2nd class citizen

[nosirrbro]

1 hour ago, AlamoVampire said:

Really? Another? Look squad is not a proper design house with the resources that come with it. They are a mexico based ADVERTISING FIRM FIRST!!!! They chose to use STEAM because THEY have the gear to deal with this kind of load. Keep also in mind its buggier than a swamp after a thunderstorm. 1.1 is nearing us, be patient.  I honestly think the most sour people about this are not wanting to test but just play.

I would imagine that KSP has shifted their priorities a bit, I can't imagine that advertising has made the company more money given the very high number of sales.

[Aetharan]

5 minutes ago, Xavven said:

1. Ugh... who orders a steak well-done? <smeagol> HE RUINS IT! </smeagol>

Hey, I happen to be a discerning carnivore who prefers to kill any potential parasites with fire before enjoying my meal, thank you very much.  Still, given that my brother prefers his meals in a state such that a few stitches and a good electrical shock might have them walking around again, I can understand your position on food.  That's side-stepping the purpose of the analogy anyway.  

30 minutes ago, SpacedCowboy said:

[snip] it's just when I bought KSP, Steam was not there yet

I feel for you there, if you'd have preferred to go with the method that was not yet available when you bought the game.  Still, while we wait for the main course, we can at least sit and enjoy our appetizers.  1.0.5 isn't dead yet, and there are still plenty of things to do in it before we update to the finished 1.1.

[Xavven]

Just now, Aetharan said:

Still, given that my brother prefers his meals in a state such that a few stitches and a good electrical shock might have them walking around again, I can understand your position on food.

LOL! I've certainly started enjoying my steaks rarer and rarer as I've gotten older. But yeah, I was just razzing ya. The intent of the analogy is not lost on me.

I said it in the last thread about this and I'll say it again... Squad really didn't realize how much of a PR disaster this decision would be. From a purely utilitarian standpoint, letting at least some people public beta-test is better than letting none beta-test, there's a much more powerful force at work here-- the harsh feelings that come with unequal treatment. Yeah sure, there's the "Squad don't owe you nothin!" argument, but if I gave everyone on this forum $5 except for Aetharan (because he has bad taste in food ) then I'm sure Aetharan would be mad.*

_{*I am not actually wealthy enough to do this.}

[Scotius]

I'm a bit sore - but i'll get over it the second i'll get my hands on 1.1. Still...fixing the patcher would be good thing *hinthint SQUAD*. THere would be no need for sour comments and attitude anymore.

[tater]

Yeah, I'm only playing on my macs (my gaming rig PC is long in the tooth and needs to be replaced), so the patcher has never worked for me, I only do full DLs.

[Raven Industries]

It's not really a PR disaster. SQUAD has hundreds of thousands, if not millions of buyers. The people who follow what SQUAD does (us) number at a few thousand, maybe a bit more. Assuming all others don't look in the Betas tab of steam (and I think that's a safe assumption), very few outside of this community will know about this. 

[godefroi]

1 hour ago, SpacedCowboy said:

Love your analogy here, it's just when I bought KSP, Steam was not there yet

There's two kinds of people. Those who bought after the game was available on Steam, and those who can transfer their keys to Steam.

Me, I bought on Steam, because the platform makes downloading easy and fast, and guarantees that I'll have access to the game even if the Squad download servers disappear. Squad clearly believes that this functionality is worth the cut that Valve takes, and I trust their judgement.

[AlanP]

My opinion on Squad. This is there first Game. The didn't have much of an idea what they where getting into. They created a great game. They get more organized and experienced as they progress in development. Just look at the inprovements in Dev notes over the past year. Look at how they are starting to plan their updates better. The make mistakes(from some peoples perspective) some times. They keep getting better at it every time.

Keep up the good work Squad!

[bonyetty]

6 hours ago, SpacedCowboy said:

Being a KSP store buyer from like,,, 3 years ago, I can't help feeling somewhat,,, segmented (no, I'm not going to use the big "S" word) Separated from the rest. I understand (basically) why Sqad can't present the 1.1 pre-release to everyone, but still, I feel a bit left out. Yeah, I'll still update 1.1 when it comes along, but I'll never forget the bad taste in my mouth. How do you feel?

Last weeks Dev notes began saying that we are half way through SQUADs volunteer testers testing of 1.1. It is very much appreciated by my myself and would assume many other storeies for you work steamies. BUT from my limited reading and watching, you steamies should not be done this week. SQUAD, it appears that this release, your intentions are to put quality before quantity. I and I beleve many storeies fully support this apparent approach (to our game)* and also a release of 1.1 "when it is done". 

 

 

 

*steamies

Edited April 12, 2016 by bonyetty
Just to be sure. All in good humor

[soulsource]

I'm of course looking forward to 1.1, and of course I'd happily install the Beta version would it be available to me.

As an engineer I see the advantages of using Steam's content delivery system (a well distributed network of servers all around the globe) over offering frequent updates from one's own website, so I'm not upset at all. Also, I agree with those who already mentioned that our experience with 1.1 will not be spoiled by the bugs that have been found and fixed during the beta.

[Rocket In My Pocket]

2nd class citizens?

More like 1st world problems.

Edited April 12, 2016 by Red Iron Crown
No name calling, please.

[steuben]

/me places some cheese in the thread since it pairs so nicely

I have to wonder if anybody who is complaining about not having access to 1.1B has ever had to work with that kind of software. I've been close enough to it that if I had the chance I wouldn't. I have enough frustration dealing with silly people, silly machines, silly software, at the office, don't want to have to deal with silly software at home.

[Guest]

48 minutes ago, soulsource said:

I'm of course looking forward to 1.1, and of course I'd happily install the Beta version would it be available to me.

As an engineer I see the advantages of using Steam's content delivery system (a well distributed network of servers all around the globe) over offering frequent updates from one's own website, so I'm not upset at all. Also, I agree with those who already mentioned that our experience with 1.1 will not be spoiled by the bugs that have been found and fixed during the beta.

If there were daily updates being pushed through Steam, I could follow your reasoning. But, I have only seen 3 public releases in 2 weeks. The KSP store has handled this type of traffic in the past. What's happened that makes the store incapable of handling it now? Also, this has got to be the most successful best selling $40 bug filled beta release of all time, just sayin. Finally, as far as being "bug filled". Yes, the game crashes way more than in 1.05. So, there is a need for the beta label. But, it's not so bad as to be deemed unplayable IMO. The crash rate also seems to be about the same with or without the most popular game play mods, like mechjeb, KAC, KER. Can't speak for the graphics mods, as I've never used those. So, the "bug filled release" excuse is falling on deaf ears as far as I'm concerned. No, the only thing that I am seeing here is original KSP supporters that do not want KSP from Steam are being alienated. Sure, it's a small crowd, but that still don't make it right.

 

 

[Choctofliatrio2.0]

So wait, on steam it's automatically updated to the 1.1 prerelease?

[Red Iron Crown]

Just now, Choctofliatrio2.0 said:

So wait, on steam it's automatically updated to the 1.1 prerelease?

It's an opt-in beta. By default Steam still delivers 1.0.5.

[John JACK]

Actually, not getting 1.1 prerelease should count as being a 1st class citizen. Because getting is not playing for fun. It's for a dirty work of testing. Though I suppose Steam users who opted for prerelease are more like heroic volunteers than 2nd class citizens to Store elite.

[HebaruSan]

11 hours ago, nosirrbro said:

What? Why? Its actually quite stable unmodded with never any game breaking bugs or even anything that would irritate you much, and the new improvements have made stations much more pleasn't. I couldn't disagree more.

Have you tried asteroids? It seems to be impossible to do ARM now. http://bugs.kerbalspaceprogram.com/issues/8692

Though it's true that having access to the pre-release is not some terrible burden, given that there's still the choice to go back to 1.0.5.

[Superfluous J]

2 hours ago, steuben said:

I have to wonder if anybody who is complaining about not having access to 1.1B has ever had to work with that kind of software.

I am not complaining any more because I now have access to it but as a previous "whiner," I feel I have the right to answer this. I have worked with beta software, both as a volunteer tester and as part of my job. I knew what 1.1 pre would be like (and I was correct) and I WANTED to beta test it. I wanted to help. More than that, though, I wanted Squad to want me (and the other store purchasers) to help. I - and the others who CHOSE to buy from the store when they could instead have just tossed money at Steam - are the exact people who would be more likely to have the desire to actually help than install it because it's "new and awesome and omg 1.1" and then complain that it's broken and why doesn't [insert mod here] work.

So yeah. I suspect "anybody who is complaining" has good reason to complain, above and beyond what you all think of as whining.

[jwenting]

10 hours ago, AlanP said:

My opinion on Squad. This is there first Game. The didn't have much of an idea what they where getting into. They created a great game. They get more organized and experienced as they progress in development. Just look at the inprovements in Dev notes over the past year. Look at how they are starting to plan their updates better. The make mistakes(from some peoples perspective) some times. They keep getting better at it every time.

Keep up the good work Squad!

And most of the people who had it only through the KSP website and really want to help make the product better will have bought a Steam copy as well, considering the often thousands of hours of enjoyment we've had out of our 3-4-5 year old copies bought back then at a fraction of the price of the current version has been well worth it.

[nli2work]

the only real mistake was calling this a "Pre-Release" instead of "Open Beta". 

[Aetharan]

@5thHorseman has the right of things here in my opinion, and I'm tossing my support behind anybody able to stand up to Cardassian torture and proclaim the proper number of dots or lights for all to hear.  We who chose Squad's store rather than Steam (each of us for our own reasons, I'm sure (Hate hate hate hate HATE VALVE!)) would be a nice expansion to their beta-testing force, and it's a bit disappointing that we don't get the chance to help this time around.  Perhaps by the next version that needs this kind of effort from the community, they'll have fixed the logistical issues that make us poor candidates for the moment.

That said, there's no need for either side of the community to whine.  We who cannot help instead get to sit back and giggle at all the silly geese who think that pre-release means "I get first dibs!" instead of "They need my help!"  Some people seem intent on splitting the community into factions over any little thing, as if they're looking for any little reason to call their 'side' superior to the other.  There's no need for that.  I don't advocate hatred whatsoever*, but instead a mutual understanding that the only thing we have to complain about is the complaining.

On that note, here's my contribution of cheese to go with the whine.  Does anybody have a recommendation for cheddar so sharp that it qualifies as 'vorpal', or at the very least, 'keen'?

* Excepting against a certain, already-mentioned company for which I do advocate extreme and irrational hatred, for reasons which I'm not even going to bother to explain, because it's more amusing if it's completely unexplained.

Edited April 12, 2016 by Aetharan

[Cornholio]

I have access to 1.1 because I purchased it on steam but have not downloaded it because it WILL be buggy (especially for my preference of gameplay with mods).

 

And as was pointed out, no Squad isn't just a small marketing firm.  They are a real video game company.  At one point they were soley marketing, sure, but not any more.

[Sampa]

I have done beta tests before...all it resulted in was me getting bored of the content prematurely when it was finally released.

[Guest]

43 minutes ago, Sampa said:

I have done beta tests before...all it resulted in was me getting bored of the content prematurely when it was finally released.

Hitting that wall here testing career mode.

[nosirrbro]

3 hours ago, John JACK said:

Actually, not getting 1.1 prerelease should count as being a 1st class citizen. Because getting is not playing for fun. It's for a dirty work of testing. Though I suppose Steam users who opted for prerelease are more like heroic volunteers than 2nd class citizens to Store elite.

Uhh nope. I'm a store user who ended up just getting it on steam anyway and this mentality that "Oh you guys don't even want it" is flawed. The game is very playable and sure it has a few bugs but (stock at least) it is 100% playable and the new physics improvements make stations much more pleasant. Store users, don't take these people's word that it's a chore to play 1.1 because, well, it's not.