KSP Interstellar Extended Continued Development Thread

[AeroGav]

14 hours ago, EnigmaG said:

 

ABTB´s mod makes interstellar fuel available for all tanks.

OK,  Tweakscale installed,  and ABTB's patch too.

First thing I have to say is that Tweakscale is awesome.  I'd seen it before and thought it looked unnecessary, but 30 seconds with the thing and you realise you can't do without it.

Secondly, I shrunk my Salt Reactor and Thermal Turbojet to 1.25M and put them on a simple 1.25m airframe.   Performance is much more plausible,  static thrust about 25kn, leading to a 5-10 degree climbout.  Thrust does build up a bit at Supersonic speeds, but it ain't no Whiplash.

Third, the fuels behave properly now.    Liquid hydrogen boils off at about 1.5/sec  whether engine running or not.  Running the engine in Atmo mode does not consume additional LH2 beyond the boiloff rate, wheras switching fuels to LH2 does.

However, I'm not convinced the engine is behaving as the   Hybrid Thermal Rocket  I supposedly unlocked in the tech tree.    The parts list still only shows a thermal rocket and a thermal turbojet,  both now have atmospheric modes , but their behaviour still seems odd.

Thermal Turbojet

20.6KN Static Thrust Atmospheric

0KN Static Thrust in LH2 mode

15KN at 25km in LH2 mode

 

Thermal Rocket

Produces 0.4KN in Atmospheric mode,  0 KN in LH2    @ sea level

I used Hack Gravity cheat to get to 10km altitude, but thrust levels were unchanged.

 

The turbojet's thrust holds up pretty well at high altitudes, but it does start to overheat, despite my pre-cooler (how many should i use, per engine? or should i add radiators as well?).  Switching to LH2 mode did not slow down the rate of heat build up, however.   

I'll try some different fuels, see if  i can get a workable design..

[SirusKing]

For some reason, loading the game with KSPI installed stops it while loading "part/AluminiumHybrid1" and refuses to go any further. Although I am running a lot of mods, it seemed to do this with only KW rocketry and B9 installed as well.

There are no crash logs as it doesn't crash, it just gets stuck. Anyone got any ideas?

[Nansuchao]

Do you have the KW Community Fixes?

[Spacetime_Changer]

I was confused by how the new KSP Interstellar works after having a pause since 0.24.2

So my question is
Where am I supposed to store the ALUMINA I'm mining off Mun when I want to refuel my Aluminum Hybrid?

It seems ISRUs had their inventory removed

[Spacetime_Changer]

5 hours ago, SirusKing said:

For some reason, loading the game with KSPI installed stops it while loading "part/AluminiumHybrid1" and refuses to go any further. Although I am running a lot of mods, it seemed to do this with only KW rocketry and B9 installed as well.

There are no crash logs as it doesn't crash, it just gets stuck. Anyone got any ideas?

It is caused by running out of memory
You have options:
1) Uninstall a mod or few
2) Install Active Texture Management
3) Force OpenGL on shortcut

[AeroGav]

10 hours ago, AeroGav said:

OK,  Tweakscale installed,  and ABTB's patch too.

First thing I have to say is that Tweakscale is awesome.  I'd seen it before and thought it looked unnecessary, but 30 seconds with the thing and you realise you can't do without it.

Secondly, I shrunk my Salt Reactor and Thermal Turbojet to 1.25M and put them on a simple 1.25m airframe.   Performance is much more plausible,  static thrust about 25kn, leading to a 5-10 degree climbout.  Thrust does build up a bit at Supersonic speeds, but it ain't no Whiplash.

Third, the fuels behave properly now.    Liquid hydrogen boils off at about 1.5/sec  whether engine running or not.  Running the engine in Atmo mode does not consume additional LH2 beyond the boiloff rate, wheras switching fuels to LH2 does.

Thermal Turbojet

20.6KN Static Thrust Atmospheric

0KN Static Thrust in LH2 mode

15KN at 25km in LH2 mode

I'll try some different fuels, see if  i can get a workable design..

OK for my next question !   Is the scaling of the molten salt reactor balanced?

The 1.25m version made 20kn static thrust, going up to about 45kn near the sound barrier.  However, the type 1 aircraft I built could not bust the sound barrier with that little thrust.    These thermal engines lack rear attach nodes so you can't use the exploit of attaching a tailcone then offsetting it forwards so as not to block the thrust path.   As a result the engine itself makes a lot of drag,  i tried climbing up as high as possible where air would be thinner and drag less,  eventually maxed out at about 255m/s at 10km - took me half an hour to climb that high.  Set prograde marker and let the nose fall, but i was below 7km again by the time we reached 1.2mach, at which point the air is too thick to sustain supersonic speeds in level flight.    I'd used hydrazine as a propellant, maybe with less fuel, it'd have gotten higher and then made it to supersonic flight.     But at this stage I was ready to accept that the basic, unupgraded molten salt reactor doesn't have the power:weight to make a worthwhile SSTO.

I started setting up a munar excursion with one of my existing, chemically fuelled vehicles to get more science.

Then I decided to return to the Mk3 plane with 2.5m reactor and engine i showed previously.    Previously, it wasn't workable because it consumed propellant even in turbojet mode.    The patches fixed that, but the mk3 to 2.5m adapter at the rear of the fuselage cannot be switched to use interstellar fuels, so i left it empty.   This halved my fuel capacity, and meant that i couldn't carry enough LH2 in the wings to boost me from 25km to orbit.

Switching to hydrazine (Radioactive materials in the reactor aren't enough, this plane clearly needs more nasty stuff onboard to work properly)  solved that issue big time - i've got to orbit, rendez-vous with the interplanetary craft, delivered a NERV and fuel tank , and still have 2400 delta v remaining!) .  The extra weight of hydrazine vs hydrogen  also made for a more realistic climb rate than with hydrogen.. 20 degrees rather than 60.

Even so, this seems like a huge difference between the two reactor sizes

1.25m 

20KN static, 45 KN mach 1

Type 1 aircraft maxes out at 260m/s and 10km

2.5M

350KN static,  over 700KN at mach 1

Type 3 freighter goes to orbit with 2400 delta v remaining AND full cargo bay.

OP?

[Spacetime_Changer]

5 hours ago, Spacetime_Changer said:

I was confused by how the new KSP Interstellar works after having a pause since 0.24.2

So my question is
Where am I supposed to store the ALUMINA I'm mining off Mun when I want to refuel my Aluminum Hybrid?

It seems ISRUs had their inventory removed

And what the hell has happened to Magnetic Nozzle?
Kraken boarded the ship and wouldn't let go until the framerate was under 10 fps
The engine teleported approx. 1200m away from the ship, in random direction it seems, I tracked it with struts and it caused my vert. speed meter to shift  through infinity instead of 0

[Profit-]

21 hours ago, AeroGav said:

OK,  Tweakscale installed,  and ABTB's patch too.

First thing I have to say is that Tweakscale is awesome.  I'd seen it before and thought it looked unnecessary, but 30 seconds with the thing and you realise you can't do without it.

Secondly, I shrunk my Salt Reactor and Thermal Turbojet to 1.25M and put them on a simple 1.25m airframe.   Performance is much more plausible,  static thrust about 25kn, leading to a 5-10 degree climbout.  Thrust does build up a bit at Supersonic speeds, but it ain't no Whiplash.

Third, the fuels behave properly now.    Liquid hydrogen boils off at about 1.5/sec  whether engine running or not.  Running the engine in Atmo mode does not consume additional LH2 beyond the boiloff rate, wheras switching fuels to LH2 does.

However, I'm not convinced the engine is behaving as the   Hybrid Thermal Rocket  I supposedly unlocked in the tech tree.    The parts list still only shows a thermal rocket and a thermal turbojet,  both now have atmospheric modes , but their behaviour still seems odd.

Thermal Turbojet

20.6KN Static Thrust Atmospheric

0KN Static Thrust in LH2 mode

15KN at 25km in LH2 mode

 

Thermal Rocket

Produces 0.4KN in Atmospheric mode,  0 KN in LH2    @ sea level

I used Hack Gravity cheat to get to 10km altitude, but thrust levels were unchanged.

 

The turbojet's thrust holds up pretty well at high altitudes, but it does start to overheat, despite my pre-cooler (how many should i use, per engine? or should i add radiators as well?).  Switching to LH2 mode did not slow down the rate of heat build up, however.   

I'll try some different fuels, see if  i can get a workable design..

The thermal rocket is not supposed to have an atmospheric mode, and that is a bug that you can switch to it. 

The rest seems acceptable, and I am glad it is working. 

[Profit-]

10 hours ago, AeroGav said:

OK for my next question !   Is the scaling of the molten salt reactor balanced?

The 1.25m version made 20kn static thrust, going up to about 45kn near the sound barrier.  However, the type 1 aircraft I built could not bust the sound barrier with that little thrust.    These thermal engines lack rear attach nodes so you can't use the exploit of attaching a tailcone then offsetting it forwards so as not to block the thrust path.   As a result the engine itself makes a lot of drag,  i tried climbing up as high as possible where air would be thinner and drag less,  eventually maxed out at about 255m/s at 10km - took me half an hour to climb that high.  Set prograde marker and let the nose fall, but i was below 7km again by the time we reached 1.2mach, at which point the air is too thick to sustain supersonic speeds in level flight.    I'd used hydrazine as a propellant, maybe with less fuel, it'd have gotten higher and then made it to supersonic flight.     But at this stage I was ready to accept that the basic, unupgraded molten salt reactor doesn't have the power:weight to make a worthwhile SSTO.

I started setting up a munar excursion with one of my existing, chemically fuelled vehicles to get more science.

Then I decided to return to the Mk3 plane with 2.5m reactor and engine i showed previously.    Previously, it wasn't workable because it consumed propellant even in turbojet mode.    The patches fixed that, but the mk3 to 2.5m adapter at the rear of the fuselage cannot be switched to use interstellar fuels, so i left it empty.   This halved my fuel capacity, and meant that i couldn't carry enough LH2 in the wings to boost me from 25km to orbit.

Switching to hydrazine (Radioactive materials in the reactor aren't enough, this plane clearly needs more nasty stuff onboard to work properly)  solved that issue big time - i've got to orbit, rendez-vous with the interplanetary craft, delivered a NERV and fuel tank , and still have 2400 delta v remaining!) .  The extra weight of hydrazine vs hydrogen  also made for a more realistic climb rate than with hydrogen.. 20 degrees rather than 60.

Even so, this seems like a huge difference between the two reactor sizes

1.25m 

20KN static, 45 KN mach 1

Type 1 aircraft maxes out at 260m/s and 10km

2.5M

350KN static,  over 700KN at mach 1

Type 3 freighter goes to orbit with 2400 delta v remaining AND full cargo bay.

OP?

The output is correct, 40MW power output of the reactor in 1.25 size, 500MW in 2.5 because of the massive increase in volume (remember it's length also increases and results in much more reactor space)  Fully upgraded though you can make the 1.25 one work and produce about 110 KN... 
LH2, once again does not have enough mass to use as reaction mass compared to the weight of the tanks, you would find water a better propellant than LH2, hydrazine is good as well, but I use nitrogen (you can harvest it from the atmosphere) and most use Liquid Carbon Dioxide.  

Edited December 27, 2015 by Profit-

[gary85]

is this mod is compatible with http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/58235-105-modular-fuel-tanks-v561/

i use this mod to swich fuel in stock mk3 fuselage but im not sure i calculte it correctly?

and is antimatter container bugged because it never need any charge.

 

Edited December 27, 2015 by gary85

[EnigmaG]

I use ABTB´s mod for swiching fuel

 

Edited December 27, 2015 by EnigmaG

[BigZ]

Hey guys i wanted to know if anyone else is having any trouble with this mod for instance, after installing the mod and starting up the game everything is fine you can build your ship but when going to the launch pad the screen acts as if you've already launched and are in space but your ship is not there. The game obviously glitched so i was wondering if anyone had this issue and if so what was the fix to the problem besides the obvious, don't use the mod??

                                                                                                                                     Thanks happy exploring!!!

 

 

[AeroGav]

15 hours ago, Profit- said:

The output is correct, 40MW power output of the reactor in 1.25 size, 500MW in 2.5 because of the massive increase in volume (remember it's length also increases and results in much more reactor space)  Fully upgraded though you can make the 1.25 one work and produce about 110 KN... 
LH2, once again does not have enough mass to use as reaction mass compared to the weight of the tanks, you would find water a better propellant than LH2, hydrazine is good as well, but I use nitrogen (you can harvest it from the atmosphere) and most use Liquid Carbon Dioxide.  

Hmm well obviously the volume of the reactor increases greatly between 1.25 and 2.5  but shouldn't the mass also?  Is there a nuclear engineering reason why the bigger reactor would have a MUCH better thrust / weight ratio?

I won't have time to play for a couple of days, but i'd love to hear more about IRSU in Interstellar.   With IRSU this plane as it stands has a chance of a Duna or even Eve return mission.      What resources are available on  these planetary bodies?   For Eve,  I'm thinking

1.  go to kerbin orbit

2. refuel via IRSU somewhere in Kerbin SOI... minmus? what's it got, water?

3. travel to Eve with near full tanks

4. use all the fuel on a deorbit burn, thrust retrograde and radial,  so that when finally falling into atmosphere we are light and slow

5. refuel on Eve surface with IRSU

6. go home

 

[Profit-]

3 hours ago, AeroGav said:

Hmm well obviously the volume of the reactor increases greatly between 1.25 and 2.5  but shouldn't the mass also?  Is there a nuclear engineering reason why the bigger reactor would have a MUCH better thrust / weight ratio?

 

The mass does change as well.. 1.25M = 1.5Tons ish the mass of a 2.5M reactor is 8.1ish tons.  And there is a nuclear engineering reason, it is called criticality. 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Critical_mass

Water does make a good reaction mass and you can harvest it from minmus.  You can also do liquid fuel I think and with a closed cycle gas core engine. 

I kinda like the arc-jets... 

 

Edited December 28, 2015 by Profit-

[FreeThinker]

On 2-12-2015 at 10:56 AM, kerbiloid said:

On 22-12-2015 at 5:34 AM, EMPeror said:

Thanks to tweakscale I can get around the power problem by using a tiny molten salt for power, so I'm ok with needing an upgrade for electrical power.

The buoyancy effect would explain the exact opposite of what I'm seeing.  (I see thrust vary directly with throttle, not inversely). 

AND, Any buoyancy effect should only kick in when greater than 1 G, otherwise the reactor wouldn't function at all on the surface of a Kerbin. 

After you upgrade, does its electrical output reduce under acceleration?

 

Actualy, buoyancy effect start with even very low Ge force effects. Keeping the Uranium seperated from the fuel is a tricky bisness which is very difficult to do with magnetic field due to the high presures involved  .That why is impossible to develop and test these kind of engines on earth. They can currently only exist in simulated models. To develop them for real you would need to test them in zerro gravity environment, like in orbit.

[Profit-]

19 hours ago, BigZ said:

Hey guys i wanted to know if anyone else is having any trouble with this mod for instance, after installing the mod and starting up the game everything is fine you can build your ship but when going to the launch pad the screen acts as if you've already launched and are in space but your ship is not there. The game obviously glitched so i was wondering if anyone had this issue and if so what was the fix to the problem besides the obvious, don't use the mod??

                                                                                                                                     Thanks happy exploring!!

Do you have any mods that add planets or change planets installed?

If you do KSPI is probably not compatible because it adds resources to planets in the system. 

[Nansuchao]

1 hour ago, Profit- said:

Do you have any mods that add planets or change planets installed?

If you do KSPI is probably not compatible because it adds resources to planets in the system. 

Not completely. Actually Interstellar is completely compatible with Outer Planets (except for Antimatter Harvesting) and it should be with any other planet pack. The only issue is that the player will not be able to harvest any kind of resource on any planet  except the stock ones without a upgraded resources .cfgs.

 

I'm actually (slowly) adding New Horizon definition to the resource system and I have plan to include every single planet pack.

[Jimbodiah]

Any chance for an update on the reactors? I have nothing reliable to make a power network with. Whenever I try to launch a Pebble Rock reactor (the only one that seems to work and not freeze up the PC) into space it explodes the entire ship the moment I get into orbit and just messes KSP up (black screen). I'm down to solar panels as a power source.

Edited December 28, 2015 by Jimbodiah

[Profit-]

2 hours ago, Jimbodiah said:

Any chance for an update on the reactors? I have nothing reliable to make a power network with. Whenever I try to launch a Pebble Rock reactor (the only one that seems to work and not freeze up the PC) into space it explodes the entire ship the moment I get into orbit and just messes KSP up (black screen). I'm down to solar panels as a power source.

Fusion reactors have been working fine for me.

 

3 hours ago, Nansuchao said:

Not completely. Actually Interstellar is completely compatible with Outer Planets (except for Antimatter Harvesting) and it should be with any other planet pack. The only issue is that the player will not be able to harvest any kind of resource on any planet  except the stock ones without a upgraded resources .cfgs.

 

I'm actually (slowly) adding New Horizon definition to the resource system and I have plan to include every single planet pack.

Ahh  I did not realize that has been working. 

[Spacetime_Changer]

19 hours ago, Jimbodiah said:

Any chance for an update on the reactors? I have nothing reliable to make a power network with. Whenever I try to launch a Pebble Rock reactor (the only one that seems to work and not freeze up the PC) into space it explodes the entire ship the moment I get into orbit and just messes KSP up (black screen). I'm down to solar panels as a power source.

Try throwing your large solar panel collectors into low solar orbit, with microwaves works better than reactors

[ss8913]

Quick question/bug report - when will the DUMBO and non-pebble-bed fusion reactor models be updated to fix the convex collider problem?  I've jimmied in the other reactor model as a substitute for now, which works, but everything looks weird

Also, I unlocked the "Advanced Science Lab" through the tech tree, and noticed 2 things:

1. There isn't a new part called Advanced Science Lab - is that intentional?
2. I read the part.cfg for both the regular KSPIE science lab and the advanced one side by side.  They have separate files and separate names, so I'd think there'd be separate parts in the VAB/SPH?  Also the ScienceConverter part of the config, for the advanced module, shows this:

researchTime = 8            //Larger = slower.  Exponential!

Whereas the value is 7 in the non-advanced version - shouldn't this be the other way around?  Everything else is identical, so essentially I paid X number of science points to unlock a lab that's slower/less good than the one I already had?

[Profit-]

@FreeThinker: Are there some files on the GIT that are not as up to date as the download?  I think the module manager for example is a previous one to what is in the deployment.   Or did I miss a fork or something?

[123nick]

10 hours ago, ss8913 said:

Quick question/bug report - when will the DUMBO and non-pebble-bed fusion reactor models be updated to fix the convex collider problem?  I've jimmied in the other reactor model as a substitute for now, which works, but everything looks weird

Also, I unlocked the "Advanced Science Lab" through the tech tree, and noticed 2 things:

1. There isn't a new part called Advanced Science Lab - is that intentional?
2. I read the part.cfg for both the regular KSPIE science lab and the advanced one side by side.  They have separate files and separate names, so I'd think there'd be separate parts in the VAB/SPH?  Also the ScienceConverter part of the config, for the advanced module, shows this:

researchTime = 8            //Larger = slower.  Exponential!

Whereas the value is 7 in the non-advanced version - shouldn't this be the other way around?  Everything else is identical, so essentially I paid X number of science points to unlock a lab that's slower/less good than the one I already had?

can you share the fixed .cfg file or whatever?  i would be very greatful if u did.  also, weird how?

[123nick]

any fusion plasma powered engines? like, engines that run off fusion plasma from a fusion reactor? theres a magnetic nozzle, but i think it requires liquid hydrogen, which isnt plasma fusion. theres charged particles, but i dont know anything that uses those exactly. any ideas?

[ss8913]

On 12/26/2015 at 0:31 PM, AeroGav said:

OK for my next question !   Is the scaling of the molten salt reactor balanced?

The 1.25m version made 20kn static thrust, going up to about 45kn near the sound barrier.  However, the type 1 aircraft I built could not bust the sound barrier with that little thrust.    These thermal engines lack rear attach nodes so you can't use the exploit of attaching a tailcone then offsetting it forwards so as not to block the thrust path.   As a result the engine itself makes a lot of drag,  i tried climbing up as high as possible where air would be thinner and drag less,  eventually maxed out at about 255m/s at 10km - took me half an hour to climb that high.  Set prograde marker and let the nose fall, but i was below 7km again by the time we reached 1.2mach, at which point the air is too thick to sustain supersonic speeds in level flight.    I'd used hydrazine as a propellant, maybe with less fuel, it'd have gotten higher and then made it to supersonic flight.     But at this stage I was ready to accept that the basic, unupgraded molten salt reactor doesn't have the power:weight to make a worthwhile SSTO.

I started setting up a munar excursion with one of my existing, chemically fuelled vehicles to get more science.

Then I decided to return to the Mk3 plane with 2.5m reactor and engine i showed previously.    Previously, it wasn't workable because it consumed propellant even in turbojet mode.    The patches fixed that, but the mk3 to 2.5m adapter at the rear of the fuselage cannot be switched to use interstellar fuels, so i left it empty.   This halved my fuel capacity, and meant that i couldn't carry enough LH2 in the wings to boost me from 25km to orbit.

Switching to hydrazine (Radioactive materials in the reactor aren't enough, this plane clearly needs more nasty stuff onboard to work properly)  solved that issue big time - i've got to orbit, rendez-vous with the interplanetary craft, delivered a NERV and fuel tank , and still have 2400 delta v remaining!) .  The extra weight of hydrazine vs hydrogen  also made for a more realistic climb rate than with hydrogen.. 20 degrees rather than 60.

Even so, this seems like a huge difference between the two reactor sizes

1.25m 

20KN static, 45 KN mach 1

Type 1 aircraft maxes out at 260m/s and 10km

2.5M

350KN static,  over 700KN at mach 1

Type 3 freighter goes to orbit with 2400 delta v remaining AND full cargo bay.

OP?

If you use ABZB's integration mod, then the adapters can be switched to use interstellar fuels.

9 hours ago, 123nick said:

can you share the fixed .cfg file or whatever?  i would be very greatful if u did.  also, weird how?

well, the fixed cfg would either swap the 7 for the 8 between the files, or make the Advanced version of the part have a value of 6 instead of 7 in the non-Advanced.  By "looks weird" I mean that the 2 reactors that I had to modify now look like the reactor that I pulled the model from, so there's no visual difference between them (since they use the same model).  It does make them functional, however.