[1.12.x] Near Future Technologies (September 6)

[Nertea]

Updates coming in hot!

NF Propulsion 1.2.1

• Marked for KSP 1.9
• Updated ModuleManager to 4.1.3
• Updated B9PartSwitch to 2.13.0
• Updated Simplified Chinese localization (tinygrox)

NF Electrical 1.1.1

• Marked for KSP 1.9
• Updated B9PartSwitch to 2.13.0
• Updated DynamicBatteryStorage to 2.1.5
• Updated ModuleManager to 4.1.3
• Updated Russian localization (Sool3)
• Updated Simplified Chinese localization (tinygrox)

NF Construction 1.2.2

• KSP 1.9.x
• Updated MM to 4.1.3
• Updated B9PartSwitch to 2.13.0
• Updates to Russian and Chinese localization

NF Solar 1.2.0

• Marked compatible with KSP 1.9+
• Updated bundled ModuleManager to 4.1.3
• B9PartSwitch is now bundled and required
• Switchable cell feature implemented
  • All previous Advanced panels can now toggle between Basic, Advanced and Concentrator cells with different looks and performance. Advanced represents previous baseline, Concentrator increases power per unit area but weighs more, Basic decreases power per unit area, but weighs less.
  • All previous Blanket panels can now toggle between Basic Blanket, and Advanced Blanket cells with different looks and performance. Advanced represents previous baseline, Basic decreases power per unit area, but weighs less.
  • All previous Concentrator panels can now toggle between Basic, Advanced and Concentrator cells with different looks and performance. Concentrator represents previous baseline, Advanced decreases power per unit area but weighs less, Basic further decreases power per unit area, but weighs least.
• Some panel names were adjusted to be clearer
• Fixed an issue where most or all normal maps in the mod had some problems
• Fixed an issue with the Solo panel's suncatcher not extending with the rest of the model

NF Spacecraft 1.3.1

• KSP 1.9.x
• Updated NearFutureProps to 0.6.2
• Updated B9PartSwitch to 2.13.0
• Updated ModuleManager to 4.1.3
• Updates to Chinese localization (tinygrox)

NF Exploration 1.0.5

• Marked compatible for KSP 1.9+
• Updated bundled B9PartSwitch to 2.13.0
• Fixed an issue where the PLTO and PLTO Compact buses had components (colliders, endcaps) rotated by 150 degrees
• Disabled more things when RemoteTech or RealAntennas are installed.

 

These are all reverse-compatible with 1.8.x. NFLV is coming eventually - it will work fine in 1.9.

[JeffreyCor]

" B9PartSwitch is now bundled and required" Hopefully not as required as it says. Always liked it but if B9 truly is need for it to work now it will have to go.

[mikegarrison]

On 2/20/2020 at 2:32 PM, JeffreyCor said:

" B9PartSwitch is now bundled and required" Hopefully not as required as it says. Always liked it but if B9 truly is need for it to work now it will have to go.

I expect he means what he says. From the other notes, it seems as if all panels now are switchable, trading off power per area v. mass.

<moderator snip>

Edited February 22, 2020 by Geonovast

[JeffreyCor]

On 2/20/2020 at 2:36 PM, mikegarrison said:

I expect he means what he says. From the other notes, it seems as if all panels now are switchable, trading off power per area v. mass.

<moderator snip>

<moderator snip>  All others work just fine without it.

Edited February 22, 2020 by Geonovast

[Nertea]

25 minutes ago, JeffreyCor said:

" B9PartSwitch is now bundled and required" Hopefully not as required as it says. Always liked it but if B9 truly is need for it to work now it will have to go.

This is one of the few cases where you might actually be able to remove it and have things not break horribly. 

You will absolutely lose functionality if you do.

I don't know what issue you have with it, it is superior in all measurable ways to any other art switching solution. It's used by practically all my mods, so if you're going to roll that way you might want to find other products to use. 

[ArXen42]

From your conversation, I have a feeling that someone is mistaking tiny 200KiB plugin (B9PartSwitch) with huge parts pack (B9 Aerospace)

[mikegarrison]

23 minutes ago, ArXen42 said:

From your conversation, I have a feeling that someone is mistaking tiny 200KiB plugin (B9PartSwitch) with huge parts pack (B9 Aerospace)

Could be. But he explicitly referenced B9PartSwitch, so....

Near Future has been using B9PartSwitch for what, 3-4 years now? (I remember back before, when Chris first was using Interstellar's part switch.) Anyway, so many of the parts use the part switching functionality that it's hard to imagine using them without it.

[JeffreyCor]

5 hours ago, Nertea said:

This is one of the few cases where you might actually be able to remove it and have things not break horribly. 

You will absolutely lose functionality if you do.

I don't know what issue you have with it, it is superior in all measurable ways to any other art switching solution. It's used by practically all my mods, so if you're going to roll that way you might want to find other products to use. 

Any and all "part switchers" I find in every way not desirable. I have no interest at all in art switching what so ever, and different function should be different parts. As a side note, almost all your other mods work VERY well without B9

[Vortexian2]

Hey quick question but is there anyway to make the Rhea Command pod from Near Future Spacecraft and the probe cores from Near Future Launch Vehicles work with Remote Tech?

If there isn't that is ok I just see it as kind of cheaty that they work with no delay and without connection to the KSC so early into the tech tree.

[Virtualgenius]

Thanks for doing a butt load of work updating to 1.9 and providing us with fantastic content i don't think this gets expressed enough to the mod makers thankyou again

 

[vardicd]

7 hours ago, JeffreyCor said:

B9 is a piece of crap to put it simply. All others work just fine without it.

6 hours ago, ArXen42 said:

From your conversation, I have a feeling that someone is mistaking tiny 200KiB plugin (B9PartSwitch) with huge parts pack (B9 Aerospace)

I also have a somewhat lingering grudge against b9 partswitch {I'm mostly over it now and don't mind using it} from my early mod using days, and realistically, I don't think it was b9 partswitcher's fault directly, I just blamed it, at the time. there used to be a number of mods that I liked to use, that i have long since abandoned, but those mods seemed to directly conflict with b9 in random and unpredictable ways. i remember that it took me a long time, and quite a few lost saves to figure out that if i removed b9 partswitch from my install the problems went away. I know for a long time any mod that had b9 partswitch as a dependencies instantly went onto my not going to touch list. I'm slowly come around though. It's perfectly okay to have a personal dislike of a mod, or a mod's functionality. Calling a mod that, objectively, works a piece of crap isn't really fair, and I say that as someone who said the same things oh so long ago.

And for clarity sake, I don't mean this post as any sort of personal attack, or insult, so my apologies if it comes across as such. I meant it only as sharing my own personal history with a the mod, and perhaps a slightly guilt fueled defense of a mod I once judged too harshly myself. It's okay to dislike a mod, but it's also important to remember someone worked hard on it, it was, probably at one time {or still is} someone's passion project, they {likely} didn't get paid to make it. They put their hard work into it, and having hearing {or seeing} someone bluntly saw hey this is crap, is kind of harsh.

 Sorry, again, I don't mean this post as any personal attack, or attempt to insult anyone. Kindness and consideration for other's feelings is important to me.

[Nightside]

1 hour ago, Vortexian2 said:

Hey quick question but is there anyway to make the Rhea Command pod from Near Future Spacecraft and the probe cores from Near Future Launch Vehicles work with Remote Tech?

If there isn't that is ok I just see it as kind of cheaty that they work with no delay and without connection to the KSC so early into the tech tree.

You could make a Module Manager patch for the antenna parts. I would guess that there are patches in the Remote Tech mod folder you could use as an example.

[Nertea]

1 hour ago, JeffreyCor said:

Any and all "part switchers" I find in every way not desirable. I have no interest at all in art switching what so ever, and different function should be different parts. As a side note, almost all your other mods work VERY well without B9

You sound like the kind of person who won't be convinced otherwise but please don't spread disinformation. I've had some issues before with people who don't think that dependencies are required, delete or don't install them, and then come complain about problems.

If you do not install B9PartSwitch, you will get the following issues:

• Near Future Propulsion: model issues - overlapping meshes and clipping will occur as engines will show all variants at once.
• Near Future Electrical: reactors will lose the ability to be mounted in different ways. There will be clipping
• Near Future Spacecraft: engines will show all their variant meshes at once, looking gnarly. Some command pods will show all variants at once
• Near Future Solar: the choosable cell type feature will not work.
• Near Future Launch Vehicles: switchable engine mounts will not work and all variants will show at once. Fuel switching will not work. Engines will show all variants at once
• Near Future Exploration: probe cores and buses will show all variants at once. 
• Near Future Construction: all variants for various girders will show at once. Fuel switching for trusses will not work
• Cryo Engines: All fuel switchers will not work. All engines will show all variants at once.
• Kerbal Atomics: All fuel switchers will not work. Some engines will show all variants at once
• MkIV System: All fuel switchers will not work. Some parts will show multiple variants at once
• Station Parts Expansion Redux: It'll look shockingly bad. Every single part has mesh variants, prepare for infinite clipping. 

 

2 minutes ago, Vortexian2 said:

Hey quick question but is there anyway to make the Rhea Command pod from Near Future Spacecraft and the probe cores from Near Future Launch Vehicles work with Remote Tech?

If there isn't that is ok I just see it as kind of cheaty that they work with no delay and without connection to the KSC so early into the tech tree.

Your best bet is to learn how to write RT compatibility patches. Should be some examples distributed with RT.

25 minutes ago, Virtualgenius said:

Thanks for doing a butt load of work updating to 1.9 and providing us with fantastic content i don't think this gets expressed enough to the mod makers thankyou again

 

Thanks, it's a shocking amount of work to even do low level updates for this many mods!

2 minutes ago, vardicd said:

I also have a somewhat lingering grudge against b9 partswitch {I'm mostly over it now and don't mind using it} from my early mod using days, and realistically, I don't think it was b9 partswitcher's fault directly, I just blamed it, at the time. there used to be a number of mods that I liked to use, that i have long since abandoned, but those mods seemed to directly conflict with b9 in random and unpredictable ways. i remember that it took me a long time, and quite a few lost saves to figure out that if i removed b9 partswitch from my install the problems went away. I know for a long time any mod that had b9 partswitch as a dependencies instantly went onto my not going to touch list. I'm slowly come around though. It's perfectly okay to have a personal dislike of a mod, or a mod's functionality. Calling a mod that, objectively, works a piece of crap isn't really fair, and I say that as someone who said the same things oh so long ago.

And for clarity sake, I don't mean this post as any sort of personal attack, or insult, so my apologies if it comes across as such. I meant it only as sharing my own personal history with a the mod, and perhaps a slightly guilt fueled defense of a mod I once judged too harshly myself. It's okay to dislike a mod, but it's also important to remember someone worked hard on it, it was, probably at one time {or still is} someone's passion project, they {likely} didn't get paid to make it. They put their hard work into it, and having hearing {or seeing} someone bluntly saw hey this is crap, is kind of harsh.

 Sorry, again, I don't mean this post as any personal attack, or attempt to insult anyone. Kindness and consideration for other's feelings is important to me.

B9PS has the dubious honour of being very clear and explicit about issues that might be occurring, and warning the user about them. A lot of other mods will just kinda freak out in quiet, difficult to detect ways that may not be noticed by the user, but B9 is very upfront about this, which is very helpful to modders. The vast majority of these issues come up when the mod that is using B9 is not configured correctly, and the popups and issues that come up should really be blaming that mod author. 

[Vortexian2]

Thank You, I'll look into it.

You make amazing mods by the way I am shocked with how good everything looks and works in your mods.

You have done an amazing job.

[jimmymcgoochie]

I noticed that the patch that adjusts engine power use/thrust/ISP in NFPropulsion doesn't affect the RCS parts, is that intended and/or something you plan to add?

[blowfish]

20 hours ago, JeffreyCor said:

Any and all "part switchers" I find in every way not desirable. I have no interest at all in art switching what so ever, and different function should be different parts.

Look around.  You'll see that yours is not a majority opinion among modders or players.  And there aren't enough players who feel this way to for modders to waste time making the switchers optional.  Even stock KSP has switchers now (although they're mostly only visual).

So B9PartSwitch is here to stay, if anything its usage is going to increase in the future, and you'd best get used to it.

[JeffreyCor]

Considering I have been using them for quite some with without B9, it is not 'disinformation'. The only mod I had to even do anything special with CyroEngines for which I had to make takes for not having to switch hydrogen tanks to be dual function. Overall it has amounted to recommended rather than required. Evan an appearance you might consider "shockingly bad " is still vastly preferable.
It is very likely to have been missed as there are a great many pages, and very understandable, but I have never complained of a problem at all. So no, I am most certainly not "one of those guys."

Edited February 22, 2020 by JeffreyCor

[Geonovast]

Thread temporarily locked for maintenance..

__

Some content has been removed.  Reasons for removal include some personal remarks and some off topic content.

 

Discussing issues you're having with a mod and/or mods is fine, but there's no need to get personal or demeaning.

Please try to keep your comments constructive.  We're all friends here.

 

Thank you.

[Snark]

Some further content has been removed.

Folks, we know that lively discussions can be frustrating, but please don't tell each other what to do or not to do. It's off-topic, it's not your place, and it never ends well, regardless of justification. It only ends up derailing threads into arguing about arguing. So please don't do that, no matter how well meant. If you see someone behaving in a fashion that you think is violating forum rules, then by all means report it so the moderator team can have a look-- but please don't try to correct others' behavior yourself, that's called "backseat moderating" and is not allowed (forum rule 3.2).

Also: Please don't publicly argue with moderator decisions; it's against the rules (3.3). Naturally, nobody ever thinks that they did anything wrong, and allowing open dispute would simply lead to endless bickering thread derailments, thus the rule. That doesn't mean the moderators are always right, or that we always do a perfect job of explaining our actions; hey, we're human, too. So you're welcome to reach out, if you think we goofed or you don't understand our reasoning-- but please do so privately.

We're sorry for the kerfuffle, we try to stay out of discussions unless absolutely needed. Thank you for your understanding.

[Streetwind]

14 hours ago, jimmymcgoochie said:

I noticed that the patch that adjusts engine power use/thrust/ISP in NFPropulsion doesn't affect the RCS parts, is that intended and/or something you plan to add?

The RCS parts were introduced after the patch was written, and they were just never included because... quite frankly, I forgot to do so

Since you might very well be the first person who has ever written any form of feedback about that patch out of their own accord in all those years, I'll try to get it fixed for you today.

[jimmymcgoochie]

30 minutes ago, Streetwind said:

The RCS parts were introduced after the patch was written, and they were just never included because... quite frankly, I forgot to do so

Since you might very well be the first person who has ever written any form of feedback about that patch out of their own accord in all those years, I'll try to get it fixed for you today.

Now that's service!

On a patch-related note: I just downloaded the latest NF Solar and found the different cell types, which is an interesting new feature I'll have to investigate. Is there any chance that a patch could be added that adds that cell switching to non-NFSolar panels e.g. stock, or from other mods? Kerbal Atomics has a patch that switches non-KA nuclear engines to run on liquid hydrogen so there is some precedent.

[Streetwind]

@jimmymcgoochie Done! Will ship with a future version of NF Propulsion. Until such a time, you can manually copy the following block of code into the patch file on your computer:

@PART[rcsblock-*]:AFTER[NearFuturePropulsion]
{
	@MODULE[ModuleRCSFX],*
	{
		@thrusterPower *= #$@NearFutureCustomSettings/nearFutureThrustMultiplier$
		@PROPELLANT[ElectricCharge]
		{
			@ratio *= #$@NearFutureCustomSettings/nearFuturePowerMultiplier$
			@ratio /= #$@NearFutureCustomSettings/nearFutureThrustMultiplier$
			@ratio *= #$@NearFutureCustomSettings/nearFutureIspMultiplier$
		}
		@atmosphereCurve
		{
			@key,*[1, ] *= #$@NearFutureCustomSettings/nearFutureIspMultiplier$
		}
	}
}

I just tested this on my end and it worked, but I'd appreciate feedback whether it works for you, too. And whether or not it causes unwanted interference with other RCS parts. Murphy's Law is never far...

[jimmymcgoochie]

2 minutes ago, Streetwind said:

@jimmymcgoochie Done! Will ship with a future version of NF Propulsion. Until such a time, you can manually copy the following block of code into the patch file on your computer:

@PART[rcsblock-*]:AFTER[NearFuturePropulsion]
{
	@MODULE[ModuleRCSFX],*
	{
		@thrusterPower *= #$@NearFutureCustomSettings/nearFutureThrustMultiplier$
		@PROPELLANT[ElectricCharge]
		{
			@ratio *= #$@NearFutureCustomSettings/nearFuturePowerMultiplier$
			@ratio /= #$@NearFutureCustomSettings/nearFutureThrustMultiplier$
			@ratio *= #$@NearFutureCustomSettings/nearFutureIspMultiplier$
		}
		@atmosphereCurve
		{
			@key,*[1, ] *= #$@NearFutureCustomSettings/nearFutureIspMultiplier$
		}
	}
}

I just tested this on my end and it worked, but I'd appreciate feedback whether it works for you, too. And whether or not it causes unwanted interference with other RCS parts. Murphy's Law is never far...

Patch copy+pasted, I'll give it a try now. Thanks for the quick turnaround.

And apparently that was my 100th post too

Edited February 22, 2020 by jimmymcgoochie
100th post :D

[jimmymcgoochie]

Patch seems to work as expected, the values I've changed are correctly applied to the RCS parts too. Thanks @Streetwind

[jimmymcgoochie]

Sorry to be such a pain, but I've found a problem in NFSolar. The NIV-30 and NIV-45 static curved panels are behaving very badly when I try to move them, they will repeatedly snap to the completely wrong position when I so much as touch one of the movement arrows and if I move them along one axis then try to move them in another they move back to where they were before. Very annoying as I can't re-position them once placed, I've tried with the snap to position thing on and off and the same thing happens.

KSP 1.8.1, NFSolar 1.2.0 and no other panels seem to be affected, just the curved ones. I might try and replicate in a clean install later with no other mods.