will ksp 2 have linux support?

[steve_v]

2 hours ago, MechBFP said:

You do realize that it is quite possible to perform certain cheats by modifying the graphics drivers, i.e. files that aren't related directly to the game, right?

Sure. I simply don't care.
The anti-cheat system is garbage if it cannot do it's job without interfering with the rest of the system, and no software vendor has any right to go poking about in my stuff or screwing up my system for their own purposes.
Most anti-cheat systems are kissing-cousins to DRM, and use the same strategies and technologies. Such technologies are defective by design, and the strategies are just another example of the ever-encroaching corporate control over end-user devices.

Cheating, like piracy, will always exist. No technological measure less than hermetically sealing all PCs and encrypting and signing all software will prevent it (and even then it's debatable), and anti-cheat DRM, like anti-piracy DRM, hurts innocent users as much as cheaters and pirates.

 

2 hours ago, richfiles said:

How many mods are developed by Linux players? Has anyone ever figured that out?

I doubt anyone has counted, but I can say with confidence that several of the oldest and most cherished KSP1 mods were and still are developed on GNU/Linux systems.

 

1 hour ago, Lord Aurelius said:

It probably comes down to finances unfortunately

Of course it does. Take Two has an army of furniture-absorbingly poophole-retentive beancounters, and if you look at things with that attitude a GNU/Linux port doesn't make sense.
I mean, that's just another example of the catch-22 @Geonovastmentioned earlier, and if it's ever going to change someone has to actually release games for the platform. A shame that those in the best financial position to do so (did I hear mention of ridiculous profit margins somewhere?) are also the least willing.

 

1 hour ago, Lord Aurelius said:

From a development standpoint Linux has a lot of advantages, but not necessarily for KSP mod development itself.

Well, since Micro$oft bought monodevelop (embrace, extend) and turned it into Visual Studio for Mac (extinguish) we don't really have a .net IDE any more, but other than that...

[Guest]

I hope there will be Linux support and I think the odds are better than for almost any other game out there. 

I'm fairly certain that Linux is a fairly small fraction of the player base, even for KSP, and that maintaining a Linux version of the game costs more than the profits they bring in directly (and no, it's not as simple as "push button to compile Linux binary" even on Unity, as the significant number of unaddressed Linux-specific bugs shows). However, KSP is a little bit special in that it owes its longevity to mods – and many of the most important, most motivated, and most knowledgeable modders work and play on Linux exclusively. 

I.e. when looking purely at the short-term bottom line, there really isn't much of a case to be made for maintaining a Linux version. But when looking at the long-term viability of the game and the long tail that has certainly brought in the bulk of the revenue, Linux-based modders are crucial, and I'm not at all certain that they would migrate to Windows or the Mac, or be replaced by Windows or Mac-based modders, should Linux support be dropped.

It remains to be seen if Private Division sees it the same way.

[steve_v]

2 hours ago, Brikoleur said:

it's not as simple as "push button to compile Linux binary" even on Unity

It's exactly as simple as building for any other platform. The difference is that bugs in the binary that the "build for Windows" button produces actually get attention, both from the game developers and upstream at Unity. The GNU/Linux and MacOS output, not so much.
The vast majority of bugs in KSP affect all platforms anyway, the only reason there are a number of outstanding GNU/Linux specific items on the tracker is because nobody is doing anything about them.
To be fair, at least half of them are Unity bugs anyway.

 

2 hours ago, Brikoleur said:

Linux-based modders are crucial

Absolutely.
The best (code) modders tend to be hobbyist hackers*, and those tend to gravitate towards open-source hacker-friendly platforms, for fairly obvious reasons.
Without them we wouldn't have such influential projects as ModuleManager, MechJeb  or CKAN, among countless other mods. Mods that directly add value to the game at no cost to the company.
Hopefully there are some beancounters at Take Two who can see that, but TBH (experience breeds pessimism) I expect the corporate mentality (for a game publisher apparently synonymous with "buy out the competition, work the devs to burnout, and squeeze the customers for every cent you can") is too ingrained to see beyond short-term profit predictions and franchise potential.

 

*Because mass-media and general stupidity, I guess I should link the definition to avoid the inevitable outrage. Sigh.

[Guest]

5 hours ago, steve_v said:

It's exactly as simple as building for any other platform. The difference is that bugs in the binary that the "build for Windows" button produces actually get attention, both from the game developers and upstream at Unity. The GNU/Linux and MacOS output, not so much.

Yep, exactly. Maintaining something for any platform demands resources, and Linux bugs are neglected because there are so few Linux players compared to Windows or probably even Mac players. It would be very cool if cross-platform compatibility really worked perfectly but there it is, it doesn't.

(The Mac version BTW performs much worse than the Windows version. I used to have an iMac running BootCamp, and the performance difference between the two versions running on the same hardware was... stark.)

[Lord Aurelius]

Now I'm tempted to repurpose my old gaming laptop as a dedicated Linux machine just to show support for games on Linux, its more or less the same Clevo model that System76 used for one of their machines so all the hardware should be supported.

[MSFC]

a revival or extension of

I have always played KSP on Ubuntu Linux via Steam and it has always worked fine. That has been because of native Linux support, but I also play other games that are "Windows" only. But some games don't work that way - too many Windows-native dependencies for Steam or WINE to compensate I guess (not being a power user). So when KSP2 is released, I'd like to try it on Linux with WINE, or Steam with Proton as the case may be; and I get that this choice will not be supported by Intercept Games. But if I buy the early release and I can't get it to work with WINE (or to keep this generic, if it does not work on ANY UNSUPPORTED PLATFORM) , will Intercept Games refund my purchase? - if I wait for Steam, and it does not work with Proton, then of course Steam will make the refund - I already trod that path too many times to count.

[Gargamel]

Overlapping threads have been merged.   Please don’t start a new thread to continue the discussion of another.   

[Ashandalar]

24 minutes ago, MSFC said:

a revival or extension of

I have always played KSP on Ubuntu Linux via Steam and it has always worked fine. That has been because of native Linux support, but I also play other games that are "Windows" only. But some games don't work that way - too many Windows-native dependencies for Steam or WINE to compensate I guess (not being a power user). So when KSP2 is released, I'd like to try it on Linux with WINE, or Steam with Proton as the case may be; and I get that this choice will not be supported by Intercept Games. But if I buy the early release and I can't get it to work with WINE (or to keep this generic, if it does not work on ANY UNSUPPORTED PLATFORM) , will Intercept Games refund my purchase? - if I wait for Steam, and it does not work with Proton, then of course Steam will make the refund - I already trod that path too many times to count.

What do you mean "wait for Steam"? Early access should be available on Steam on the 24th, the same time it's available elsewhere.

[EnderiumSmith]

Windows runs like crap. It takes forever to boot and each time it does a forced update it starts to randomly blue screen for a few days. Its also inconvenient to restart the pc just to play a game on windows. If theres no linux support ill stick with 1. We already have interstellar.

[GoldForest]

14 minutes ago, EnderiumSmith said:

Windows runs like crap. It takes forever to boot and each time it does a forced update it starts to randomly blue screen for a few days. Its also inconvenient to restart the pc just to play a game on windows. If theres no linux support ill stick with 1. We already have interstellar.

Linux support won't be in EA. It will come after KSP 2 exits EA and some time down the line after 1.0. 

[MSFC]

1 hour ago, Gargamel said:

Overlapping threads have been merged.   Please don’t start a new thread to continue the discussion of another.   

ha! The forum engine specifically RECOMMENDS starting a new thread when the old one is "old", fyi. Moderation vs configuration - the ancient conflict never ends!

[MSFC]

1 hour ago, Ashandalar said:

What do you mean "wait for Steam"? Early access should be available on Steam on the 24th, the same time it's available elsewhere.

Something about the announcement page at https://www.kerbalspaceprogram.com/games-kerbal-space-program-2 made me think there was some kind of exclusivity for Early Access, but now I see that Early Access is also going to be available on Steam. But regardless of that my question remains - if I purchase directly for a non-supported platform, would Intercept Games refund my purchase if the game does not work? I think only Intercept Games can answer this; presumably someone from there will eventually reply.

[Lisias]

3 hours ago, GoldForest said:

Linux support won't be in EA. It will come after KSP 2 exits EA and some time down the line after 1.0. 

What may be a bad move, as there are some subtle difference between Linux and Windows (and MacOS!) that is way harder to cope with when you already have a 1.0 release aiming only to Windows.

Epic and Steam clients are a known pain the bottom on non Windows machines due this - I had to create blundles with tricked filesystems and then mount them on a directory to use these ones on MacOS. GOG client is the only one that just works on MacOS - exactly because they aimed Linux at the same time Windows.

So, in a nutshell - there's a good chance that Linux and MacOS support will not be available for more than a year after 1.0 is gold. If ever.

[Guest]

On 2/11/2023 at 5:23 PM, EnderiumSmith said:

Windows runs like crap. It takes forever to boot and each time it does a forced update it starts to randomly blue screen for a few days. Its also inconvenient to restart the pc just to play a game on windows. If theres no linux support ill stick with 1. We already have interstellar.

I must be doing something very wrong with my Windows install then.

I've installed Win 10 on my PC in November 2016, on a SATA SSD. Since then that same install survived all the updates, 2 SSD changes, 2 changes of the partition table, a change of MOBO and CPU from an Intel to an AMD one, a 2 GPU changes from NVIDIA to AMD.

It boots fast, forced updates have rarely been a thing for me (set my network as a metered connection) and the only blue screens I've ever saw are from my dumb-ass self  installing some hardware incorrectly (my un-shielded SSD didn't like to have the GPU exhaust right on top of it, running demanding games from it made the whole PC crash after a few minutes).

 

And, don't get me wrong, I'm no windows fan, in the same room my desktop sits in Linux PCs outnumber my Windows one 4 to 1 (2 Raspberry PIs, one for my 3D printers and one for Pi-hole, my old laptop and a Steamdeck), and Steamdeck is already rigged up to use my keyboard, mouse and monitors setup for when I don't need the full performance of my gaming PC and I can't wait to have 100% of my gaming doable without any problems from Linux to ditch Windows completely. 

I just don't like when people feel the need to make up things to justify a position that is valid to begin with.

 

That said I can't wait to see if the game does indeed run on Proton, I'll do it on D1 if the game passes my refund-window review, I'll try to remember to report it here if it works or not.

Edited February 15, 2023 by Master39

[Bej Kerman]

On 2/11/2023 at 5:26 PM, MSFC said:

Something about the announcement page at https://www.kerbalspaceprogram.com/games-kerbal-space-program-2 made me think there was some kind of exclusivity for Early Access, but now I see that Early Access is also going to be available on Steam. But regardless of that my question remains - if I purchase directly for a non-supported platform, would Intercept Games refund my purchase if the game does not work? I think only Intercept Games can answer this; presumably someone from there will eventually reply.

I don't know. Will they refund if you make the conscious decision to attempt to run it on a platform that it explicitly states it won't be running on until some time after EA?

[Bej Kerman]

On 2/11/2023 at 4:23 PM, EnderiumSmith said:

Windows runs like crap. It takes forever to boot and each time it does a forced update it starts to randomly blue screen for a few days. Its also inconvenient to restart the pc just to play a game on windows. If theres no linux support ill stick with 1.

That sounds more like something that's being caused by shoddy internals than anything.

On 2/11/2023 at 4:23 PM, EnderiumSmith said:

If theres no linux support ill stick with 1. We already have interstellar.

To be fair, you don't have that much of a choice. Still, you'll be dealing with all the bull waste ShadowZone brought up in his Invictus part 1 post-mortem, a generally unpolished experience, a million mods that are implemented as applets instead of being properly integrated into the UI (like what stock KSP did to the dV indicator, compare to Kerbal Engineer's comparatively unwieldy and unfriendly readouts), etc. It might be worth looking into VMs or dual boots if KSP's manure-factor starts getting to you - that much is evident by the devs' emphasis on user experience.

[m4v]

On 2/11/2023 at 1:39 PM, GoldForest said:

Linux support won't be in EA. It will come after KSP 2 exits EA and some time down the line after 1.0. 

Too bad, the developing team is missing out.

Edited February 16, 2023 by m4v

[Arugela]

The first comment about being used to filing bug reports is more relevant than the second comment!