[Minimum KSP: 1.12.2] Heisenberg - Airships Part Pack

[Angelo Kerman]

15 minutes ago, DerekL1963 said:

Which engine does that apply to? (And what does it do?)

And taming those big fans is turning out to be a serious bear...  I still haven't figured out how to take off w/o flipping the blimp on it's nose.  But I think that's mostly because I'm launching from clamps due to the "drop and explode"bug.  I saw a mod to fix that, just need to track it down.  And go back and start from zero with a proper Duna Dirigible rather than working with a hacked version of the Norge.  (Which is designed to a rather different goal.)  It's work to do that, but better than doing the current and future engineering development work twice.

Sounds like an interesting challenge. That patch goes in the config files for the electric fans. it replaces what's there already.

[SpaceFoon]

2 hours ago, DerekL1963 said:

Which engine does that apply to? (And what does it do?)

And taming those big fans is turning out to be a serious bear...  I still haven't figured out how to take off w/o flipping the blimp on it's nose.  But I think that's mostly because I'm launching from clamps due to the "drop and explode"bug.  I saw a mod to fix that, just need to track it down.  And go back and start from zero with a proper Duna Dirigible rather than working with a hacked version of the Norge.  (Which is designed to a rather different goal.)  It's work to do that, but better than doing the current and future engineering development work twice.

What about some vtol manager? And for the clamps you just raise your buoyancy before launching.

I'm having the same problems with Duna. Seems to fly a blimp on duna you need a blimp made for duna. I didn't realize how little air there actually is there lol. I got my 200 ton ship to slow down to 200 m/s before stalling. Took the 95 ton payload out and it can land at 80 m/s and even take off again with electric props but it's not easy and takes a long time to speed up and slow down. However I also found that I can enter duna at any speed I want and still have a ton of control. As long as I have the speed I could basically get back into orbit with my lift. Other planets I have to enter very slowly and carefully or I flip and burn up. But same as you I'm working with a hacked version of a craft with different goals. Just gonna do the C-130 JTOL landing I saw on youtube once.

 

Hey Angle-125 I noticed the COM for the flight deck and top side flight deck is about 10 meter below the part. Is this a bug or a feature for balance? Thanks again for this mod.

[Angelo Kerman]

11 hours ago, SpaceFoon said:

Hey Angle-125 I noticed the COM for the flight deck and top side flight deck is about 10 meter below the part. Is this a bug or a feature for balance? Thanks again for this mod.

That's done to help balance out the airship and keep it from getting top heavy.

Now that MOLE is feature complete, I'm gearing up to finish up Heisenberg as well. I have some stuff planned like mesh optimizations to improve rendering performance, reworking the ground stabilizer into landing gear, remaking the Bison command pod, and some kind of wheel well so that the Bison can fit into a Mk3 cargo bay. I'm also experimenting with an inflatable airship envelope- if I can get that to work then you'll have an easier time lofting airships to other worlds as long as you can live with the fixed lifting capacity of the blimp hull. I might do some boat hulls/ rectangular lifting sections but we'll see. It depends upon my time and interest.

Edited April 3, 2018 by Angel-125

[Quoniam Kerman]

Inflatable airship makes me think of the last ideas from engineer for a Venus atmosperic craft, they wish to make a ship enter the Venus atmosphere and deploy as an airship when arrived at the right altitude. Sounds very interesting but also very hazardous project. It is not scheduled for before half a Century to say the least...

[DerekL1963]

Indeed, thanks to Angel and the Heisenberg mod - you CAN fly a blimp on Duna.

[Angelo Kerman]

The next Heisenberg release won't be for awhile, but here's one of the new parts:

This will make it easier to build bases with the Bison gondola parts. Imagine using the existing docking ports, ground stabilizers, and wheels to dock components together to form a mobile base.

[DeltaDizzy]

I wonder if anyone knows how to fix the Z-fighting. Im pretty sure I found the cause...

EDIT: It appears it was JSI Transparent Pods, and tuning transparency off fixes it

Edited April 24, 2018 by DeltaDizzy

[Lisias]

3 hours ago, DeltaDizzy said:

EDIT: It appears it was JSI Transparent Pods, and tuning transparency off fixes it

I had a glitch with the JSI Transparent Pods also. Perhaps you should post there too? Perhaps this can be related somehow.

 

[Lisias]

On 4/24/2018 at 12:23 AM, Angel-125 said:

The next Heisenberg release won't be for awhile, but here's one of the new parts:

This will make it easier to build bases with the Bison gondola parts. Imagine using the existing docking ports, ground stabilizers, and wheels to dock components together to form a mobile base.

Well.... I'm "trying" to do something similar using the corridor. Some extra "struts" are needed, however. :-)

[theonegalen]

4 hours ago, Lisias said:

*snip*

Good Kerbol Above!

[Lisias]

On 4/27/2018 at 1:05 AM, theonegalen said:

Good Kerbol Above!

You can say it again. :-) On the bright side, this monsters survivability is better than I expected! :-D

[Lisias]

I learnt something today, Besides the absolutely idiotic sizing (KSP style! MOAR BALLONS), another thing that was crashing the vessels on launching is that I mistakenly was attaching the launch clamps on the Fligth Deck, and not on the Dirigible Section! X-P

The Flight Deck, obviously, didn't uphold all the weight, snaps and the Section weight was fully transferred to the neighbours, starting a (nice looking!) chain reaction.

Below, in red the wrong way, and in green the right way of clamping a blimp with a flight dec. :-)

[Lisias]

And now I have a very hard nut to crack. :-)

It should not be a problem on reasonable airships, but as you already noted, mine is not reasonable. For a mile.

I having a hard time launching the thing without cheats - once she's launched, she flies nicely (for she's size!) without cheating, but hell... I'd like to solve this orthodoxically.

The problem is the Launch Clamps. 

When the clamps are using autostruts, they are not released fast enough and then some parts broke as their neighboor starts to float but it are still clamped. This was the other problem that was biting me (together clamping the Flight Deck instead of the vessel's body).

Without autostruts, when setting the Hooligan's Altitude Control to 0m/s - the plan is to give the vessel a stable atitude, release the clamps, and then start a slow climbing to avoid hitting the heavy tail into the ground, the clamps themselves collapse (beautifully) as the buoyancy kicks in. She launches, but scattered over the sky!! =D

Unbreakable Joints prevents this, of course. But I'm seeking a cheat-less =P solution.

Anyone has any idea?

Edited May 4, 2018 by Lisias
more screenshots for your amusement. :-)

[CaptainAl]

Not sure if it's been said, but I'm having issues with the SAFER in KSP 1.4.3.

Nothing game breaking, only it has no EnrichedUranium or DepletedUranium storage.

Edit- Neither does the Nuclear Gyro Ring.

Edited May 6, 2018 by CaptainAl
Updating post

[Krakatoa]

23 minutes ago, CaptainAl said:

Not sure if it's been said, but I'm having issues with the SAFER in KSP 1.4.3.

Nothing game breaking, only it has no EnrichedUranium or DepletedUranium storage.

Edit- Neither does the Nuclear Gyro Ring.

With the different options available for this mod, it'll be kinda important to see your GameData and WildBlueIndustries folders to make sure it's installed correctly, then the appropriate log. I've not heard of anyone else having that issue, so it leans towards an install issue. Those two resources for the SAFER rely on CRP and being in WBI's CRP play mode. Classic Stock uses NuclearFuel and NuclearWaste and Pristine mode uses stock's RTG-style generator instead of a resource converter.  Also to throw it out there, Heisenburg hasn't been updated to 1.4.3, so if there was something that broke during that change, it'll have to wait till Angel can get the opportunity to update things.

[CaptainAl]

6 minutes ago, Krakatoa said:

With the different options available for this mod, it'll be kinda important to see your GameData and WildBlueIndustries folders to make sure it's installed correctly, then the appropriate log. I've not heard of anyone else having that issue, so it leans towards an install issue. Those two resources for the SAFER rely on CRP and being in WBI's CRP play mode. Classic Stock uses NuclearFuel and NuclearWaste and Pristine mode uses stock's RTG-style generator instead of a resource converter.  Also to throw it out there, Heisenburg hasn't been updated to 1.4.3, so if there was something that broke during that change, it'll have to wait till Angel can get the opportunity to update things.

I've modded enough to be confident it's installed correctly, but accidents happen 

I did, however, quit out of the resources menu when it popped up. Any way to get it back and get CRP selected and working?

Edit- Also, if I can't do this, I'd be happy to provide logs, screenshots of folders etc.

Edited May 6, 2018 by CaptainAl

[Krakatoa]

8 minutes ago, CaptainAl said:

I've modded enough to be confident it's installed correctly, but accidents happen 

I did, however, quit out of the resources menu when it popped up. Any way to get it back and get CRP selected and working?

Edit- Also, if I can't do this, I'd be happy to provide logs, screenshots of folders etc.

Pretty sure there's a button in the toolbar of the Space Center screen with WBT on it, clicking that should bring up the thing to choose which play mode.

Edited: just loaded the game, yep, there's a big WBT button down in the toolbar, it brought up the play mode screen, you just select what you want to use, then restart the game.

Edited May 6, 2018 by Krakatoa

[Angelo Kerman]

Heisenberg 2.12 is now available:

New Part
- Bison Hub (Advanced Exploration: This 4-way hub lets you connect four gondola modules together to form a ground base.

Bug Fixes & Enhancements
- Recompiled for KSP 1.4.3
- Improved resource summary in the geology lab.
- Fixed a situation where resource distribution that wouldn't distribute resources.
- Adjusted Classic Stock resource densities to reflect the 5-liter standard used by most stock resources.
- Adjusted Classic Stock storage capacities to reflect the 5-liter standard used by most stock resources. These changes will affect new parts and when you reconfigure an existing part.
- Classic Stock is now the default Play Mode for new installs of WBI mods. Existing games are unchanged.

[Lisias]

2 minutes ago, Angel-125 said:

changes will affect new parts and when you reconfigure an existing part.

There's an automated or easier way to apply the changes on a pre-existant vessel? I'm building a somewhat big one, and it will be somewhat cumbersome to reconfigure all that parts...

[Angelo Kerman]

1 minute ago, Lisias said:

There's an automated or easier way to apply the changes on a pre-existant vessel? I'm building a somewhat big one, and it will be somewhat cumbersome to reconfigure all that parts...

No, there's no automated way that I know of. If you're not using Classic Stock then it won't affect you though.

[CaptainAl]

1 minute ago, Krakatoa said:

Pretty sure there's a button in the toolbar of the Space Center screen with WBI on it, clicking that should bring up the thing to choose which play mode.

Yeah sorry, just found it and selected CRP. Doesn't seem to be working though, so-

Log-

https://www.dropbox.com/s/wq2r67a8mjxk0yt/KSP.log?dl=0

GameData folder-

https://imgur.com/fJIWsCz

[Angelo Kerman]

22 minutes ago, CaptainAl said:

Yeah sorry, just found it and selected CRP. Doesn't seem to be working though, so-

Log-

https://www.dropbox.com/s/wq2r67a8mjxk0yt/KSP.log?dl=0

GameData folder-

https://imgur.com/fJIWsCz

After selection did you restart the game?

[CaptainAl]

1 minute ago, Angel-125 said:

After selection did you restart the game?

I did, thanks.

Thanks for all your help, but I've found the culprit- I hadn't installed CRP. 

[Lisias]

YES! After days and days of blood (Kerbal's, not mine), sweat (mine, not Kerbal's) and tears (both), I manager to tame the infamous krakenwobbling! :-)

I had to rebuilt the whole shebang from the ground due a wobbling that started to happen when I added the lateral gondolas. One way to overcome this is autostruting everything into the root (the Cockpit), but this has some drawbacks:

• I feel more or less cheating - there's no real life parallel to autostruting EVERYTHING into a single light part.
• This would invoke the krakenwoobling when docking another heavy vessel (planned).

A way to solve this dilemma is to make root a docking port, and then another heavy vessel those root is also the docking port would cause minimal stress while docking (docking is a traumatic event when you use heaviest and root autostruting, as a dock would reconfigure everything). But that also sounded like "cheating".

In the real life, we would use some serious steel I-Beams as a spine, but there's no way to do this without mesh clipping (something usually used in Kerbal dark masses to invoke the kraken). Another real life solution is use the I-beams traversing vertically  the center o mass, and then using long flexible struts tying various parts of the vessel to the beam's extreme (as a suspension bridge). But that would derail the airstrip. So 4 I-beans in "X", at 45°, would do the trick. But then I realized that the stock AES struts can stretch to 10 meters max, and then a lot of struts and I-beams would be necessary to cover all the ship - and since I didn't found any mod with long, strong struts (well, there's ShipStuts from 77 Industries, but this relies on KerbPaint that don't work on 1.4.x), I scratched the idea. (making mods myself to solve my problems is also cheating, no?)

So I given up, and came back to autostruts. But on a "less cheating" way: the central part of the vessel is the root, and all the heavy parts are autostruted to the root. That would simulate the central spine. Everything else is autotruted to the grandparent (or simply not autostruted), and tied up to the main body using girders, Netherdyne Jumbo Trusses or AES struts in "X".

Since we can only use one attachment point per subassembly (the data structure of a vessel is a tree, not a graph), some Jumbo Truss have no effective structural function. Struts in "X" are used to do the job, and the Jumbo Truss "hide" the struts, pretending to do the job. 

And the thing flies well, besides the weight! 4 heavy duty propellers: two WB-50 Jet Streams and two F-12 Hurricane (and 4 Gas  turbines to keep that power hungry engines happy) moves this monster to 54 m/s (195Km/h, ~105knots). :-)

I'm still "cheating" on launch, however. I will end up using Kerbal Joint Reinforcements only due the launch clamps exploding everything instead of doing their jobs. :-)

One thing that would help a lot is a new auto-strut option: pivot. You would mark one part of your vessel as pivot and then you could use it as target for autostrutting. And once a part is autostrutted to his pivot, it would not change target no matter what (but the pivot being destroyed in a crash).

That would prevent Unplanned Slow and Painful Deconstructions =P on large vessels when docking - a situation where the root and heaviest part of the vessels changes, and them at least one vessel have all his auto-struts reassigned.

Edited May 9, 2018 by Lisias

[Angelo Kerman]

@Lisias Congrats on getting your airship airborne!