[1.8.1-1.12.x] Modular Launch Pads v2.8.0: Launch clamps evolved: Real-style launch bases and towers [24 December 2024]

[AlphaMensae]

Ok, I've changed my mind, and have started a new AlphaDev branch on the Github. This is not the old AlphaDev (that one is gone) but a copy of the master into which I'll first post the changes that will be part of the next major update (the first digit after the decimal point, i.e. v2.x). Minor changes like bug fixes and tweaks will still be put into the master with the posting of the minor updare release.

The first things that will be put there are the new small crew elevator and crew arm. The elevator tower is done, and am finishing up the crew arm--just need to add a mount option for the now-renamed large crew elevator. 

The large elevator and arm will also be revised to incorporate some things I did with the small ones, like an adjustable hatch access end section.

Edited August 29, 2019 by AlphaMensae

[AlphaMensae]

Another change: I'm going to make what was supposed to be the small crew arm the replacement for the general crew arm, as the smaller width and height are more Kerbal-sized than that big arm.  That arm got bigger than I really wanted, as I wanted it to match the width of the general crew elevator...which was kind of bif to begin width.   So now the general crew arm will be a smaller size, able to be used with both the large and small crew elevators.

It also has a third style variant, a partially-enclosed type that has a roof. The SpaceX-style variant is being reworked for the smaller size arm.

The arm also has the hinge on the side, while still being center-mounted. This allows the start of the arm walkway to be right up next to the edge of the elevator car.

There's also going to be an general-style Tier 1 crew elevator to be an alternate option to the Mercury-type elevator.  It will have an integrated crew walkway and not a full-height arm, and will still swing.

[AlphaMensae]

At last, the newly reworked smaller-size General Crew Arm is done!

The arm now retracts a full 180 degrees, and mounts much closer to the elevator towers, a result of switching to a side hinge method.

But it turns out the side-hinge method resulted in having to duplicate the arm transforms for use with the Large Crew Elevator, as the wider mount size meant that the arm hinge point (which is on the arm core segment) moved farther away from the small mount size, and so the other arm segments had to be moved with it.

This also meant that to reduce the .mu size. I had to remove three of the arm lengths, leaving just two: 7.5m and 10m; don't really need anything longer, and shorter lengths can be filled by the Mercury Crew Elevator or the coming alternate Mini-Tier 1 Crew Elevator.

I also had to remove the adapter mounts for the Saturn Tower/Shuttle FSS, as again they would require two more complete arm duplicates for that new size of mount. It's no big deal for me, as the Saturn pad is for Saturn/SLS, and the Shuttle pad is for the Space Shuttle; anything else (like Falcon 9) uses the General pad parts.

Now, pics!  

The Small Crew Elevator:

 

New General Crew Arm with open truss style and side hatch access:

 

Enclosed 1 style with end access:

 

Enclosed 2 style:

 

New GeneraL Crew Arm on the Large Crew Elevator:

 

It will still be a bit before it goes on the AlphaDev branch, as I still need to revise both the large and small elevators. The small one is going to be simplified a bit more, and the large elevator's base section will be split off into a separate part, as well as a simplification of the tower parts. I never really did like having the base section being included in the modular section, much as it reduced the number of parts, as it has the elevators, and complicated the PAW when you clicked on one of the tower section. I didn't do it for the Saturn/shuttle towers, and so I'm reversing course and splitting the large elevator into two parts as well. The modular elevator tower section is actually going to end up like the Saturn/shuttle tower section.  

[AlphaMensae]

Small Crew Elevator (actual title: Crew Access Elevator - Small Tier 2) tweaks are done. It now just has 6 regular crew tower heights and 3 pad access heights; for pad access the elevator car's extendable walkway is used to get to a launch base's deck, not a crew arm.  The pad access types don't have a solid top plate so the car can go above the top of the elevator is needed. The extendable walkway also doubles as a short alternate crew access for narrow rockets.  

[smotheredrun]

@AlphaMensae Hey, how's it going?  This looks so good!

My hiatus from Kerballing has extended into and now through the summer  but everything in this updated version looks so cool.  And 1.7.something and now KSP 2 are out?!!  I really miss this crowd/community!

 

Keep up the great work!

[KerbalKore]

Ksp2 isn’t out yet  but it will be next year.

but yeah, things are good!

[AlphaMensae]

One worry for me about KP 2: If that crawler-platform and tower can't be disabled in the release, then I won't be able to bring Modular Launch Pads over to it.

I'll just continue developing for KSP 1 then.

[RealKerbal3x]

23 minutes ago, AlphaMensae said:

One worry for me about KP 2: If that crawler-platform and tower can't be disabled in the release, then I won't be able to bring Modular Launch Pads over to it.

I'll just continue developing for KSP 1 then.

Maybe something like Modular Launch Pads has been implemented in KSP 2. In that case, you won't need to port it over at all.

[AlphaMensae]

36 minutes ago, RealKerbal3x said:

Maybe something like Modular Launch Pads has been implemented in KSP 2. In that case, you won't need to port it over at all.

No, they just resurrected the tower from old KSP in a fancier form. It's still just a static object, as the arms don't swing and there's no crew elevator.

There's been plenty of concern raised about it, as the reason the tower was removed from KSP was that it restricted how big a rocket you could launch. Supposedly the tower automatically moves based on rocket size, but I think a lot of people still want a clean pad.

[infinite_monkey]

21 hours ago, AlphaMensae said:

No, they just resurrected the tower from old KSP in a fancier form. It's still just a static object, as the arms don't swing and there's no crew elevator.

There's been plenty of concern raised about it, as the reason the tower was removed from KSP was that it restricted how big a rocket you could launch. Supposedly the tower automatically moves based on rocket size, but I think a lot of people still want a clean pad.

As they promised that there will be multiple launch sites and that you're eben able to build your own, I guess modular launch pads will be possible. Maybe not on KSC's main pad, but on any other pad.

[AlphaMensae]

12 hours ago, infinite_monkey said:

As they promised that there will be multiple launch sites and that you're eben able to build your own, I guess modular launch pads will be possible. Maybe not on KSC's main pad, but on any other pad.

Unless those other pads are reserved for multiplayer only.

[AlphaMensae]

The remade General-now Large Crew Elevator is just about done. It's in two parts, the base section with the elevators, and the tower section with 6 regular height variants (including a 2.5m one), 3 crew access section heights and a top section. All the tower sections have a more detailed truss frame style, with an option for a walled truss style. The top section has had two rooftop antennas and some interior structure detail added as well.

Edited September 6, 2019 by AlphaMensae

[AlphaMensae]

The new Small and Large Crew Elevators, plus the revised Crew Arm, are now on the AlphaDev branch of the Github.

Reminder, AlphaDev is now a conventional development branch, being just a clone of the master branch, into which major updates will first be posted. 

So it entirely replaces the latest release version.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, AlphaMensae said:

Unless those other pads are reserved for multiplayer only.

They're not, but they might be restricted by tech instead. The "built-it-yourself" pads shown so far are quite clearly a part of the colonization system. It would be nice if they used the same system to allow building custom launch sites on Kerbin, though. If they won't, I suppose modders will. 

[AlphaMensae]

 

New Tier 1 Mini Crew Elevator and Crew Arm are done and on the Github.  These are in the Launch Stands tech tree node.

I had to make the arm a separate part, as I discovered the reason for the "Rendering drag cube" message spam in the console that happens a lot of the time. Turns out integrated animated arms that can be adjusted in position with a deploy limit slider will cause the spam to happen if they're actually adjusted with the slider. Separate arms moved with the offset gizmo won't cause this to happen.  So the mini elevator has its own separate mini crew arm.

This same problem affects the Mercury Elevator (and the Gemini one as well, I think), so I'm now reworking it to remove the integrated crew walkway, and making it a separate part. That means the elevator tower can't be rolled back with it attached (unless Animated Attachment is installed), but it is a flip-up walkway (like the Atlas crew elevator had), so that will be the retraction method.

For the rollback animation, I'm adding a manually-operated extension walkway to the elevator pad, as that works fine.

 

The Mini Elevator has an open top so the car-pad can be extended up past it a bit.

[AlphaMensae]

On another issue that was mentioned earlier, I discovered why the clamp versions of the Saturn and Shuttle launch bases don't rotate properly: It's because of the LC-39 pad (for use with KSC Extended) support leg option--they are farther out than the stock pad option (to be where the the IRL ones were, at the corners), too far out for proper rotation.  Turns out the base has to be rotated on the LC-39 pad to be in the right orientation

There are two solutions: Either use the stock pad option (only difference between the two options is where the outer legs are), or go into the Kerbal Konstructs menu and rotate the LC-39 pad static instead and not the launcher base.  

 

And another issue: I did some retesting to see if the various launch bases with the deploy-adjustable hold-downs and support beams cause the "Rendering Procedural Drag" message spam (I didn't think they did). They don't, but I'm going to apply my solution anyways: removing the integrated adjustable hold-down support beams and add the support beam directly to the various hold-downs themselves, basically giving them an extended base. That way if you need to raise them up or move them into the exhaust hole of the launch base, there will be something to give visual support to the hold-down. Also will simplify the launch bases.  

[AlphaMensae]

Revised Mercury and Gemini Crew Elevators are now on the AlphaDev branch. Both caused massive "Rendering procedural drag" message spam in the console, and also caused any Kerbals on EVA to do that "dance" or jerk motion. This was due to the vertical height of integrated crew platforms being adjusted by a deploy limit slider. Strangely, the new Soyuz Launch Base does not suffer this problem, even though it has a crew elevator with an adjustable platform as well. I think this may have something to do with it being the crew elevator being part of a launch clamp.

The Mercury elevator does not have the integrated upward-rotating platform anymore, instead it is now a separate part, with attach nodes added to the elevator tower. Obviously the tower rollback animation can't be used wth this walkway attached, unless Animated Attachment is installed. As an alternative, the elevator car now has an extendable platform that serves as a crew walkway. There is also a side entrance to the elevator car on the ground.

The Gemini elevator's internal crew platform is now part of the elevator car, and moves with it. The platform also an extendable section that is toggled with the animation buttons.

[infinite_monkey]

I did some mod updates after not playing KSP for about 2 months, so I'm not sure if this is due to some incompatibility or a Modular Launch Pads issue:

• there are some "toggle" buttons in the right-click-menu that don't seem to do anything
• launch clamps are messed up - at launch, some of them explode, and they're arranged differently from what I did in the VAB. After reverting the flight, they're in a weird position also in the VAB.

Spoiler

Maybe I'm doing something wrong? What are "Core hold beams" - do I need them?

Another question: is it possible to have the EC generator enabled by default? I keep forgetting that, and end up without control when waiting for a launch window 

[AlphaMensae]

6 hours ago, infinite_monkey said:

I did some mod updates after not playing KSP for about 2 months, so I'm not sure if this is due to some incompatibility or a Modular Launch Pads issue:

• there are some "toggle" buttons in the right-click-menu that don't seem to do anything
• launch clamps are messed up - at launch, some of them explode, and they're arranged differently from what I did in the VAB. After reverting the flight, they're in a weird position also in the VAB.

  Reveal hidden contents

Maybe I'm doing something wrong? What are "Core hold beams" - do I need them?

Another question: is it possible to have the EC generator enabled by default? I keep forgetting that, and end up without control when waiting for a launch window 

It could be the fact that the actual release edition of version 2 differs from the former WIP AlphaDev edition, and the minor updates since then have changed a few things from that. Or it could be an issue with the latest B9PS version, which I haven't used yet.

The lower-case "toggle' buttons are remnants from animations that only serve to adjust a position of something via the deploy limit slider; there's no way to remove it even if all animation start/toggle lines are removed from ModuleAnimateGeneric.

The core and side hold beams are optional extended supports for the hold-down arms, in case they have to poke into the exhaust hole. What I thought was a great solution to attaching hold-downs, but they are somewhat cumbersome, so they're going to be removed in the "Great Split" and attached to the hold-downs themselves (which I should have done in the first place  ).

The EC generator is manual so you can switch to a vehicle's internal power during a countdown.  

[infinite_monkey]

1 hour ago, AlphaMensae said:

The EC generator is manual so you can switch to a vehicle's internal power during a countdown.  

I like that idea, but isn't that the wrong way around? It should be enabled first and then disabled during the countdown.

[AlphaMensae]

21 minutes ago, infinite_monkey said:

I like that idea, but isn't that the wrong way around? It should be enabled first and then disabled during the countdown.

ModuleGenerator only has a true/false setting for "isAlwayActive", so if it's true, it's always on. The only way to shut it off is to make it not always active.

[AlphaMensae]

Now starting the "Great Split", where I reverse course from the earlier mesh merging mania and split the General Launch Base, Plate, Service Tower and the Small Launch Stand into separate sizes. This is to make the different sizes (which are usually different in appearance, aside from the Launch Plate) stand out in the part window, and to make customizing them possible or easier, e.g. adding the extended deck back as a toggleable option for the Large General Launch Base and mkaing the main attach node appropriate for each size. I'm also going to be adding toggleable side panels on the general truss tower secions, for an all-enclosed tower look or even part-open truss, part-covered.  And there may be other additions here and there.

Note: The original internal part name  and attach node names will be retained by one of the new separate parts after the splitting to prevent breaking craft files....though they may end up looking strange.  

First step is adding extended bases (the to-be-removed support beams from the bases) to the hold-downs. These will now be toggleable, with them off by default, so they'll look the same, but if you need to move a hold-down into the exhaust hole, the extended base can be switched on to give a visual indication that something is there to support the hold-down when half of it is over the edge.

Edited September 12, 2019 by AlphaMensae

[infinite_monkey]

When decoupling the fallback towers after being in Step1 retracted position, it seems to snap back to vertical before fully retracting.

[G'th]

So, Alpha. Its been over a year. And I always longed to see you do the Shuttle launchpad. 

Suffice to say, I am screaming right now to see you did it you madlad. I love you. 

[AlphaMensae]

2 hours ago, infinite_monkey said:

When decoupling the fallback towers after being in Step1 retracted position, it seems to snap back to vertical before fully retracting.

Decoupling the tower is only a single-step retraction, don't do a partial one from the manual 2-step method.