YNM Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 21 minutes ago, CatastrophicFailure said: But it does go to show that even at 250 klicks, air still has a significant effect. Even ISS still need reboosts. Manned spacecrafts routinely operate at 200-300 km, except for space stations (though Salyut 7 is quoted to have a perigee of 210 km height). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 (edited) 4 hours ago, YNM said: Salyut 7 is quoted to have a perigee of 210 km height Original orbit 345x354 km. Before deorbiting was rised up to 492x474. spent there several years in unmanned mode, later got down into the atmosphere due to the solar activity and communication equipment failure. Edited October 17, 2018 by kerbiloid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 Video confirms that 1st stage has hit the 2nd one. Probably a limit switch caused the failure preventing the opening of the separation nozzle. https://translate.google.com.tr/translate?sl=ru&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=ru&ie=UTF-8&u=https://www.interfax.ru/russia/633727&edit-text= Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YNM Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 14 hours ago, kerbiloid said: 1st stage has hit the 2nd one. Side booster and core ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultimate Steve Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 11 minutes ago, YNM said: Side booster and core ? Yes, as far as Soyuz is concerned, the 4 boosters are stage 1 and the core is stage 2 even though they are all ignited at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 Probably the attach node was damaged while attaching the side booster with crane. https://translate.google.com.tr/translate?sl=ru&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=ru&ie=UTF-8&u=https://www.interfax.ru/world/633855&edit-text= (A typical oops in KSP VAB, the crane operator should clean his mouse), Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 (edited) Roscosmos doesn't enjoy the speculations about the causes. https://translate.google.com.tr/translate?sl=ru&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=ru&ie=UTF-8&u=https://www.interfax.ru/russia/633892&edit-text= So, disregard all previous posts. Edited October 18, 2018 by kerbiloid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NSEP Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 That must've hurt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reactordrone Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 3 hours ago, NSEP said: That must've hurt About the same condition as the boosters normally are after impact. A bit flattened but still recognizable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultimate Steve Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 20 minutes ago, Reactordrone said: About the same condition as the boosters normally are after impact. A bit flattened but still recognizable. Some of the cargo, if there is any stored in the orbital module, might have survived and some of it might still be usable depending on what it was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insert_name Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 12 hours ago, kerbiloid said: Roscosmos doesn't enjoy the speculations about the causes. https://translate.google.com.tr/translate?sl=ru&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=ru&ie=UTF-8&u=https://www.interfax.ru/russia/633892&edit-text= So, disregard all previous posts. that site later posted this: https://translate.google.com.tr/translate?sl=ru&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=ru&ie=UTF-8&u=https://www.interfax.ru/russia/633892&edit-text= sounds like they damaged a valve sensor, wonder if it was the oxygen valve like we all suspected Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDE Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 @razark@Ultimate Steve Mir-era Soyuz ships have switched to an ODU architecture: like the Buran, it feeds the RCS and the main thruster(s) from the same tankage of (in Soyuz's case, UDMH-NTO, while Buran used syntin-lOx).This helps remove the need for the elaborate dual-nozzle backup UDMH-NTO engine and replace it with prograde RCS thrusters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 (edited) 7 hours ago, insert_name said: wonder if it was the oxygen valve like we all suspected As the lateral booster has the oxygen tank on top, and afaik the oxygen remains push it from the central booster, probably so. Spoiler Edited October 19, 2018 by kerbiloid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 They say that they've found who did it. https://translate.google.com.tr/translate?sl=ru&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=ru&ie=UTF-8&u=https://www.rbc.ru/society/18/10/2018/5bc8bafd9a794729f1f95a9b?from=main&edit-text= Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatastrophicFailure Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 3 minutes ago, kerbiloid said: They say that they've found who did it. https://translate.google.com.tr/translate?sl=ru&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=ru&ie=UTF-8&u=https://www.rbc.ru/society/18/10/2018/5bc8bafd9a794729f1f95a9b?from=main&edit-text= It... it wasn't the same guy who hammered the sensor in on the Proton, was it? Spoiler Irony that I got a huge, annoying, unavoidable Chevrolet ad on a Russian website... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razark Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 1 hour ago, kerbiloid said: They say that they've found who did it. Due to the imperfections of translations and the bourbon, this (and the headline) sounds a bit accusatory. Are they saying this was an accidental incident, or a deliberate act? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 (edited) 3 minutes ago, razark said: Due to the imperfections of translations and the bourbon, this (and the headline) sounds a bit accusatory. Are they saying this was an accidental incident, or a deliberate act? The assembling specialists listed in a log made mistake(s) while assembling. Edited October 19, 2018 by kerbiloid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razark Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 Just now, kerbiloid said: The assembling specialists listed in a log made mistakes while assempbling. Thanks for the clarification. Mistakes happen, but if they were saying this was a deliberate act, on top of the Soyuz hole, it would be very alarming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVaughan Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 45 minutes ago, razark said: Mistakes happen, but if they were saying this was a deliberate act, on top of the Soyuz hole, it would be very alarming. Even if they are both mistakes, two such mistakes getting made in a relatively short period of time, and then covered up (or at least not adequately reported and followed up) is a problem. And the work culture/environment that allows that to happen on mission critical space hardware probably isn't something that can be easily and quickly fixed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatastrophicFailure Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 10 hours ago, AVaughan said: Even if they are both mistakes, two such mistakes getting made in a relatively short period of time, and then covered up (or at least not adequately reported and followed up) is a problem. And the work culture/environment that allows that to happen on mission critical space hardware probably isn't something that can be easily and quickly fixed. Once is an anomaly. Twice is a coincidence. Thrice is a pattern... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaverickSawyer Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 1 hour ago, CatastrophicFailure said: Once is an anomaly. Twice is a coincidence. Thrice is a pattern... I know this one more as "happenstance, conspiracy, enemy action", but same basic concept. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatastrophicFailure Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 27 minutes ago, MaverickSawyer said: I know this one more as "happenstance, conspiracy, enemy action", but same basic concept. I didn’t wanna be the first one to use the C word. But this is all clearly a part of Elon Musk’s grand conspiracy to become Lord of Mars. First, he gets Constellation cancelled and rolled into SLS, which is forever mired in development hell. He establishes himself as the underdog fighting against Big Space, cuz who doesn’t like an underdog? Antares. He gets Starliner mired down with fuel leaks and stability issues. Then he slowly picks apart Roscosmos with a series of increasingly dramatic accidents with just enough danger to engage the media, entirely plausible due to the economic situation over there. He engages more public support with a dorky yet lovable rich guy to shoot artists around the moon in his megarocket. And to defeat Bezos himself, he goes after Bezos’ own target: the moon. Now he just needs to arrange another “accident” to ground Soyuz for the long term, then gets to revel in public appreciation as the hero when he’s the only one who can send people and cargo to the space station. The Lizard Men will be most pleased Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sh1pman Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 4 hours ago, CatastrophicFailure said: And to defeat Bezos himself, he goes after Bezos’ own target: the moon. He doesn’t need to defeat Bezos to become Lord of Mars, because Bezos has no interest in Mars. Cool optional quest though. Gives a lot of XP for future Mars conquest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatastrophicFailure Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 11 minutes ago, sh1pman said: He doesn’t need to defeat Bezos to become Lord of Mars, because Bezos has no interest in Mars. Cool optional quest though. Gives a lot of XP for future Mars conquest. ...but you haven't heard Bezos's plan yet... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sh1pman Posted October 20, 2018 Share Posted October 20, 2018 25 minutes ago, CatastrophicFailure said: ...but you haven't heard Bezos's plan yet... Emperor of the Solar System? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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