Everything hinges on the first update. Fingers crossed! [discussion]

[TheArturro]

I bought KSP 2 in the first couple of minutes after it launched in EA. I had a fair amount of fun with it as well as a couple of headaches, which is understandable during early access period. However, just as a lot of other players, I have a feeling that this is a bit of Too-Early-Access Release considering the amount of problems troubling the game right now (as of 28.02.2023).

There has been a lot of complaints over the state of the game, some more fair than others. Combined with a very high price tag for EA (240 PLN ~ $54 !!! here in Poland) it doesn't surprise that a very low number of copies have been sold during the first days. It does raise some sad concerns whether the game's development will continue.

In my opinion, the first update will be the most crucial step towards either forging KSP 2 into an ultimate-space-simulator or... let's stay positive for now.

I believe that, provided the update fixes at least 1/3 of the current problems, the game will attract more KSP 1 veterans, and with following updates adding newer features even some new players.

 

Fingers crossed for the first update!

 

[Periple]

Everything hinges on the first year. 

The publicity will turn around when the game turns around. If it's after the first update, great. If it's after six months, it'll still be fine. If it's still a mess after a year, then the publisher will likely take some more drastic steps.

[Mutex]

4 minutes ago, Periple said:

Everything hinges on the first year. 

The publicity will turn around when the game turns around. If it's after the first update, great. If it's after six months, it'll still be fine. If it's still a mess after a year, then the publisher will likely take some more drastic steps.

This seems like a much more reasonable prediction than some I've seen.

T2 know that the better state the game is in, the more sales there will be. They'll absolutely give the developers a good chance to turn things around before they cut their losses.

[Homer_S]

I believe the technical term is E-AF-A...

 

Seriously, is there a way to see when patches get posted for those that bought direct from Private Division?

Here is what I think I have seen so far, I'm sure of the first two...

0.1.0.0.20893    Patch 1 (or whatever) <- live now
0.1.0.0.20892    EA / Scott Manley's first video
0.1.0.0.20658    Matt Lowne's first video
0.1.0.0.20375    ShadowZone's first video

 

Homer

[MechBFP]

I am curious if some of the ways the game does things now was done on purpose, or if it was done just to get the game into a “shippable” state on the 24th. 
You can browse the bug reports forum for those that have been digging through the game files and it sounds like a number of things were implemented in a very hacky manner without apparent consideration for the consequences later on.

If these solutions were just tossed together in order to get the game out the door, but they are actively working on what their real solution is behind the scenes, then I think the game will be okay.

If those hacky solutions were always the intended target, then I have far less confidence in the end goal being reached. 

[MarcAbaddon]

I don't really want to turn this in another general concerns thread, but I doubt that every central gameplay loop that currently has issues was just simply thrown together for EA. And yes, that is somewhat troubling.

Anyway, I agree it's the first year that counts but I also think the first patch/more detailed communication we receive will give us a good indicator how the first year will go. They need to be fairly clear on their priorities.

[magnemoe]

1 hour ago, Periple said:

Everything hinges on the first year. 

The publicity will turn around when the game turns around. If it's after the first update, great. If it's after six months, it'll still be fine. If it's still a mess after a year, then the publisher will likely take some more drastic steps.

This, its two ways to do updates, quick fast fixed and stuff who takes longer to handle.  Has an feeling some things are easy like spam of pause message, stop time warp and trust, the camera and probably  the maneuver nodes. 
Two observations, it looked like it was less bugs during the pre launch event. I guess scope was more limited than now people has the game? 
I also has an strong suspicion that KSP 2 generate much more bugs if framerate is low. KSP 1 did not but this very common in games. 

[LameLefty]

According to SteamDB, a “RELEASETEST” branch was updated 17 minutes ago.  So fingers crossed for some fixes Soon(tm). 

[jnbspace]

It absolutely depends on the first updates.

KSP1 shipped in much the same ropy, near unplayable state that KSP2 is currently in. The difference is that KSP2 is much more in the public view than KSP1 was. KSP1 was noticed by a  few physics nerds who were enamoured by the concept and they would forgive those errors. Shipping KSP2 early might get revenue and feedback but its also getting them reputation. If the first updates don't ship soon and make a substantial difference to the playability then they may be too late to undo the damage to reputation.

Yes it is early access so we can forgive missing features. No career mode , lack of re-entry heating, dodgy maneouvre nodes are really annoying but forgiveable. What shouldn't have happened is shipping something that requires a 700 euro video card and then still crashes.

For the moment I've gone back to KSP1. I'll hope for something usable out of KSP2 but I'll let others pay that high entry price for now.
 

[Fullmetal Analyst]

2 hours ago, Mutex said:

T2 know that the better state the game is in, the more sales there will be. They'll absolutely give the developers a good chance to turn things around before they cut their losses.

bruh what are u basing that statement on? they already gave them a whopping 5 years of development time with delay after delay, and now they released THIS, a 50€ EA release, full of bugs,  in a desperate attempt to mitigate financial damage, i strongly doubt that the devs have alot of room for fooling around anymore, if they cant fix all the gamebreaking issues within the next 3 months its probably the end of the line...

[Mutex]

29 minutes ago, Fullmetal Analyst said:

bruh what are u basing that statement on? they already gave them a whopping 5 years of development time with delay after delay, and now they released THIS, a 50€ EA release, full of bugs,  in a desperate attempt to mitigate financial damage, i strongly doubt that the devs have alot of room for fooling around anymore, if they cant fix all the gamebreaking issues within the next 3 months its probably the end of the line...

If I'd already given them five years, I'd be willing to give them one more if it made the difference between a successful game, and eating a massive loss.

[RayneCloud]

The primary thing my experience in this industry has taught me is that you don't get second chances and you don't get a second "Release". There are some exceptions, NMS, FFXIV, and the rebound of Cyberpunk, but the average game doesn't get a second chance. I only hope that the release cadence steps up to at least bi-weekly updates and that the project strives towards the goal no matter what with fixes, optimizations, content and features. I want to see KSP 2 succeed. I also agree that this first patch will set the stage, hence we're more than likely not going to see it this week. (That's just a guess, I could be dead wrong.)

[regex]

3 hours ago, TheArturro said:

I believe that, provided the update fixes at least 1/3 of the current problems

lol

Look, I think this is going to be a fantastic game, it's miles beyond KSP1 in a lot of ways, but like, 1/3 of the current problems will probably take a couple months or more of dev work. There are a lot of problems.

[linuxgurugamer]

[snip]

Well, I guess you haven't even tried playing it.  Or, maybe your system is not good enough?

I've run several successful missions to the Mun, as well as building planes, flying, etc.

Look on Twitch, you will see many people currently playing KSP 2.  

 

Of course it has problems.  That's why it's called "Early Access".  

If you would read the Steam page, it specifically says the following:
 

Quote

Get instant access and start playing; get involved with this game as it develops.

Note: This Early Access game is not complete and may or may not change further. If you are not excited to play this game in its current state, then you should wait to see if the game progresses further in development.

and 

Quote

Get immediate access to games that are being developed with the community's involvement. These are games that evolve as you play them, as you give feedback, and as the developers update and add content.

 

If you don't want to participate, then don't.  But don't criticize for the sake of hearing your own voice with no content at all

Edited February 28, 2023 by Starhawk
Redacted by moderator

[tstein]

8 minutes ago, RayneCloud said:

The primary thing my experience in this industry has taught me is that you don't get second chances and you don't get a second "Release". There are some exceptions, NMS, FFXIV, and the rebound of Cyberpunk, but the average game doesn't get a second chance. I only hope that the release cadence steps up to at least bi-weekly updates and that the project strives towards the goal no matter what with fixes, optimizations, content and features. I want to see KSP 2 succeed. I also agree that this first patch will set the stage, hence we're more than likely not going to see it this week. (That's just a guess, I could be dead wrong.)

You are right on that, Cyberpunk had to pull a whole anime to  have a second release, not many can do that. That said, public is weird, sometimes you create a "Free expansion" with a  different sub tittle and pack a lot of fixes and a few features and that magically  is taken as a second chance.

[RaBDawG]

3 hours ago, TheArturro said:

I bought KSP 2 in the first couple of minutes after it launched in EA. I had a fair amount of fun with it as well as a couple of headaches, which is understandable during early access period. However, just as a lot of other players, I have a feeling that this is a bit of Too-Early-Access Release considering the amount of problems troubling the game right now (as of 28.02.2023).

There has been a lot of complaints over the state of the game, some more fair than others. Combined with a very high price tag for EA (240 PLN ~ $54 !!! here in Poland) it doesn't surprise that a very low number of copies have been sold during the first days. It does raise some sad concerns whether the game's development will continue.

In my opinion, the first update will be the most crucial step towards either forging KSP 2 into an ultimate-space-simulator or... let's stay positive for now.

I believe that, provided the update fixes at least 1/3 of the current problems, the game will attract more KSP 1 veterans, and with following updates adding newer features even some new players.

 

Fingers crossed for the first update!

 

well prepare to be disappointed.  The only thing they are fixing withy first update is issues causing game not to load and or crash.  No performance updates, struts, heat, etc.

[Mutex]

15 minutes ago, RayneCloud said:

The primary thing my experience in this industry has taught me is that you don't get second chances and you don't get a second "Release". There are some exceptions, NMS, FFXIV, and the rebound of Cyberpunk, but the average game doesn't get a second chance.

Does that hold true when the initial "release" is Early Access?

[linuxgurugamer]

1 hour ago, LameLefty said:

According to SteamDB, a “RELEASETEST” branch was updated 17 minutes ago.  So fingers crossed for some fixes Soon(tm). 

Link, i can't find it

[Stephensan]

Just now, linuxgurugamer said:

Link, i can't find it

https://steamdb.info/app/954850/depots/

[RayneCloud]

Just now, Mutex said:

Does that hold true when the initial "release" is Early Access?

Usually? 

Yeah... and very unfortunately so...  steam has hit nearly 60,000 games (if not more) and the average indie EA sales rate is anywhere from 30,000 copies to 50,000 copies at best. Most games on steam don't ever sell above a 1,000 units..

[linuxgurugamer]

1 minute ago, Stephensan said:

https://steamdb.info/app/954850/depots/

Thank you

[MarcAbaddon]

It was also updated on Monday. Doesn't really tell us anything except that they are working (which isn't exactly a big surprise).

[RayneCloud]

Also, I am begging you all not to look at steamDB as any indication of any incoming build and hype yourselves up only to be disappointed and then get angry at the dev team. 

I posted this on reddit,

Quote

More than likely no, there was a releastest update yesterday. I don't work on this project so I could be wrong here, but I'm a QA lead for another studio and "release test" screams to me that it's an integration testing build where they merge in fixes from other branches, test it for a possible release candidate and see if it passes or fails any sort of  checks or not.

What we might be seeing is,
* Development Branches are testing fixes
* Those fixes are integrated and merged in to other branches for QA testing
* If the fixes don't break things, they get merged in to a release testing branch that's more than likely for testing release candidates
* If all goes well, that released test turns in to a public build we all get.

Anywho, just pure speculation on my part.

 

All this tells us, is that they are working. Hard. Multiple branches, multiple updates, two Release Test branch updates, tell me the team is focused and working. Which is good. 

Edited February 28, 2023 by RayneCloud

[Stephensan]

Just now, RayneCloud said:

Also, I am begging you all not to look at steamDB as any indication of any incoming build and hype yourselves up only to be disappointed and then get angry at the dev team. 

I posted this on reddit,

 

we know its in the upcoming weeks, so seeing that in less than 4 days there is tons of branches, makes alot of people happy.

[RayneCloud]

Just now, Stephensan said:

we know its in the upcoming weeks, so seeing that in less than 4 days there is tons of branches, makes alot of people happy.

I am glad it does and it should  It shows the community the team is doing what we want them to do. They're working hard. Let's cheer that on and support them!