Firespitter propeller plane and helicopter parts v7.1 (May 5th) for KSP 1.0

[Snjo]

Hey Snjo!

Quick question, you can PM these answers and/or any other detail if you'd like.

-How do your helicopter modules work?

-How does the player translate forward, back, left, right? (without rolling/pitching in place).

-How is collective done? (up, down) is it just throttle up and down?

-I'm assuming tail rotor controls yaw.

In the following two screens you note more or less the issue:

http://i.imgur.com/ZBhhiJk.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/jnXrHUY.jpg

-The main rotor is linked to the rotor head which is linked to the turboshaft. I'm assuming your module would control the main rotor? What is that declared as?

-In the IVA, as I increase collective (up, down) what happens? How does your module handle that? I need to know so that I can separate out the proper part that'll move. If it's throttle, I need to know so I can declare the collective handles as throttles so they move up and down as the player increases/decreases collective.

-If so, how is cyclic handled? We can have the cyclic stick controlled like normal (like we do in the KSOs), but does your module which control the main rotor automatically do bladeslip, blade translation and such?

-So main rotor, which module do we use?

-Tail rotor, which module do we use?

-Is the engine a separate thing? (Helicopter's, especially this one, don't really have "thrust").

There are two sets of engines, the old ones, which use the stock engine module with a lot of hacks on top, and the new ones based on a totally new piece of engine code.

The old one, used in v6 and earlier, tilt the thrustTransform to control pitch and roll, and vary the thrust amount to simulate collective. The tail rudder is a separate engine with 0 output unelss you yaw, in which case it ramps up the thrust, and flips the direction of the thrustTrasnform to yaw left/right.

So rockets.

The new code, used in v7, which has only been shown as a test so far, uses actual blades with lift code on them, both for main and tail rotors, just with different axis response settings.

They are more complicated to set up, but more customizable. You can opt to not use blade physics, and just use the new engine module's thrust system to get most of what you need. I think I did that on the electric main rotor in the pre-release.

Translation is only done by pithing and rolling to create thrust in the desired direction, while maintaining altitude by altering the collective. This is easily done with hover mode.

BTW, for any code explorers out there, there IS a module for

, just no part using them

If you check the video I made of v7 features, you will see the blades pitching. That's the very real thing that control flight, since the wing code is running on transforms inside those pitching blades.

As for instrumentation, if you use a throttle prop, it will show the collective value in normal mode, since normal mode reads the throttle for collective, while keeping engine RPM as a separate internal thing. If you use hove mode however, pressing ctrl and shift to go up and down won't look correct. In this state the blade pitch varies wildly, but that's not seen in the throttle, however, there is an internal value called longtermHoverCollective, which is a smoothed average for the current collective. It would be possible to feed that to a throttle using a new throttle prop code.

Hey Snjo, will we see a Lancaster part set, i.e - Faithful Lancaster cockpits, fuselage, gunner ports (you could use Bahamuto's Armoury plugin for gun turrets), wings rear wheels, etc. seeing as we have the engines and stuff - in update maybe v7.0 or v8.0 because those Lancaster engines have a lot of potential for a MASSIVE lancaster replica!?

I know it's very long ago since I started talking about those parts. I just haven't been doing much modelling, and know that starting the IVA of that cockpit will be a big job, so...

I still want to, just need to get in the right mood I guess. The biplane parts came out so well that I kind of rested on my laurels.

I have made an electrificated swamp engine in the past, just add this to the bottom of it's part.cfg. I don't think the heli engines can be reversed though.

PART

{

// --- general parameters ---

name = FSswampEngineElec

module = Part

author = Snjo

// --- asset parameters ---

mesh = model.mu

//scale = 0.1

scale = 1.0

// --- node definitions ---

//node_stack_top = 5.82, 3.74, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 0.0

//node_attach = 5.82, 3.74, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 0.0

node_stack_top = 0.582, 0.374, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 0.0

node_attach = 0.582, 0.374, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 0.0

// --- FX definitions ---

//fx_exhaustLight_yellow = 0.0, -0.1, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, power

//fx_smokeTrail_light = 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, power

fx_exhaustSparks_flameout = 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 0.0, 1.0, 0.0, flameout

// --- Sound FX definition ---

//sound_fspropstart.wav = engage

//sound_fspropidle.wav = power

//sound_jet_deep =

//sound_vent_soft = disengage

sound_explosion_low = flameout

// --- editor parameters ---

TechRequired = specializedControl

cost = 950

category = Propulsion

subcategory = 0

title = FS3SE Swamp Engine Electric

manufacturer = Bitesized Industries

description = It's obviously not just an upscaled table fan. Obviously! Now with electrickery!

// attachment rules: stack, srfAttach, allowStack, allowSrfAttach, allowCollision

attachRules = 0,1,0,1,1

// --- standard part parameters ---

mass = 0.3

dragModelType = default

maximum_drag = 0.2

minimum_drag = 0.2

angularDrag = 2

crashTolerance = 7

maxTemp = 3600

MODULE

{

name = FSengineSounds

//engage =

//running =

power = Firespitter/Sounds/sound_fselectricengine

//disengage =

//flameout =

//warning = Firespitter/Sounds/sound_fsheatDing

powerPitchBase = 0.7

thrustAddedToPitch = 0.7

powerFadeInSpeed = 0.01

powerFadeInDelay = 0.0

powerVolume = 1.0

engageVolume = 1.0

warningSoundThreshold = 0.8

warningCooldownTime = 2.0

}

MODULE

{

name = ModuleEngines

thrustVectorTransformName = thrustTransform

exhaustDamage = False

ignitionThreshold = 0.1

minThrust = 0

maxThrust = 45

heatProduction = 300

useEngineResponseTime = True

engineAccelerationSpeed = 20

engineDecelerationSpeed = 20

useVelocityCurve = True

PROPELLANT

{

name = ElectricCharge

ratio = 1

DrawGauge = True

}

PROPELLANT

{

name = FSCoolant

ratio = 0.01

}

atmosphereCurve

{

key = 0 3500

key = 1 3500

}

velocityCurve

{

key = 500 0 0 0

key = 425 0.2 0 0

key = 0 1 0 0

}

}

MODULE

{

name = FSpropellerAtmosphericNerf

thrustModifier = 1.1

}

MODULE

{

name = ModuleResourceIntake

resourceName = FSCoolant

checkForOxygen = false

area = 1

intakeSpeed = 50

intakeTransformName = thrustTransform //Intake

}

RESOURCE

{

name = FSCoolant

amount = 5.0

maxAmount = 5.0

}

MODULE

{

name = FSplanePropellerSpinner

propellerName = propeller

useRotorDiscSwap = 0

rotationSpeed = -700

windmillRPM = 0.0

}

MODULE

{

name = FSmultiAxisEngine // allows for rotating three different objects in an engine or other part. Must be three separate objects or empties.

pitchObject = pitchObject //rotates around the y axis

yawObject = yawObject //rotates around the x axis

rollObject = none // rotates around the z axis

//pitchDefaultRotation = 0,0,0 etc can be used to add to the 0,0,0 + p,r,y rotation reset each update

axisMultiplier = 15, 0, 30 // pitch, roll, yaw

}

// END PART

}

You can add the thrust reversing module to any engine, except ones with the gimbal module (cause that overrides it in silly ways).

[Furious1964]

I have the latest Firespitter (633) and KSP 0.24.2 and I'm still getting an incompatibility warning for Firespitter. Is this a false positive? Is this updated yet?

[JonBar]

I have the latest Firespitter (633) and KSP 0.24.2 and I'm still getting an incompatibility warning for Firespitter. Is this a false positive? Is this updated yet?

Think it is a false positive, see here, one page back he gave out a newer dll for those who are annoyed by the warnings.

[Nuke]

a small request:

please make FSplanePropellerSpinner work with ModuleEnginesFX. im having to choose between cool particle effects and spinneh rotors and i want both.

Edited July 27, 2014 by Nuke

[Snjo]

a small request:

please make FSplanePropellerSpinner work with ModuleEnginesFX. im having to choose between cool particle effects and spinneh rotors and i want both.

I feel like it already does. I changed the code a while back from referencing ModuleEngines to referencing a wrapper that can talk to ModuleEngines, ModuleEnginesFX or FSengine.

What happens when you try?

[Nuke]

*does science*

oh wait never mind i did something stupid. i had commented out the module a few versions back while i was having trouble getting the right version of firespitter.dll installed. when i uncommented it, i must have inadvertently deleted a line break so that this:

MODULE
	{
		name = FSplanePropellerSpinner
...

was like this:

MODULE{
		name = FSplanePropellerSpinner
...

and that was enough to break everything/crash the game. i fixed it and it appears to be working now. sorry i wasted your time. at least thats one more bug i can cross off my todo list.

[Snjo]

I updated the official release for 0.24.2. I thought I saw someone mentioning bugs that would lead to a 0.24.3, but time will tell I guess.

It's still too hot and humid here to get any proper work done. This has been the craziest norwegian summer I can remember! (Which probably means it's like a Floridian winter)

[Smurfalot]

I have made an electrificated swamp engine in the past, just add this to the bottom of it's part.cfg. I don't think the heli engines can be reversed though.

Sweet, thanks.

[Eskandare]

I updated the official release for 0.24.2. I thought I saw someone mentioning bugs that would lead to a 0.24.3, but time will tell I guess.

It's still too hot and humid here to get any proper work done. This has been the craziest norwegian summer I can remember! (Which probably means it's like a Floridian winter)

I just saw your v.7 preview. I, being a helicopter pilot and mechanic, I got very excited! I know it won't be exactly like the real thing but for Kerbal physics it looks close. Now I can build my Sikorsky style sky crane helicopter a bit better. It looks really good! : D

[colmo]

I was just trying the F86 wings and could not get the leading edge to react to an action group. It launches and remains deployed, with no right-click option to toggle it. Linux x64 KSP.

Answered: It happens automagically.

Edited July 29, 2014 by colmo

[luizopiloto]

will it have Actiongroups to control helichopter rotor RPM?

[Snjo]

I was just trying the F86 wings and could not get the leading edge to react to an action group. It launches and remains deployed, with no right-click option to toggle it. Linux x64 KSP.

This is a classic case of "It's not a bug, it's a feature"

They used to be toggleable (and they still are if you alter the cfg)

Now they are automatically deployed if the speed is low, or the Angle of Attack is high? Why, you say?

Because that's how the real F-86 wing's leading edge works.

If you want it manual, alter Firespitter\Parts\Aero\FS_fighterJetWing\part.cfg like this:

MODULE
{
	name = FSwing

... bla bla bla ...

	autoDeployLeadingEdge = [B]false[/B]
}

[colmo]

Cheers Snjo, I evidently missed mention of that change. What does the Centre of Lift indicator in the SPH indicate, deployed or retracted? (I have a feeling the answer will be "it's more complicated than that...")

Edit: Definitely don't use then in a deltawing arrangement - lawn dart action!

Edited July 29, 2014 by colmo

[NathanKell]

Yep, most slats are aerodynamically actuated. Great to see in FS!

[Snjo]

Cheers Snjo, I evidently missed mention of that change. What does the Centre of Lift indicator in the SPH indicate, deployed or retracted? (I have a feeling the answer will be "it's more complicated than that...")

Edit: Definitely don't use then in a deltawing arrangement - lawn dart action!

The CoL indicator will indicate the retracted state.

Speaking of. Has anyone else noticed the CoL marker being totally messed up in 0.24?

Maybe I just need to ditch this buggy 64 bit version. It keeps crashing on me, the tweakables are erratic, and I think it ate all my pretzels.

Also, I guess it didn't help that this bugginess was observed while setting up this thing:

Edited July 29, 2014 by Snjo
banananana

[RuBisCO]

The propeller animations are not working for me in x64. I don't believe it is properly loading the .dll, how do I fix that?

Edited July 30, 2014 by RuBisCO

[Guest]

Does the 6.3.4 contain the wheel fix for the CSS? I just wanted to ask, because I'll need to get myself together and update CSS for 0.24.2.

[Snjo]

The propeller animations are not working for me in x64. I don't believe it is properly loading the .dll, how do I fix that?

I have been spinning propellers all day in x64 and x86, so I'm curious what doesn't work for you. Also make sure you didn't forget to install the plugin

Does the 6.3.4 contain the wheel fix for the CSS? I just wanted to ask, because I'll need to get myself together and update CSS for 0.24.2.

I don't know what fix you mean, but yes, 6.3.4 does contain all the latest features.

[RuBisCO]

I install the Firespitter.dll in the plugin folder both the one that comes with 634 and another one found on this forum (https://github.com/snjo/Firespitter/blob/master/For%20release/Firespitter/Plugins/Firespitter.dll?raw=true) they appear to be identical, the result is identical, these propellers are not animated as well as have no thrust reverse or RCS thusting:

Javascript is disabled. View full album

I've checked and other engines don't spin either.

[Avalon304]

The CoL indicator will indicate the retracted state.

Speaking of. Has anyone else noticed the CoL marker being totally messed up in 0.24?

Maybe I just need to ditch this buggy 64 bit version. It keeps crashing on me, the tweakables are erratic, and I think it ate all my pretzels.

Also, I guess it didn't help that this bugginess was observed while setting up this thing:

http://i.imgur.com/8eNKn9v.png

Snjo... was there alcohol involved in the making of that? Because... wow... I do think Ive seen everything.

[nli2work]

Finally got to work with this great plugin a little. is there something I can do to hide rotorDisc in the part thumbnail?

[RuBisCO]

I tried the older .dll from 23.5 and it sort of works, the animations work, and the tail rotors work but the engine now has no thrust even though I can unfold it and start it up.

[Snjo]

Finally got to work with this great plugin a little. is there something I can do to hide rotorDisc in the part thumbnail?

I've found ot how to hide this now, so I'll have to remember to do that for my existing models. The trick is to create a new tag in Unity called Icon_Hidden, and assign it to the object.

I tried the older .dll from 23.5 and it sort of works, the animations work, and the tail rotors work but the engine now has no thrust even though I can unfold it and start it up.

This still sounds like the game either doesn't find the dll, or maybe you have duplicates of it. There is no sign of any FS code running on those tweakable menus. Make sure you

, and if it still doesn't work, create a new copy of KSP with only stock parts and Firespitter installed, and see if that works. If it does, add other mods back in until it breaks.

[RuBisCO]

Well I searched for a duplicate .dll and there was not, so I'm guess I'm stuck trying clean to see what other mod is fing it up. I don't use steam for KSP so it is a lot easier making duplicates I got 11 KSP all the way back to .22, others with different mod sets. Anyways I tried it on a fresh installation with no other mods and a fresh copy of firespitter from the zip, and still the same problem!

- I ran it in 32 bit and it works fine, I run it in 64 bit and the same problem.

- I extracted a totally clean version straight from the ksp-win64-0-24-0.zip, no patcher updates, put in only the firespitter mod, SAME PROBLEM (no 32 bit to test though without the patcher)

Added what it looks like when it works and when it does not:

Javascript is disabled. View full album

Edited July 30, 2014 by RuBisCO

[FacialJack]

Hi all

I have an issue wiz 0.634 on x64, i try to land on water wiz appropriate parts, but they seems to have trouble wiz physics, they move as i fly, and explode when touching water, even at few m/s (less than 10m/s)

Is that normal, an issue? is it something i can do else waiting?