AlamoVampire Posted March 2 Share Posted March 2 (edited) 4 hours ago, The Aziz said: So, 20-something days left until the unknown? I think until the license holder or ip holder or both make a statement publicly its safe to believe in 26 days (including today) this forum will shut down. There is no reason until proven otherwise by aforementioned criteria to believe this forum will be functional by March 29-31, 2025. If we are going to be wrong let us be wrong expecting total shut down and getting more life. But make no mistake even IF the forum is allowed to exist post license it is still on a clock for shut down. How long can an unlicensed software item exist sans updates/maintenance before catastrophic systemic failure? 0826003022025 just noticed! New page! 083303022025 Edited March 2 by AlamoVampire Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisias Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 20 hours ago, AlamoVampire said: How long can an unlicensed software item exist sans updates/maintenance before catastrophic systemic failure? Well... I have an old rig running Windows XP, and it connects to the Internet, and nothing bad happens. But I'm a professional on this field, and blocked this machine IP from connecting the WAN on the router, and so all connections are via proxy. Having proper support from the Vendor is usually a better idea, but it's possible to "survive" for years without it if you have in house expertise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlamoVampire Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 3 hours ago, Lisias said: Having proper support from the Vendor is usually a better idea, but it's possible to "survive" for years without it if you have in house expertise. I do not know the level of expertise the forum will have access to when the license expires. And as far as I know we have not had word from either the license holder or the ip holder regarding the future of our beloved forum. Until such a time as the license holder explicitly comes here and posts evidence to the contrary, we are now 25 days away from shuttering. If im wrong thats how i want to be wrong. Unfortunately evidence currently suggests i am not. 092903032025 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MechBFP Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 48 minutes ago, AlamoVampire said: I do not know the level of expertise the forum will have access to when the license expires. And as far as I know we have not had word from either the license holder or the ip holder regarding the future of our beloved forum. Until such a time as the license holder explicitly comes here and posts evidence to the contrary, we are now 25 days away from shuttering. If im wrong thats how i want to be wrong. Unfortunately evidence currently suggests i am not. 092903032025 A lack of evidence does not count as evidence. That is a logical fallacy called “argument from ignorance”. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlamoVampire Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 (edited) 19 minutes ago, MechBFP said: A lack of evidence does not count as evidence. That is a logical fallacy called “argument from ignorance”. And youre strawmaning my statement. I clearly state that until explicitly proven otherwise by the license holder that it has been renewed that i expect shut down and that if im wrong thats HOW i want to be wrong. But you ignore my own caveat to strawman me into something i never said. I could EASILY say you make the same fallacious argument in having no evidence things will continue on uninterrupted. But i will not be so insulting as to say you are arguing from ignorance. I respect you more than that. I thought you respected me, but I guess not given such a vile accusation. Just as i have 0 proof it will shut down you have 0 proof it wont. I will say this the same as I have been saying: it will end on the 28th of March or it wont. We have no proof it will or wont but the safest bet is expect it will. Its much better to expect the end to come and be proven wrong than expect it will continue only to find it ended. That is my position and has been my position. 103703032025 104003032025 Edited March 3 by AlamoVampire Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MechBFP Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 (edited) No idea why you think I am arguing it will stay up. I literally didn’t make any argument at all lol. Doing so would also be a fallacy for the exact same reason, a lack of evidence. Also that is just the name of the fallacy, not a personal comment towards you. Also, I am not sure what you are concerned about anyway since we should still have 6 months to go according to you Edited March 3 by MechBFP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlamoVampire Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 @MechBFP 1. That thread was posted 5 months ago. Since then ive seen no indication that anything has changed. I had been incorrectly informed by a moderator of a mistaken timeline that has since been corrected publicly by said moderator. This returns us to the 6 month state. Thus, if you maths out September until March that is 6 months. We are in the final 25 days until proven otherwise. 2. When you point out a fallacy name you are intrinsically accusing the person of committing said fallacy. Thats just how it is. 3. There are only 2 stances in this situation: believe as i do that its ending OR believe it wont. Calling my point of view fallacious rather incorrectly indicates you believe it will not end. One of us is right. One of us isnt. Now its clear you really do not respect me. The facts are as follows until EXPLICITLY PROVEN OTHERWISE by 1. License Holder and/or 2. The IP Rights holder: 1. The license appears per the thread dated September 28, 2024 to be expiring on or about March 28, 2025. 6 months after said thread. 2. We do not know as of right now the state of that license. Why? The License Holder and/or IP holder has not publicly and explicitly stated the state of said license. These are the facts on that. The following facts are what I have maintained publicly: 1. Until it is explicitly stated per the above I am of the position that service will cease on or about March 28, 2025. I have stated publicly that if I am wrong this is how I wish to be so. I would and do prefer to expect service shut cessation and to see it continue rather than expect it to continue and see it cease. This is a safer stance. I have stated this clearly and consistently. 2. Even IF service continues sans license we are still on a clock. Only at that point we dont know a time frame. Without official software support provided by use of said license the forum will eventually suffer a critical failure. Given the recent periods of total service blackout on this forum as well as the bevy of 502 bad gateways it is reasonable to believe that after license failure if service stays up another blackout or bad gateway could shut us down. Now i kindly ask you @MechBFP that on this subject you leave me in peace. 131303032025 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MechBFP Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 The chance of the licensing actually expiring on the 28th itself is pretty unlikely unless someone actually can provide the expiry date from the license. Not sure if anyone can actually see that. Without that information then the current license could have been extended a month or two early, meaning it potentially won’t expire till April or May. Or we could have been told late about it being renewed and it could actually expire anytime now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
umbra humanus Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 It's either shutting down or it's not. There's nothing any of us can do about it, but prepare for the worst. No amount of online arguing about it's fate will change that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisias Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 8 hours ago, umbra humanus said: It's either shutting down or it's not. There's nothing any of us can do about it, but prepare for the worst. No amount of online arguing about it's fate will change that. Yes and no. If the decision is already made, so yeah - if they are going to shut it down, then shutdown this thing will be. If they decided to keep it alive, so alive it will linger. BUT... If they had not decided yet, the arguing is a two edged sword: it may tip the scale in a way or another, depending on how we argue! Enough people demonstrating care and wish to cooperate on keeping this alive, and they will probably consider keeping this alive as this is a good tool to keep the Franchise alive. On the other hand, we reveal ourselves a toxic, demanding and narcissistic group of people, they will probably kill this, as the potential for trouble and losses would be bigger than any gain this Forum could provide them. This Forum is a tool: it can be used to help them, or to screw them. "What is steel compared to the hand that wields it?" Thulsa Doom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ItchyBrother Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 What is the backup plan? I would sure hate to lose this valuable tool to the community. I have been playing KSP since Alpha days.... geez, has it been that long? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superfluous J Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 1 hour ago, ItchyBrother said: What is the backup plan? I would sure hate to lose this valuable tool to the community. I have been playing KSP since Alpha days.... geez, has it been that long? Don't worry the community's got it covered. https://github.com/net-lisias-ksp/KSP-Forum-Preservation-Project That's just one. There are threads on here for others but I can't be bothered to search for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ItchyBrother Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 7 hours ago, Superfluous J said: Don't worry the community's got it covered. https://github.com/net-lisias-ksp/KSP-Forum-Preservation-Project That's just one. There are threads on here for others but I can't be bothered to search for them. Thanks! That is good to know and hear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
umbra humanus Posted Saturday at 02:45 AM Share Posted Saturday at 02:45 AM Quote Don't worry the community's got it covered. https://github.com/net-lisias-ksp/KSP-Forum-Preservation-Project That's just one. There are threads on here for others but I can't be bothered to search for them. Lisias likes this Like True, but these preservation projects to my knowledge do not restore the functionality of the forum. They just provide a torrent that you can use to download all of the forum content. It's a start, but it still is not a replacement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisias Posted Saturday at 04:09 AM Share Posted Saturday at 04:09 AM 1 hour ago, umbra humanus said: True, but these preservation projects to my knowledge do not restore the functionality of the forum. They just provide a torrent that you can use to download all of the forum content. It's a start, but it still is not a replacement. Because a replacement is not feasible under the Copyright law. Check this post below for the rationale: TL;DR: the only shot we have to do it under the Law is by going Internet Archive style. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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