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"Plan Kappa" - A KSP graphic novel (Jeb is back in Chapter 53! Well, kinda.)

Parkaboy

By Parkaboy
in KSP1 Mission Reports

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Parkaboy

Parkaboy

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[quote name='Kuzzter']Go Bob go! So, what do you think is the fuel balance problem? Or maybe a better question: what do you know so far [I]is not [/I]the fuel balance problem?[/QUOTE]

I have no idea. The fuel lines are all in place, but for some reason they're not draining from the central tanks at the same rate. Temporary solution will be to forbid use of central tanks and drain to the radial ones as needed.
For some reason, there are also a couple of ladders missing. I'll have to build them at Yardstick Base and install via KAS.
Seriously, that thing is a deathtrap. Bob may be trying too hard to be brave, he should have many concerns. Especially with where it's going...
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Noname117

Noname117

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I might know what is going on here. Had similar problems with an old shuttle project. Here's the thread Kasuha made awhile back about fuel flow rules:

[URL="http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/64362-Fuel-Flow-Rules-%280-24-2%29?highlight=Kasuha"]http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/64362-Fuel-Flow-Rules-%280-24-2%29?highlight=Kasuha[/URL]

See if anything there defines the problem you are having. I do not know how much of it has been patched though.
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Parkaboy

Parkaboy

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[quote name='Noname117']I might know what is going on here. Had similar problems with an old shuttle project. Here's the thread Kasuha made awhile back about fuel flow rules:

[URL="http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/64362-Fuel-Flow-Rules-%280-24-2%29?highlight=Kasuha"]http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/threads/64362-Fuel-Flow-Rules-%280-24-2%29?highlight=Kasuha[/URL][/QUOTE]

Yeah, I really don't know what's the issue. I'll have to do some tests myself later.

[quote name='RandomRyan']I said the words with a deep (not so deep) voice.sounds cool (you should try it!)
So, any ETA on Vol.2?[/QUOTE]

Can't give an ETA, because while things are moving slowly right now, they'll move faster during summer break in a few weeks.
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Drethon

Drethon

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I have to say, while I might wish the story was written faster (but would rather keep seeing a quality story than rush you), I love the pacing within the story. It makes things feel epic as they build this program a piece at a time and we see the pieces coming together.
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  • 2 weeks later...
FyunchClick

FyunchClick

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Yay. And just as I'm back from my extended business trip and ready for some entertainment.

As to the fuel lines, did you ever figure out the imbalance. If you added the fuel lines without symmetry, see if the lines connect from and to same sized tanks. I noticed the flow rate seems to be influenced by the tanks it's connecting to, so if you link it to a different size fuel tank on that stack, it'll flow slower.

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Parkaboy

Parkaboy

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46 minutes ago, FyunchClick said:

Yay. And just as I'm back from my extended business trip and ready for some entertainment.

As to the fuel lines, did you ever figure out the imbalance. If you added the fuel lines without symmetry, see if the lines connect from and to same sized tanks. I noticed the flow rate seems to be influenced by the tanks it's connecting to, so if you link it to a different size fuel tank on that stack, it'll flow slower.

Well, here's what I know so far: the KSS Hardihood has a central stack of tanks, and four radial stacks of tanks. The engines are on the radial tanks. These draw fuel from the center stack via fuel lines, and the fuel lines are symmetric and correctly attached. The radial stacks draw fuel from the center stack all right, but when the center stack empties, two of the radial stacks, on one side, start drawing fuel from the other two. This shouldn't be possible, since it goes against the flow direction of the fuel lines. I think for some reason the radial tanks are crossing fuel with the center tanks they are directly attached with. Other than rebuilding the ship, the only solution I could find was to turn off the radial stacks and keep refueling the center stack from them manually. Hope that's enough.

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Parkaboy

Parkaboy

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4 minutes ago, Alchemist said:

Being wrong about plenty of time... Did he count it by Minmus days? Or did the anomalies escalate quickier than expected?

I'm sure Bill was counting by Kerbin days, since Yardstick Base is kept on KSC hours...

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Deddly

Deddly

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I like the design, especially the sideways-yet-correctly-oriented crew cabins. And it's a nice touch to have a Kerbal on EVA assembling the antennae. Very good piece of work, Parkaboy. We've missed you more than Jeb misses Bob,

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Alchemist

Alchemist

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20 minutes ago, Parkaboy said:

I'm sure Bill was counting by Kerbin days, since Yardstick Base is kept on KSC hours...

Well, it's easy to get carried away a bit when you have different daylight cycle... I even considered this for a base module.

And of course it rarely goes fully according to the plan in KSP

 

On the other note, for anomalous crossfeed on the other craft you might want to compare it to this bugreport. The anomaly in terms of craft file turned to be some parts link references appearing on the wrong stacks (and so draining fuel from one stack and giving it to the other as fantom fuel lines). You might try checking the craft/save file for this kind of mess.

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Starhawk

Starhawk

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Great update!  Thanks Parkaboy.

'Wrong on both counts.'  That sounds very ominous.  Like knowing Kerbin's going to end isn't ominous enough! :)

Now I'm seriously worried about the fates of two entire space programs.

Happy Concerned landings!

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Parkaboy

Parkaboy

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22 minutes ago, Alchemist said:

On the other note, for anomalous crossfeed on the other craft you might want to compare it to this bugreport. The anomaly in terms of craft file turned to be some parts link references appearing on the wrong stacks (and so draining fuel from one stack and giving it to the other as fantom fuel lines). You might try checking the craft/save file for this kind of mess.

Whoa, I think you nailed it. I have to check the persistence file, but it matches. Each radial stack has a reaction wheel on top, that coul be the root of the issue. Thanks!

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Alchemist

Alchemist

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15 minutes ago, Parkaboy said:

Each radial stack has a reaction wheel on top, that coul be the root of the issue. Thanks!

Well, I don't think it's SAS specifically that is to blame, but putting things on top of symmetric stacks seems to have quite an increased proportion of broken symmetry bugs (and this one seems to be a silent case of that - that is visually correct, but with crossfeed logic going haywire).
On the other hand, that craft (yes, it was N1 replica. It can't be built without problems on the first stage) was like the only case I've got such results... or at least the only only one I tracked down to such an anomaly not blamed on fuel lines (well, I blamed them initially, but it persisted without them) and just fixed by rebuilding. So congratulations on catching a rare bug! (Do we have an entomologist?)

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