Galileo Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 (edited) disregard Edited October 9, 2016 by Galileo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francois424 Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 Just .... wow. I have something else to do when I finish playing around in the OPM. Squad could hire you to redo the stock planets... no problem from me lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poodmund Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 On the Lili appearing spherical issue, can you not push the Scaled Space -> PQS fade in range further out so basically the player will still see the PQS at a range where the resolution of the moon on the screen is small enough that the switch to a spherical shape isn't as noticeable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galileo Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 (edited) disregard Edited October 9, 2016 by Galileo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galileo Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 (edited) disregard Edited October 9, 2016 by Galileo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEpicSquared Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 (edited) I'm assuming it would be too difficult and/or time-consuming to move the rings to match Lili's orbit instead of the other way around? Or, would it be possible to move Lili to the that gas giant with rings Saturn-like rings(I forget the name, but you know which one I mean)? Edited October 8, 2016 by TheEpicSquared Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioBob Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 1 hour ago, Galileo said: @OhioBob Here is Lili and Tellumo The semiMajorAxis is almost exactly where it needs to be. if you have any other suggestions, dont even ask, just do it im fed up with small bodies https://www.dropbox.com/s/0o6jf77dp0n9ml5/Lili.zip?dl=0 Ill post it here just in case anyone else wants to try their hand at it. I see several things in the Lili cfg that I'd like to change to be consistent with what I did for the other celestial bodies. I should also be able to fix Lili's orbit, but first I have to get a meal (I haven't eaten anything yet today). I'll continue working on it later this afternoon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galileo Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 (edited) disregard Edited October 9, 2016 by Galileo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JadeOfMaar Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 11 hours ago, Galileo said: I probably won't include it. Too frustrating I named it Lili pronounced Lilly Oh perfectionism. Is the Longitude of Ascending Node already taken care of? Lili the (last) remnant. Or, the one proto-moon. Has a nice ring to it. Now what shall I stuff that potato with, resource-wise...or forbid it from having? The floor is officially open to ask for resource biases for bodies and biomes, either to accompany themes or just because. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galileo Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 (edited) disregard Edited October 9, 2016 by Galileo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioBob Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 (edited) Found the problem. It's not Lili's orbit, it's the rings. The inclination of the rings is not fixed, it changes with the planet's rotation. We need to change lockRotation = true. I think I've figured out the right settings but I need to do some more testing before I'm ready to send it back to you. @Galileo, you probably need to make the same change in Nero's cfg. Edited October 8, 2016 by OhioBob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galileo Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 (edited) 11 hours ago, OhioBob said: Found the problem. It's not Lili's orbit, it's the rings. The inclination of the rings is not fixed, it changes with the planet's rotation. We need to change lockRotation = true. I think I've figured out the right settings but I need to do some more testing before I'm ready to send it back to you. @Galileo, you probably need to make the same change in Nero's cfg. Ah. I should have known that. Ok I can do that. That didn't even cross my mind. Edited October 9, 2016 by Galileo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioBob Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 1 minute ago, Galileo said: And why would Lili move off of its orbit line? Technically, Lili's orbit wasn't moving, it was the ring plane that was moving. The ascending node of the rings was fixed in relation to a point on the surface of Tellumo rather than fixed in relation to the stars. Therefore the rings went through one precession cycle with each rotation of the planet. Go to the Tracking Station and orient the view so that you are looking down on Tellumo's north pole, then time warp ahead and you can see what I'm talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galileo Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 (edited) disregard Edited October 9, 2016 by Galileo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioBob Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 @Galileo, I'm afraid that I can't get it figured out either. I see no problem with Lili's orbit, the problem appears to me to be an inability to lock down the orientation of the rings. For example, I can get Lili's orbit to within a few degrees of the ring plane, so I exit the game, edit Lili's ascending node in the cfg, restart the game, and now the ring plane and Lili's orbital plane are way off from each other. When I compare the orientation of the planes in relation to the Tellumo-Sun line, Lili's orbit looks correct but the ascending node of the ring plane has changed since the last game load. I just keep chasing a randomly moving target and can never catch it. We may have to choose between having inclined rings or having a small moon, but right now I can't make it give us both. I'm not giving up yet, I'll make some inquiries and see if I can find anybody who knows how to make it work. I'm sure we can make Lili work if we take out the ring inclination (with no inclination there is no ascending node, so the problem goes away). Of course even without Lili, it's certainly not desirable to have the ring orientation jumping around and changing randomly. On to another problem... I can't make your latest Tellumo cfg work. I get stuck on the screen where I load my saved game; I click to load the game and nothing happens. I went back to the last Tellumo cfg that I knew worked, which is the one I sent you Thursday with the new Tellumo atmosphere. I copied the ring node into that file and it worked fine. I also noticed that the your most recent Tellumo cfg didn't have the new atmosphere in it. I've also made several changes to the Lili cfg, but I don't see much point going over that until we decide whether or not we're even going to use Lili. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galileo Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 (edited) 10 minutes ago, OhioBob said: @Galileo, I'm afraid that I can't get it figured out either. I see no problem with Lili's orbit, the problem appears to me to be an inability to lock down the orientation of the rings. For example, I can get Lili's orbit to within a few degrees of the ring plane, so I exit the game, edit Lili's ascending node in the cfg, restart the game, and now the ring plane and Lili's orbital plane are way off from each other. When I compare the orientation of the planes in relation to the Tellumo-Sun line, Lili's orbit looks correct but the ascending node of the ring plane has changed since the last game load. I just keep chasing a randomly moving target and can never catch it. We may have to choose between having inclined rings or having a small moon, but right now I can't make it give us both. I'm not giving up yet, I'll make some inquiries and see if I can find anybody who knows how to make it work. I'm sure we can make Lili work if we take out the ring inclination (with no inclination there is no ascending node, so the problem goes away). Of course even without Lili, it's certainly not desirable to have the ring orientation jumping around and changing randomly. On to another problem... I can't make your latest Tellumo cfg work. I get stuck on the screen where I load my saved game; I click to load the game and nothing happens. I went back to the last Tellumo cfg that I knew worked, which is the one I sent you Thursday with the new Tellumo atmosphere. I copied the ring node into that file and it worked fine. I also noticed that the your most recent Tellumo cfg didn't have the new atmosphere in it. I've also made several changes to the Lili cfg, but I don't see much point going over that until we decide whether or not we're even going to use Lili. I think I'm going to scrap Lili then. 0 inclination just seems boring to me. I must have forgotten to add the changes to the atmosphere on Tellumo. I changed so much in Tellumo and Gael that I may have just copied over it with an old atmosphere node and didn't notice. Edited October 8, 2016 by Galileo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioBob Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 If I can get some help and figure out how to make Lili work with the inclined rings, then we can add it back. But until that happens, yeah, take it out (assuming you like the inclined rings better than Lili). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galileo Posted October 8, 2016 Author Share Posted October 8, 2016 I do like the rings more. Thinking about it, having 0 inclination wouldn't be so bad. Nobody will ever get 0 inclination naturally unless they are using hyper edit. Maybe it wouldn't look so bad. That way we can keep both. Also, does the transition look bad? It kinda just disappears at some point but it's very far away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JadeOfMaar Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 If we may, an Ovok inspection might be in order (maybe Sarnus has two ring configs and Ovok safely sits between the two. But the rings will get more preference versus Lili. If indeed the ring plane and Lili's path are not allowed to coincide then a minor inclination difference will be welcome. For my Elite style chart, which planet should be highlighted and featured + info revealed? Gael? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioBob Posted October 8, 2016 Share Posted October 8, 2016 2 minutes ago, Galileo said: Also, does the transition look bad? It kinda just disappears at some point but it's very far away I didn't even get to that. I was totally focused on just trying to solve the other problem. I'll take a look at it. I'll take the inclination out of both the rings and the moonlet and send you the updated files. You can then take a look at it and decide whether or not you want to use it. 3 minutes ago, JadeOfMaar said: If we may, an Ovok inspection might be in order (maybe Sarnus has two ring configs and Ovok safely sits between the two. But the rings will get more preference versus Lili. If indeed the ring plane and Lili's path are not allowed to coincide then a minor inclination difference will be welcome. I looked into that. Sanus' rings have no inclination, so the problem I'm having would not be a issue there. Ovok is inclined 1.5 degrees, so it does pass a little above and below the ring plane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JadeOfMaar Posted October 9, 2016 Share Posted October 9, 2016 (edited) From the inception Galileo gave me. Edited October 9, 2016 by JadeOfMaar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioBob Posted October 9, 2016 Share Posted October 9, 2016 (edited) Below are the new files: http://www.braeunig.us/KSP/TellumoLili.zip Warning, be careful with the Tellumo file. This is not the .cfg you sent out earlier today. It is the .cfg I sent you on Thursday with the new Tellumo atmosphere, but with the Ring node copied to it. As I said, I couldn't get your file to work. The only change I made to the ring is to set angle = 0. The Lili .cfg has several changes to it. First, I deleted a bunch of stuff that's not needed, like mass and gravParameter. All we need is radius and geeASL, from which the game computes everything else. I think it is best to not specifiy the other stuff to avoid possible inconsistencies. I also greatly reduced geeASL to give a more realistic density (accounting for the fact that density 10x what it would be in real life). The value you used gave Lili an impossible density. We normally also don't need to specify sphereOfInfluence and hillSphere (the game will calculate those), but in this case Lili is so small and so close to Tellumo that its computed SOI is smaller than its own radius (I guess that's what happens when you're inside the Roche limit). I therefore overrode the computed values and gave Lili a SOI of 17000 m. This allows orbits of Lili if we're within 10 km of it. I also made Lili tidally locked. Furthermore, I gave it a very slight inclination of 0.5 degrees so that is passes just above and below the ring plane to produce some nice views of the rings. Not much of an inclination is needed to produce some nice views, but you're free to add more inclination (or take it out) if you want. I also revised things like time warp limits and science values to match the same formulas I used for the other celestial bodies. I could not observe the problem you talked about regarding Lili turning spherical. I changed all the fade start and end values back to the norms. I then did a close flyby of Lili and continued to observed it until it traveled around the far side of the planet and disappeared behind the limb. It looks fine to me the whole time. I also didn't see anything unusual in the map view. One more thing, I noticed that Lili is actually wider than the gap in the rings though which it passes. It might look better if you could widen the ring gap. Edited October 9, 2016 by OhioBob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioBob Posted October 9, 2016 Share Posted October 9, 2016 (edited) 28 minutes ago, JadeOfMaar said: From the inception Galileo gave me. @JadeOfMaar, that looks awesome. I see one error though, Gael's semimajor axis is 13,984,360 km. I also figured the molecular weight of Gael's atmosphere to be exactly that of Earth, presuming the same composition. It's possible Gael could have a lower oxygen content than Earth, but then it would need more of a heavier gas like carbon dioxide to make up for it. Also one itsy bitsy grammatical nit pick. It should be "A goldilocks planet that surprisingly..." Generally, "which" is used following a comma, and "that" is used when there is no pause. Edited October 9, 2016 by OhioBob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JadeOfMaar Posted October 9, 2016 Share Posted October 9, 2016 (edited) I've been seeing errors after posting it, part of why I put [Incomplete Image] in the upper right corner. Thanks anyway for the spell-checks as they're quite welcome. I actually guessed at the atmo composition because I don't exactly remember Earth's own (I think 87% N2 and 12% O2), and Gael can indeed have less Oxygen since it's still not Kerbin. It would go under trace gases, perhaps. Indeed I accidentally wrote Gratian's semimajor axis. Edited October 9, 2016 by JadeOfMaar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OhioBob Posted October 9, 2016 Share Posted October 9, 2016 (edited) 4 minutes ago, JadeOfMaar said: (I think 87% N2 and 12% O2). Right digits, wrong order. 78% N2 and 21% O2. The remaining 1% is mostly argon. (edit) That's the composition of dry air. Edited October 9, 2016 by OhioBob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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