SpaceDock.info (Mod Hosting Site)

[AlphaAsh]

Internal Server Error. Internal Server Error. Internal Server Error.

I'm rapidly becoming disheartened with the stability of SpaceDock, considering that only a few days ago, before all these changes were being pushed, it was stable and worked.

Guess it's time to find another host for my mods.

[VITAS]

Up to you. If devoting all my time for your pleasure isnt enough for you.

[AlphaAsh]

30 minutes ago, VITAS said:

Up to you. If devoting all my time for your pleasure isnt enough for you.

You aren't and it certainly is. Sorry chap but you offered to provide a service, then asked me to trust you that you aren't just mucking about and it's become clear that you are just mucking about at the expense of the service you offered.

Thanks for volunteering your time and effort but this 'customer' needs a reliable, consistent and usable host to serve his mods.

[VITAS]

wait! you paid me? What else would made you a customer?

BTW dont threaten me (: "Guess it's time to find another host for my mods. ")

Either use it and post some constructive criticism (like i got several 500 errors when doing....) or dont use it at all.

Tank you

[AlphaAsh]

You consider losing some mods to host a threat? To what?

EDIT: Constructive criticism?

The last 48 hours I have had numerous Internal Database Errors when attempting to:

Download a file. Upload a file. Update a mod. View my profile.

I conclude that the database is currently in a unstable state and therefore am concerned that my users cannot get the mods they want. I am concerned that this will continue to be an issue and am therefore seeking a more reliable host.

There you go.

Edited April 9, 2016 by AlphaAsh

[swjr-swis]

Uhm, guys, from where I am standing: you both make reasonable points for your position, but you're also both allowing this exchange to escalate.

We don't want to see the next community mod site host burned out, and we don't want to see mod authors running off to curse in search of stability. No one is doing anything out of malice here, and the intent -of both of you- is to get a good mod delivery to the users.

I for one appreciate the work both of you do, and considering it's volunteer work, I accept that sometimes, it can come with bugs/problems (heck, we're accustomed to accepting that even for paid stuff).

So, may I suggest taking a step back and a deep breath, to keep the peace?

I am sorry that waving a flag is all I can offer; I can read python and make little corrections, but coding it is a level beyond me at the moment. I also have no servers to offer an alternative host. I need you guys to be able to work together. Don't make me beg. It's not pretty. Please?

[VITAS]

imm for that

after changing the flip thing to a simple hover show thing i wont change anything on the production server i think the current version is stable, bug free(?) and usable enough to leave it alone for a while.

So i wont add any new functions in the coming week or more and instead ask everyone to check http://beta.spacedock.info from time to time to find bugs and give opinions on new features.

@AlphaAsh is right. we where so surpirsed by the showstoping bugs emerging from the new version (especialy because we realy tried to test the heck out of it) that we headlessly ran in there trying to fix them. We thought its better to fix stuff like "not beeing able to post updates for mods" asap than having it not function for as long as it would take to build and test a new version of the code. I guess we where wrong.

I also want to make the point that the new design has nothing to do with the stability issues and bugs but its:

1.) my wish to add multigame support

2.) attempts to make the code run faster and more efficient (we dont want to buy ourselves out with larger servers like KS did)

3.) a monitoring script going berserk (it was restarting the site over and over for a day and we didnt notice)

4.) the increased visitor count as result of pre1.1 (atm files are clustered but the site itself isnt)

so im ready to take blame for poor decissions on my part.

But i hope it channels into more people helping out in commiting code to the project.

Darklight and i simply arent the experts in python (im certenly am not) and were forced to use it because thats what the site is written in.

P.S. i know about a lot of problems (e.g. mobile menu) but my day only has 24h so i simply cant write enough good code to fix them all asap.

Edited April 9, 2016 by VITAS

[AlphaAsh]

*nod* From my own experience, it's very valuable to be have a stable setup you can roll back to ready before going live. Of course it depends on the type of roll-out you're doing but I'd suggest going big bang - that's a heck of a lot easier to roll-back from.

[swjr-swis]

1 hour ago, VITAS said:

So i wont add any new functions in the coming week or more and instead ask everyone to check http://beta.spacedock.info from time to time to find bugs and give opinions on new features.

I think that's good way of going about it.

From my part: I have made that beta link my main spacedock link now, so I'll be a permanent beta tester, by choice. I don't consider my need of SpaceDock critical, so I am ok if stuff sometimes doesn't work as expected, I can spot and report any issues, or otherwise offer feedback. I know I can always 'revert' to the stable one if the beta is not working and I really need a mod.

 

1 hour ago, VITAS said:

i know about a lot of problems (e.g. mobile menu) but my day only has 24h so i simply cant write enough good code to fix them all asap.

I get what you're saying, but 24 hours is a serious overestimate. 8 hours/day to spend on the site would be the most anyone could expect even if you were being paid for this, and you're not, so even that is stretching it. So don't overburden yourself, 'asap' in this context should really mean 'when I can reasonably get to it', and we'll accept that.

 

22 minutes ago, AlphaAsh said:

I'd suggest going big bang - that's a heck of a lot easier to roll-back from.

From my own experience in large scale datacenter transition & transformation projects: I agree with this, as long as you ensure you have a stable roll-back situation prepared.

[Bonus Eventus]

3 hours ago, VITAS said:

imm for that

after changing the flip thing to a simple hover show thing i wont change anything on the production server i think the current version is stable, bug free(?) and usable enough to leave it alone for a while.

So i wont add any new functions in the coming week or more and instead ask everyone to check http://beta.spacedock.info from time to time to find bugs and give opinions on new features.

@AlphaAsh is right. we where so surpirsed by the showstoping bugs emerging from the new version (especialy because we realy tried to test the heck out of it) that we headlessly ran in there trying to fix them. We thought its better to fix stuff like "not beeing able to post updates for mods" asap than having it not function for as long as it would take to build and test a new version of the code. I guess we where wrong.

I also want to make the point that the new design has nothing to do with the stability issues and bugs but its:

1.) my wish to add multigame support

2.) attempts to make the code run faster and more efficient (we dont want to buy ourselves out with larger servers like KS did)

3.) a monitoring script going berserk (it was restarting the site over and over for a day and we didnt notice)

4.) the increased visitor count as result of pre1.1 (atm files are clustered but the site itself isnt)

so im ready to take blame for poor decissions on my part.

But i hope it channels into more people helping out in commiting code to the project.

Darklight and i simply arent the experts in python (im certenly am not) and were forced to use it because thats what the site is written in.

P.S. i know about a lot of problems (e.g. mobile menu) but my day only has 24h so i simply cant write enough good code to fix them all asap.

Nice work! I really like how the site looks on Ipad

[CobaltWolf]

@VITAS looking at the beta site, I have some feedback:

The 'flippy' thing the mods do on mouseover is somewhat annoying. If you don't put your mouse in the right spot, they get caught in a loop as the animation takes your mouse off the highlight area, reversing it, causing it to go back to your mouse, reversing it again, etc. I don't mind the motion (though I am partial to merely highlighting) but I think a different motion that doesn't cause the mouse to possibly move out of the selection box would be better.

Also, I feel like the new color scheme (primarily white/gray with blue in some places) makes some of the pages, specifically the mod pages, less intuitive to use. The download button doesn't stick out as much now, making the whole page's navigation less obvious. If that makes sense. EDIT: on the mod page there is just a huge block of almost solid white, and what little text/buttons are there get lost in the void haha.

Edited April 9, 2016 by CobaltWolf

[VITAS]

the flip thing is removed.

 

the page looks so empty because most features planed arent there yet.

i made a color pallet for the page so i could change the dl button color.

 

[AlphaAsh]

Any progress on fixing View Your Profile and Create a New Mod being fixed? The former is still leading to an Internal Database Error this morning and the latter I haven't tried since yesterday when an Internal Database Error kept coming up everytime I tried to complete submitting a mod.

[VITAS]

im not at home atm but ive alerted the others about it.

[AlphaAsh]

13 hours ago, VITAS said:

im not at home atm but ive alerted the others about it.

Seems to be fixed now. Good work and thank you.

[godarklight]

For anyone who has some ideas for which direction the site should go design wise, it's probably best jumping in the IRC channel (There's a link on the spacedock site, CHAT in the main menu).

The thing about design is everyone has a different idea of what they like, and I think the only real way to move forward is by doing back-and-forths with people and making mockups. On the forums it'll sound like flaming as neither side can understand each other, using forums to talk to each other is also slow as molasses.

VITAS does the frontend stuff, I'm much more interested in the actually fun backend code. HTML/CSS is horrible and all you web developers out there are insane if you like it

 

But yeah, let's not let this thread devolve - jump into IRC and chat with us, we're friendly enough that we won't bite, much. The IRC topic there says so.

[Frybert]

Hey guys, just a friendly reminder keep it polite to not get personal.

[Snark]

Regarding my request not to show mod names in all capital letters:

On 4/7/2016 at 10:45 AM, VITAS said:

regarding caps:

the font i use only has caps ...sorry

Could you please reconsider, and find some font that does have upper and lower case?

Seriously, MODSWITHCAMELCASEDNAMES become unreadable eyesores when rendered in all capitals.  Since I use that naming convention for nearly all of my mods, it's especially painful and I don't have any recourse.

Uppercase / lowercase is important to some people.  The way a mod announces itself to the world is through its name, and I picked those names because I liked them and I thought they fit well.  They worked on the old hosting site, and they worked on the original-style SpaceDock, and now they don't work anymore.

I appreciate all the time you're putting in to the site.  However, given that there's a significant, user-impacting effect of using an ALL-CAPITAL font, what benefit does it offer that makes it worthwhile?  Is there a strong reason why you prefer to show the names in all capitals?

(Everything else on the site is just fine in mixed font, it's just the mod names that are in all capitals.  Could you not just use the same font as you do elsewhere?)

[Checker_guy]

Is the site down right now, or is it a maintenance? 

[GDJ]

41 minutes ago, Checker_guy said:

Is the site down right now, or is it a maintenance? 

Nope. I logged on just 2 minutes ago.

[Checker_guy]

12 minutes ago, GDJ said:

Nope. I logged on just 2 minutes ago.

Okay thanks

[inigma]

liking the new digs. great job VITAS! @VITAS

[VITAS]

If you have any problems with the site:

• Post a screenshot of your whole browser screen here or on github
• Post the full url too
• If downloads dont work please post your geographic location and the link to the file you wish to download

We need those informations to fix it.

explanation:

• we dont know where it happened if we dont have the url
• we dont know what happened if we only get a part of the browser screen
• Depending on your location the site serves files you request from different servers so we need your location to identify the server thats acting up.

[godarklight]

Hello everyone, I figured out the problem with mod creation, and broken profiles. If anyone else has other issues please contact either me or @VITAS - But we should be stable again now.

[Snark]

Is it possible there's some bug going on with CKAN and version reporting?

I recently posted an update to my mod, BetterBurnTime, which is CKAN-enabled:

https://spacedock.info/mod/21/BetterBurnTime

...Normally, when I post an update, there's a huge surge of download traffic over the next 3-4 days, with thousands of downloads, as downloads of the prior version drop almost immediately to zero.  The surge is always about the same size, regardless of whether it's a very minor bugfix release or a major release that adds shiny new features.  I'm assuming that's CKAN traffic, and that the reason it doesn't change in size based on "how attractive is the update" is because it's automated traffic as people's CKAN clients just automatically grab the update.

However, when I just posted my 1.4.1 update a couple of days ago, there's been practically no download traffic.  I've seen a couple of hundred downloads, which is pretty much in line with the 216 followers I have that would have gotten notified via email.  That's probably manual-download traffic.  And in the meantime, the 1.4 traffic is continuing virtually unaffected.

It seems to me most likely that what this means is that all the CKAN clients are somehow not seeing my latest update.

I don't know enough about the interaction between CKAN and SpaceDock, or how CKAN works internally, to be able to say for sure whether this is a problem in CKAN or in SpaceDock, but I figured I'd start here.  Anyone have any ideas?