[1.12.x] Near Future Technologies (September 6)

[GrandProtectorDark]

19 minutes ago, Nertea said:

Once I'm done I'll actually play KSP.

I've been working on my personal modding projects for long while now and I feel that sentence so damm much.
I just want to play my heavy modded ksp install again.

Lets hope that day will come for you someday, knowing many people enjoy your work.

[Nertea]

38 minutes ago, scottadges said:

You should play the game more then along the way! 

Is soft-deprecating like they're still in the game but hidden? Just wondering, what that would look like?

Yes, acts the same as the stock parts that Squad deprecated. Except in my case, I'll probably leave them like this for 3-4 months and then hard deprecate, not leave around forever ;). 

[Barzon]

Was I right @Nertea ?

[sturmhauke]

In my software engineering world, "deprecated" means "still there for now, but you should phase it out" and "removed" means "dude it's gone already, move on with your life".

[DStaal]

4 hours ago, Nertea said:

Restock+ has a considerably better 3.75m battery.  I'd like to move maintenance of those parts there. 

What are your requirements for monoprop tanks? If I need to keep some it would be good to pare down the set. For example, the smallest 2.5m one is definitely going away as it is a stock part replacement in all but name (same size, price, capacity), and the Restock one is leaps visually better. Restock+ will also eventually include something in the same footprint as the smallest 3.75m one, so that's on the chopping block. So, out of the remaining 3x lengths of 1.25ms, 2x lengths of 2.5m and 2x lengths of 3.75m... what can I kill in your view?

Just to answer this question - I just double-checked all my craft in my current career game.  I almost exclusively use the smallest sizes, with the 2.5m and the 1.25m being the most common.  (In fact, my only use of the any other size of the 1.25m was in an early-game craft which was a quick modification of an existing craft to make it to Mun's SOI for some extra science - IIRC that craft was considered completely expendable and is currently marked as debris in an eccentric Kerbin orbit.)  My use of the 3.75m has a been a bit better split between the shortest and the medium length - but that's mostly because of low sample size, as I rarely use them.

Based on that, if Restock and Restock+ have something to replace, the only one that I'd really miss is the shortest 1.25m length.  I use it both in small 1.25m craft, and in some lighter 2.5m craft, so it sees the widest use.  (Though I haven't looked at the Restock part for the FL-R25, which is just slightly smaller capacity - as mentioned, I haven't tried Restock yet.) 

[d4harp]

Will you be updating each mod independently (i.e focus on propulsion and release, then move on to electrical etc.) or will they be getting released as a single collective update? I don't mind either way, I'm just curious how you would approach a mod suite of this scale.

[Nertea]

Yes, I'm pretty close to finishing up NFP actually, the others will take longer.

[DStaal]

I'm a bit ashamed to be asking this, but how do I transfer DepletedUranium?  I know I can refuel a reactor by cooling it, then sending Kerbal on EVA, but I've decided to be a bit tricky in my current playthrough and I've set up a reprocessing plant in near-Kerbin orbit to offload used fuel and turn it back into something usable.  (Since I've managed a decent nuclear/ion drive ferry to the moons...)  However I can't figure out how to get the waste fuel into the Wirlygig.  Is there a minimum amount that needs to be transferred?  (I'm doing a test run after returning the ferry from a trip to Minmus.  Total time on the reactor is around 1 hour, so there wasn't much fuel use.)

[NHunter]

@DStaal, you don't need to EVA Kerbals (though parts between which you transfer fuel, obviously, have to be on the same ship). What you need is an engineer (lvl 1+ for enriched uranium, lvl 3+ for depleted fuel) onboard and for the parts that the fuel is transferred between to be cooler than (AFAIR) 400K.

[Redacted]

@Nertea

Not sure if this is something on your end with Near-Solar, however i though it worth posting just in case...

That being said, while working with KIS / KAS the volume of the OKEB-75 Photo Voltaic Array is 786,166 Liters. Because of this it's impossible to add an extra solar array into one of the KIS containers. Keep in mind that the K55-XL Meglador Array is 1134 Liters for comparison.

 

Thanks in advance!

-Redacted

Edited March 11, 2019 by Redacted

[Boamere]

On 3/2/2019 at 5:35 PM, lodestar said:

Thanks! Just one minor thing. The entry for the PPD-24 has a misplaced closing brace, so the config wasn't being applied at all.

1. //PPD-24 Itinerant Service Container
2. @PART[utility-pod-25]:NEEDS[USILifeSupport]
3.    
4. }
5. {

Gosh darn it, thanks mate I have updated it. Not sure if it's even necessary anymore as I haven't been up to date with ksp in a while

This should make NFS work with the current USI-LS for anyone who doesn't know. (there's like 4 parts that use it)

 

Edited March 11, 2019 by Boamere

[Nertea]

2 hours ago, Redacted said:

@Nertea

Not sure if this is something on your end with Near-Solar, however i though it worth posting just in case...

That being said, while working with KIS / KAS the volume of the OKEB-75 Photo Voltaic Array is 786,166 Liters. Because of this it's impossible to add an extra solar array into one of the KIS containers. Keep in mind that the K55-XL Meglador Array is 1134 Liters for comparison.

 

Thanks in advance!

-Redacted

Probably doesn't handle skinned mesh renderers right in its calculations or something along those lines.

[Boamere]

On 3/8/2019 at 6:22 PM, Nertea said:

Ok people, so this neglected mod suite needs some updates.

You're an absolute madlad. This is awesome but please don't kill yourself doing it. 

Just gotta say thanks for making great mods my dude, been using your mods for years and they are top tier.

[FellipeC]

On 3/8/2019 at 4:39 PM, Nertea said:

Restock+ has a considerably better 3.75m battery.  I'd like to move maintenance of those parts there. 

What are your requirements for monoprop tanks? If I need to keep some it would be good to pare down the set. For example, the smallest 2.5m one is definitely going away as it is a stock part replacement in all but name (same size, price, capacity), and the Restock one is leaps visually better. Restock+ will also eventually include something in the same footprint as the smallest 3.75m one, so that's on the chopping block. So, out of the remaining 3x lengths of 1.25ms, 2x lengths of 2.5m and 2x lengths of 3.75m... what can I kill in your view?

 

Since you have formidable monopropellant engines, I would like to keep the tanks. Of course the ones that are redundant with the stock/restock ones can go, but the longer ones in 1.25/2.5 meters I still use.

I also use those thanks in shuttles (with cormorant mod) to extend their range)

Sorry, but I love then!

[Redacted]

11 hours ago, Nertea said:

Probably doesn't handle skinned mesh renderers right in its calculations or something along those lines.

Do you support and use "ModuleKISItem" ?

[Streetwind]

4 minutes ago, Redacted said:

Do you support and use "ModuleKISItem" ?

As you can see, no such module is part of the blanket array configs. I don't personally remember it being part of any other configs in any of Nertea's mods, either.

Since I've never used KIS, or investigated how it works, I know nothing about what ModuleKISItem does or what it requires to work. In case you do, might you be willing to contribute a compatibility patch? A file placed here, named NFSolarKIS.cfg, could contain ModuleManager instructions tagged with :NEEDS[KIS] (or whatever the plugin is named) to add this module to all the solar panels, if it would help with your issue.

[Redacted]

1 hour ago, Streetwind said:

As you can see, no such module is part of the blanket array configs. I don't personally remember it being part of any other configs in any of Nertea's mods, either.

Since I've never used KIS, or investigated how it works, I know nothing about what ModuleKISItem does or what it requires to work. In case you do, might you be willing to contribute a compatibility patch? A file placed here, named NFSolarKIS.cfg, could contain ModuleManager instructions tagged with :NEEDS[KIS] (or whatever the plugin is named) to add this module to all the solar panels, if it would help with your issue.

What little I've read on the subject is that it allows the setting of an objects volume.  Specifically the volumeOverride as shown here: https://github.com/ihsoft/KIS/wiki/ModuleKISItem

MODULE
{
        name = ModuleKISItem
        shortcutKeyAction = drop
        useName = use
        usableFromEva = false
        usableFromContainer = false
        usableFromPod = false
        usableFromEditor = false
        stackable = false
        volumeOverride = 0
        moveSndPath = KIS/Sounds/itemMove
        equipable = false
        equipMode = model
        equipSlot = <null>
        equipSkill = <null>
        equipRemoveHelmet = false
        equipBoneName = aliasHelmet
        equipPos = (0, 0, 0)
        equipDir = (0, 0, 0)
        carriable = false
        allowPartAttach = 2    
        allowStaticAttach = 0
}

Did a little tinkering around with the above to no effect. Will "Ask" the KIS / KAS how this can be used with our application, then report back.

Edited March 12, 2019 by Redacted

[Streetwind]

The problem I can see with this is that it defines a single value for volume. But solar panels come in two different volume states (deployed and undeployed). If overridden with this module, a fully deployed OKEB-250 blanket array - which is larger than most spacecraft - would be allowed to be packed into common KIS containers a tiny fraction of that size.

 

Edited March 12, 2019 by Streetwind

[Redacted]

2 minutes ago, Streetwind said:

The problem I can see with this is that it defines a single value for volume. But solar panels come in two different volume states (deployed and undeployed). If overridden with this module, a fully deployed OKEB-250 blanket array - which is larger than most spacecraft - would be allowed to be packed into common KIS containers a tiny fraction of that size.

 

I get what your saying and I agree but this is whats available via KIS.

Keep in mind however that we are only dealing with the array in its reduced state.

[Nertea]

So working on a bit of concepting for redoing NF Solar. Besides upgrading the art in general, I am probably going to make some changes to the nature and balance of the panels. I think it'll be beneficial to outline them because they might be slightly save-affecting.

At the moment the following 3 arrays are set up and balanced as Concentrator type arrays - that means they are heavier, more expensive but generate more power per unit area. 

• K55-XL Megalador Solar Array
• K90-ML Trio Solar Array
• K30-SL Solo Solar Array

However, their model work and concept art really does not support this (they're obviously blankets). To solve this, the Trio and the Solar are going to get rebalanced as Blanket type arrays, which means they will get lower power outputs but become lighter and cheaper. The Megalador could stay the same - I have a nice concept model available for a Concentrator type (the Megalador isn't really based on anything at the moment), but this would probably have a different footprint. Alternately it could become a blanket array with the same balance notes as the other two (I have a nice new concept here too). At the moment, I'm open to both options. If it is modified to a Blanket array I will model a new Concentrating array in the same size class

As a note, converting them to Blanket arrays will:

• Halve power production
• Make them 20% cheaper per unit kW (so about 0.4x their current cost)
• Make them 20% lighter per unit kW (so about 0.4x their current mass)

This would definitely affect crafts, but hey, major version change  (0.x.x to 1.0.0) so breaking is expected. In case it wasn't clear, this will move NF Solar into the 1.0 range ( no new features etc). 

There is probably some room for a couple more panels in the mod that I have identified as a result of these changes

• 250 kW blanket 
• 100 kW concentrating
• 50-75  kW concentrating (if Megalador becomes a Blanket type)
• 30-50 kW concentrating

The improvements for NFP and NFE are coming along quite nicely. I'm almost happy with the NFP updates barring some minor bugs, and last night I finished unwrapping the new capacitors and batteries.

 

 

 

[Streetwind]

18 hours ago, Nertea said:

This would definitely affect crafts, but hey, major version change  (0.x.x to 1.0.0) so breaking is expected.

I'm totally in that boat. The only way you'll ever avoid breaking crafts is to freeze development - and if there is still stuff left to do, then that's not an option. Rip the bandaid off quickly, it'll hurt less oveall.

EDIT: The capacitors and batteries look like they're turning out great. Question though - is there any way to make the top right one a little thicker? KSP's physics engine doesn't do so well with thin slabs, and most of your batteries and electrical parts are thicker than stock ones, which has always been a great boon when building. I mean, I reckon that it'll be fine as it is, and changing its dimensions would also necessitate changing its stats, but it is something you could consider while it isn't completely finished yet. Usually, if you go for capacitors, you don't mount just one anyway. So a model with doubled thickness and doubled stats would probably be used just as much as the current model.

...And, of course, also break craft

 

Edited March 14, 2019 by Streetwind

[Svm420]

Agree with streetwind

[Guest]

18 hours ago, Nertea said:

However, their model work and concept art really does not support this (they're obviously blankets). To solve this, the Trio and the Solar are going to get rebalanced as Blanket type arrays, which means they will get lower power outputs but become lighter and cheaper. The Megalador could stay the same - I have a nice concept model available for a Concentrator type (the Megalador isn't really based on anything at the moment), but this would probably have a different footprint. Alternately it could become a blanket array with the same balance notes as the other two (I have a nice new concept here too). At the moment, I'm open to both options. If it is modified to a Blanket array I will model a new Concentrating array in the same size class

@Nertea I recommend to make the Megalodor a blanket. Concentrator panels tend to be bulky, fitting this tech on a flexible blanket isn't really possible. Better to make a concentrating array with a new model that'd take that into account.

Awesome news on the rework, BTW.  Will you look into replicating the distinct look of each panel type? In particular, Fresnel lens on the concentrators and black, monocrystalline cell look for the blankets. 

Also, any plans on revising the Magic Starship Blanket?  

Edited March 14, 2019 by Guest

[Redacted]

I've tested a Patch file for the Blanket PV arrays that had the volume calculation issues. Works like a charm!

 

Redacted

[Nertea]

On 3/14/2019 at 10:12 AM, Streetwind said:

EDIT: The capacitors and batteries look like they're turning out great. Question though - is there any way to make the top right one a little thicker? KSP's physics engine doesn't do so well with thin slabs, and most of your batteries and electrical parts are thicker than stock ones, which has always been a great boon when building. I mean, I reckon that it'll be fine as it is, and changing its dimensions would also necessitate changing its stats, but it is something you could consider while it isn't completely finished yet. Usually, if you go for capacitors, you don't mount just one anyway. So a model with doubled thickness and doubled stats would probably be used just as much as the current model.

Ah, I had already unwrapped them when I posted that picture so they're pretty final. Same thickness at the stock 2.5m battery though...

On 3/14/2019 at 10:33 AM, Dragon01 said:

@Nertea I recommend to make the Megalodor a blanket. Concentrator panels tend to be bulky, fitting this tech on a flexible blanket isn't really possible. Better to make a concentrating array with a new model that'd take that into account.

Well that's the issue right - new model with same stats, but bulkier closed size, or similar model with different stats, and similar closed size. Both have negative effects on craft, just putting the options out there in case anyone really cares which path I take. I would prefer the conversion to non-blanket myself. 

On 3/14/2019 at 10:33 AM, Dragon01 said:

 Awesome news on the rework, BTW.  Will you look into replicating the distinct look of each panel type? In particular, Fresnel lens on the concentrators and black, monocrystalline cell look for the blankets. 

Probably not exactly that, because to some extent the CSP arrays in the mod are not really CSP. It's just a convenient label. I think a better thing is to push towards a "modern solar panel" look for the advanced arrays, and something more akin to ISS arrays for the blanket ones. We'll see what looks artistically good. 

On 3/14/2019 at 10:33 AM, Dragon01 said:

 Also, any plans on revising the Magic Starship Blanket?  

All items will be reworked, except possibly the OKEB-500, which is a beast and I'm not sure I want to tackle a complete revision. That particular model is challenging because it has requirements to be compatible with stuff @damonvv produces, even through the inspiration is totally artistic and not really realistic. 

Edited March 15, 2019 by Nertea