tater Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 Yeah, I didn't see any beanstalk, though, it looked like they were free floating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Treveli Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 Possible explanation: If Ganymede is such a major agro station, then it could be spread over a very large area. We only see a small section in books and show. The falling mirror could have been supporting another area of the station (so it's not falling straight down). It was knocked out of orbit (by accident or design) by the Earth/Mars skirmish in orbit (or an ultra radical OPA faction). There was no way to stop it, so evaced where it was predicted to hit. As for the problems with the passage of time, like any TV show, they've got five seconds to explain/show events, versus five pages in a book. But I agree they (and all scifi shows and movies) need a better system for time and transit so it doesn't look so ridiculously fast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted July 30, 2020 Share Posted July 30, 2020 Ganymede: Mass = 1.482*1023 kg. Orbit radius = 1.07*109 m. Rotation period = synchronous = 7.155 d ~= 6.182*105 s. Reference body = Jupiter (mass = 318 earths ~= 1.9*1027 kg. Ganymedostationary orbit. w = 2 * pi / RotationPeriod = 2 * pi / 6.182*105 s ~= 1.016*10-5 rad/s. R = (G * M / w2)1/3 = (6.67*10-11 * 1.482*1023 / (1.016*10-5)2)1/3 ~= 4.575*107 m ~= 45 750 km. Hill sphere R = a (m/(3M))1/3 = 1.07e9 * (1.482*1023/(3 * 1.9*1027))1/3 ~= 3.170*107 m ~= 31 700 km. Also, it's the Lagrange points L1 & L2 distance. *** 45 750 > 31 700 *** What shocks me the most in the ganymedian stationary station is that Ganymede can't have a stationary orbit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacke Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 I thought the radiation from Jupiter was too high still at Ganymede for people to live there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codraroll Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 7 hours ago, Jacke said: I thought the radiation from Jupiter was too high still at Ganymede for people to live there. I guess that depends how far underground you want to live. In the series, only the spacedocks and greenhouse domes are on the surface. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacke Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 3 hours ago, Codraroll said: I guess that depends how far underground you want to live. In the series, only the spacedocks and greenhouse domes are on the surface. Well, a quick search leads to some lethal numbers. IO - 3600rem/d Europa - 750rem/d Ganymede - 8rem/d Callisto - 0.01rem/d Note that the radiation even at Callisto is very dangerous. I could see a subsurface base on Callisto with restrictions to going up top. Space suits would also shield against a lot of the radiation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 So, Callisto matches the nuclear powerplant personnel limit, 5 rem/year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cubinator Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Jacke said: Well, a quick search leads to some lethal numbers. IO - 3600rem/d Europa - 750rem/d Ganymede - 8rem/d Callisto - 0.01rem/d Note that the radiation even at Callisto is very dangerous. I could see a subsurface base on Callisto with restrictions to going up top. Space suits would also shield against a lot of the radiation. Do these hold true on the far sides of the moons, or is it safer there? Edited July 31, 2020 by cubinator Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 hour ago, cubinator said: Do these hold true on the far sides of the moons, or is it safer there? I think the primary radiation concern is actually inside the orbit of Ganymede. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDE Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 hour ago, cubinator said: Do these hold true on the far sides of the moons, or is it safer there? Due to the radiation being from the magnetic field rather than a point source, not likely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DunaManiac Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 There's this one moment in Star Trek: Into Darkness which not only is unscientific, violates the laws of physics. It's that moment when the Enterprise loses power. The ship, which is clearly in orbit around the Moon, ironically picks up speed only after it's power is out. it inexplicably veers to the left towards earth as if something were pushing it, then proceeds to ignore the Moon's gravity and manages to brake the Moon's escape velocity. I don't remember how long it took to get there, but assuming it took 15 minutes, the ship accelerated to 955,600 miles per hour, which is 38 times the escape velocity of the Earth. Also, the people on board the ship experienced gravity or acceleration instead of free fall. it doesn't make sense why the gravity would be pulling them down, while they are falling, extreme speeds aside. But then it somehow decelerated down to sensible speeds as they aproached the Earth, which violates yet another law of physics, while the people inside the ship didn't feel any difference. Even if this gravity was caused by the mystical extreme acceleration, the angle is all wrong and their bodies would be splattered all over the floor from the extreme and sudden acceleration, nevermind the implausibility of it all. Plotwise it was pretty okay. Not so much sciencewise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacke Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 minute ago, DunaManiac said: There's this one moment in Star Trek: Into Darkness which not only is unscientific, violates the laws of physics. This is the least of Into Darkness's problems. It's riddled through and through with bad characters, bad dialog, etc. 1 minute ago, DunaManiac said: Plotwise it was pretty okay. Not so much sciencewise. O.o It created a past history out of so much stuff stolen from Star Trek TOS. I hated "Star Trek" (2009) but Into Darkness plunged right off the cliff. It's so bad that despite the 3rd recent Star Trek film not being that bad, the crap of Into Darkness killed everything off. There will not be a 4th film in this dumpster-fire series. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DunaManiac Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 minute ago, Jacke said: It's so bad that despite the 3rd recent Star Trek film not being that bad Actually, I think that the 3rd one was the worst. I mean, I think they were great and all, it's just they're not true Star Trek. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tater Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 Spoiler I'm on S3 Ep13 They are talking about using guns. The "speed limit" is 18 kph. Those bullets might sting. Slightly. Assuming the targets don't jog away from them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDE Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 7 hours ago, Jacke said: There will not be a 4th film in this dumpster-fire series. No-one's ever really gone, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacke Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 8 hours ago, DunaManiac said: Actually, I think that the 3rd one was the worst. I mean, I think they were great and all, it's just they're not true Star Trek. "Star Trek Beyond" worse than "Star Trek Into Darkness" ?!? Wow. I'd not watched Beyond as I'm no fan of this warped product of the Age of Abrams (I hated the 2009 starter) but I'd heard it was better. I might have to watch it. 1 hour ago, DDE said: No-one's ever really gone, though. But pre-2009 Star Trek is so much better. Even that horrid last film, Nemesis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 What is that Star Trek all of you talking about? Some clone of Orville? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DunaManiac Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, kerbiloid said: Some clone of Orville? Nope, the reverse. Anyway's, to get back on topic, the movie Interstellar even though it was mostly hard sci-fi, I feel like the main problem with it was the delta v and maneuvers that the Endurance seemed to be able to do. To me it looked like it was propelled by chemical rockets based on the engine bell, (correct me if I'm wrong), but It's hard to believe that that puny rocket could take it to say, Miller's planet, and anyone who has tried to go to Moho that the Delta-V requirements would be astronomical, especially by direct transfer. Also, another nagging problem: where's the light source? I mean, they do mention a neutron star, but it's hard to believe it could light up the entire system and the radiation would most certainly have killed any life trying to form on the surface, plus, the light would be much darker or a much more harsh blue light, the light is clearly coming from a yellow-white star. But where is it? There's also the mystical equation that needs data from a singularity and can magically propel things into space. But what would that accomplish? The food that they brought with them wouldn't be able to be replenished because of the Blight, most crops were eradicated due to the blight. But overall, it was a great movie, just not great science wise. Edited August 1, 2020 by DunaManiac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KerikBalm Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 On 7/30/2020 at 8:38 PM, kerbiloid said: Hill sphere R = a (m/(3M))1/3 = 1.07e9 * (1.482*1023/(3 * 1.9*1027))1/3 ~= 3.170*107 m ~= 31 700 km. Also, it's the Lagrange points L1 & L2 distance. *** 45 750 > 31 700 *** What shocks me the most in the ganymedian stationary station is that Ganymede can't have a stationary orbit. Well since Ganymede is tidally locked, L1 and L2 (and 3,4,5) would be stationary relative to the surface of Ganymede, and not so far from the surface. Active station keeping would be needed, but the station would effectively be a giant solar sail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bej Kerman Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 In Elite: Dangerous, the Frame Shift Drive is a magic device that makes you go really fast in the direction you point and magically syncs your speed with the object you drop near. Would it have killed to have just skip "it's a modified Alcubierre drive" in the part description? That's not how Alcubierre drives work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDE Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Bej Kerman said: Would it have killed to have just skip "it's a modified Alcubierre drive" in the part description? It pacifies the sci-fi fans who think a wrench lost by an astranaut on EVA would immediately fall from orbit and kill someone. Edited August 1, 2020 by DDE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cubinator Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 1 hour ago, DunaManiac said: Anyway's, to get back on topic, the movie Interstellar even though it was mostly hard sci-fi, I feel like the main problem with it was the delta v and maneuvers that the Endurance seemed to be able to do. To me it looked like it was propelled by chemical rockets based on the engine bell, (correct me if I'm wrong), but It's hard to believe that that puny rocket could take it to say, Miller's planet, and anyone who has tried to go to Moho that the Delta-V requirements would be astronomical, especially by direct transfer. Yes, the rockets were overpowered, especially the Rangers. I think they are meant to be plasma rockets, but still - Ranger can drop down to Miller's planet, a super-Earth with 130% surface gravity, and lift off all the way back to the Endurance in one go? It had to be done for the sake of the plot. 1 hour ago, DunaManiac said: Also, another nagging problem: where's the light source? I mean, they do mention a neutron star, but it's hard to believe it could light up the entire system and the radiation would most certainly have killed any life trying to form on the surface, plus, the light would be much darker or a much more harsh blue light, the light is clearly coming from a yellow-white star. But where is it? The black hole's accretion disk provides plenty of yellowish light, probably more than the barely-mentioned neutron star. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, DDE said: sci-fi fans who a wrench lost by an astranaut on EVA would immediately fall from orbit and kill someone. Fools. It will immediately hit the nearest passenger spaceplane instead. All of us could see that. Spoiler Rangers seem greatly depend on the gravity field around. Otherwise why did it take for them several months to get to the Saturn from the Earth. Also, when Endurance had lost some modules in collision, I can't remember any significant precession due to the CoM offset. It's a special voodoo ship. And why did those kilometer-high waves not made the planet tidally locked and freeze at the noon point? Edited August 1, 2020 by kerbiloid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DunaManiac Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 19 minutes ago, kerbiloid said: And why did those kilometer-high waves not made the planet tidally locked and freeze at the noon point? It probably is, I mean, we haven't seen it rotate have we? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerbiloid Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 1 minute ago, DunaManiac said: It probably is, I mean, we haven't seen it rotate have we? Then why did they escape so quickly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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