mesklin: Congratulation, you lead the leaderboard for the Level3 sub-challenge for now with 51t! Really impressive! Yeah, a small lander and a lot of little refueling modules is a must in this kind of a mission. Good job! BTW I almost finished my mission and if the fuel will be enough to return then I'm going to beat your 51t!

Mr. Rocket: congratulation for finishing the JOOL-5 mission! Again. - at first, painting the ships made this mission look very unique! - I loved that moveable EVA light on Tylo! - I enjoyed your approach with the numerous refueling missions... one or two made it anyway! And I'm sorry for the other ones...

Hello again everybody, I'm sorry for the radio silence, I had internet issues. But I'm back and I'm going to comment/add every new finished JOOL-5 misson!

Oh yeah, I had no time for that yet but will definitely start the Kethane version of this challenge next week!! I don't have the details yet but I guess it would be good to have an optimization one (like the low-mass one but maybe with more rules/goals), a general point-collecting one and a mostly freestyle one. Let me know your ideas on this! (I know you already had some, I kept that in mind! )

Yeah, unbalanced ships can cause a lot of trouble (and are very inefficient at deltaV/fuel too). I hope you will be able to manage this!

WOW, that's very impressive!!! My version is already in the 70-80 tons range but still tweaking the launcher vehicle. But I hated to see you already beaten that! > And it's the same for this mission as mentioned before: I can't watch pictures/videos until next week but I will answer and update the stats too, sorry for the delay!!

Mr.Rocket: congratulation for finishing your JOOL-5 mission! I can't watch all the pictures now becaue I'm with a USB stick internet right now with only some hundred Mb left until Monday and I have to save, like fuel for the level1 sub-challenge (hopefully I will get the broadband on Monday...I just moved home). So I will review your mission in details then, too!

OMG maybe that's the most orange fuels I saw for this... expect VERY LONG burning times, and that if you bring one orange tank, it will be 2/3 empty when you arrive at Jool. If you bring 100 of them, 2/3 of them will be empty at arrival, because they need to spend fuel to move their own mass (=fuel). But, of course, more orange tanks mean more 1/3 fuels remaining! For the deltaV between moons, expect something like this: deltaV stats of my first mission (not always accurate! )

Hi again, sure, using Jets and wings is a good idea for the low mass subchallenge (I had this idea too). For a lander with nuke, did you consider that at Laythe it will be much less effective (deltaV) in the atmosphere? And I don't really like that you put the Nuke engine INTO the fuel tank. I didn't write any rule that you can't use such a solution and the subchallenge is about crazy daring solutions but this doesn't feel elegant for me. It's similar with the air intakes but I can accept that a little bit better. But please try to make "realistic" and elegant solutions. Your question is good about the order of moons. It depends... check the fuel consumption for both solution and the lowest version wins. And yes, the command pod is required only for the interplanetary travel, for the landings you don't have to use any. Edit: I saw you are about to finish the mission. Finish it if you can! Doing a JOOL-5 is a big accomplishment on its own, and being on the low-mass list is like a double fame!

Sure you can visit other bodies, that will impress the decision makers about the funding for future Kerbal Space Programs! Hm, but for Jebediah's level, it's kinda race for the science points for some people, so yes, please divide the science points between the Joolian system and the others planets! (SSSPutnik: no, I visited other bodies on level1, and ttnarg was the other one who visited others on level3 too, but nobody did that for Jebediah's level yet)

btw I'm working on my level1sub entry and I always feel I should make my lander look good too, even if I lose some dV... I'm close to launch my new version and I guess I will be able to make it under 100t! Or maybe much less, I had an idea today afternoon!

immelman: WOW, awesome mission, and you are the new leader on the board! This Low-Mass level1 sub-challenge started to be popular these days! This is interesting because landing on all the moons and coming back with one launch and no refueling is a pretty hard task on its own too! Nice mission planning and I really like your landing gear solution! Unique lander and looks good too. Very good job!

SSSPutnik, pretty nice Expedition-style mission, especially with the greenhouse and the rotating living section! I think it could be a level3 if you had a lot of Kerbals on the deck, but -as we discussed before - I will put this into the Other Solution list anyway because of the lot of modded/LLL parts. I really like the inner views from the cockpits! That's cool that you didn't refuel, especially at huge ships like this! Good job!