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[1.3] Kerbal Joint Reinforcement v3.3.3 7/24/17

ferram4

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Lisias

Lisias

Posted
Posted
  On 4/2/2019 at 7:49 PM, DStaal said:

I have yet to get Lisias' version to work for me.  However, the Meiru release has worked decent for me (I still have one station that's wobbly - but it's a big station)

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99% of the time, you have serious problems on your installment. KSPe is picky about the KSP health, and will not work if any DLL is missing or corrupted. Since KJR/L relies on KSPe to keep it alive, it borks too.

Check your KSP.log for ADDON BINDER errors.

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icecold951

icecold951

Posted
Posted
  On 4/2/2019 at 9:14 PM, Lisias said:

99% of the time, you have serious problems on your installment. KSPe is picky about the KSP health, and will not work if any DLL is missing or corrupted. Since KJR/L relies on KSPe to keep it alive, it borks too.

Check your KSP.log for ADDON BINDER errors.

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I'm trying to figure out what KSPe is, and if I have it. I have interstellar installed, if that is what it is.

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Lisias

Lisias

Posted
Posted
  On 4/2/2019 at 10:49 PM, icecold951 said:

I'm trying to figure out what KSPe is, and if I have it. I have interstellar installed, if that is what it is.

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If you have KJR/L correctly installed (read the INSTALL.md on the zip file), then you have KSPe installed. Its the 000_KSPe.dll thingy on the GameData/ folder.

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MikeO89

MikeO89

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Posted (edited)

 

  On 4/2/2019 at 7:49 PM, DStaal said:

I have yet to get Lisias' version to work for me.  However, the Meiru release has worked decent for me (I still have one station that's wobbly - but it's a big station)

https://github.com/linuxgurugamer/Kerbal-Joint-Reinforcement/releases/tag/3.3.3.2

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I'm still using original modified by wolderado and it's still working flawless. I'm sticking with it as long as it keeps working.

Edited by MikeO89
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Lisias

Lisias

Posted
Posted
  On 4/2/2019 at 11:18 PM, MikeO89 said:

I'm still using original modified by wolderado and it's still working flawless. I'm sticking with it as long as it keeps working.

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As long you don't need the extra bit of performance, neither are willing to use Infernal Robotics, this is probably the less effort way to get KJR in your rig.

 

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Zah

Zah

Posted
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@Lisias Shouldn't KJR (using your version, logs looked fine so far) disable this problem with warping a craft when coming out of time warp? This is just a testing sandbox build so no problem, I also have it with smaller craft, sometimes. I don't use autostruts on this, either. Weird.

j1G5Cer.jpg

Edited by Zah
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infinite_monkey

infinite_monkey

Posted
Posted
  On 4/6/2019 at 4:55 PM, Zah said:

@Lisias Shouldn't KJR (using your version, logs looked fine so far) disable this problem with warping a craft when coming out of time warp? This is just a testing sandbox build so no problem, I also have it with smaller craft, sometimes. I don't use autostruts on this, either. Weird.

j1G5Cer.jpg

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Is this wobbly or just messed up but stiff?

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Lisias

Lisias

Posted
Posted
  On 4/6/2019 at 4:55 PM, Zah said:

@Lisias Shouldn't KJR (using your version, logs looked fine so far) disable this problem with warping a craft when coming out of time warp? 
j1G5Cer.jpg

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Nope, the KJR can't exactly prevent this. KJR is a kind of "AutoStruts with Steroids" - it's essentially the same thing as the AutoStrut to Grand Parent, but with some serious extra juice.

You should have the same issues on docking/undocking.

What's happening is the joints being recalculated by some reason, spreading overshoots everywhere, and this is above KJR's grasp.

However, there're some things you can try to mitigate the problem:

  • Mangle with the Delta Physics on the Main Menu/Settings/General/"Max Physics Delta-Time per Frame"
    • Hopefully this will minimize the over-shoot effect of the simulation's deltaT your vessel is handling
    • Trial and error - if fail, put it back to the default position.
  • Edit PluginData/KerbalJointReinforcement/user.cfg , using values the would make the joints yet more stiffer.
    • Instructions here.
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Rudolf Meier

Rudolf Meier

Posted
Posted (edited)
  On 4/6/2019 at 5:06 PM, Zah said:

Messed up but stiff. Didn't happen with 100x timewarp, but with e.g. 3000x time warp. It's straight during time warp, but back to warped again at 1x

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What this means is, that you have a force on the joints.

During timewarp the forces are removed and the joints go back into their "zero-position". From that standpoint it could (in theory) be that KJR is the problem. Because in case the extra joints added are off by some margins, it's possible to see this effect.

But I don't see why time warping would cause joints to be at a wrong position after warping... the easiest way to find out would be to save your ship, disable KJR and load the ship again... if you see a difference, then we know it. Otherwise it's not KJR.

Edited by Rudolf Meier
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Lisias

Lisias

Posted
Posted
  On 4/6/2019 at 7:43 PM, Rudolf Meier said:

But I don't see why time warping would cause joints to be at a wrong position after warping... 

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Rounding errors and overshoot.

There're a lot conversions between floats and double (usually on load/save, but God knows if any more). The difference I tiny, but pile up. Then the physics engine kicks in, that tiny differences are tacked but due the delta T, there's an overshoot between a engine's heartbeat and another. Then it's corrected next heartbeat, but now we have another overshoot (usualy smaller, but yet...), that is then corrected in the next heartbeat... And you got it already. 

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Rudolf Meier

Rudolf Meier

Posted
Posted
  On 4/6/2019 at 8:59 PM, Lisias said:

Rounding errors and overshoot.

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Yes, but that's why (at least until 1.4) they had some sort of "shadow"-positions that never changed. This allowed them to get to a safe configuraiton after things like warping... that's why I wonder why it shouldn't work anymore. (I had a lot of problems with those positions when programming IR next... because there I have to modify both positions when moving... this one and the real one). So... for me it's not yet that clear what happens here... but I didn't investigate it. I'm only speculating right now :) 

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Zah

Zah

Posted
Posted (edited)
  On 4/6/2019 at 9:05 PM, Rudolf Meier said:

Yes, but that's why (at least until 1.4) they had some sort of "shadow"-positions that never changed. This allowed them to get to a safe configuraiton after things like warping... that's why I wonder why it shouldn't work anymore. (I had a lot of problems with those positions when programming IR next... because there I have to modify both positions when moving... this one and the real one). So... for me it's not yet that clear what happens here... but I didn't investigate it. I'm only speculating right now :) 

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Eek, okay. I may be able to test some, but this build is a bit load-heavy. I'm using just about every parts mod, so just loading two games to compare may take an hour.
I could post the 29MB logfile of that session though. :P

Edited by Zah
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Lisias

Lisias

Posted
Posted
  On 4/6/2019 at 9:05 PM, Rudolf Meier said:

Yes, but that's why (at least until 1.4) they had some sort of "shadow"-positions that never changed. 

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That shadow positions are defined as float or a double? :)

The Rounding could be happening anywhere.  A piece of code still working on floats on a stack of functions using double is enough. It can be even a third party Add'On.

but, of couse, i'm speculating too.

  On 4/6/2019 at 9:07 PM, Zah said:

I could post the 29MB logfile of that session though. :P

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If there's no exceptions, the log would be informative but not diagnosing. I think we would need a debug version, where the log would have some diagnosing information. But the log would be easily 10 times greater. :)

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Zah

Zah

Posted
Posted (edited)
  On 4/6/2019 at 9:10 PM, Lisias said:

That shadow positions are defined as float or a double? :)

The Rounding could be happening anywhere.  A piece of code still working on floats on a stack of functions using double is enough. It can be even a third party Add'On.

but, of couse, i'm speculating too.

If there's no exceptions, the log would be informative but not diagnosing. I think we would need a debug version, where the log would have some diagnosing information. But the log would be easily 10 times greater. :)

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There's some exceptions but nothing bad IMO.
What does this mean, though?
 

  Reveal hidden contents

That's just MM-based mods messing around with the order, right? So no bug?!
"No KJRDecouplerReinforecementModule found..." is weird though.

Edited by Zah
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Lisias

Lisias

Posted
Posted
  On 4/6/2019 at 9:19 PM, Zah said:

That's just MM-based mods messing around with the order, right? So no bug?!
"No KJRDecouplerReinforecementModule found..." is weird though.

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No evident bug. You know, bugs are insidious social beings - they like to hide on the mob. :)

I find this warning… interesting.  

[WRN 18:17:44.468] [Part]: PartModule KJRDecouplerReinforcementModule at CDT2503, index 26: index exceeds module count as defined in cfg.
Looking for KJRDecouplerReinforcementModule in other indices...
[WRN 18:17:44.469] ...no KJRDecouplerReinforcementModule module found on part definition. Skipping...

Do you have TweakScale installed? If yes, can you publish your KSP.log on some snippet server? Under certain circumstances, TweakScale is withdrawing itself from some parts to prevent disasters, and it does it by deleting itself from a data structure that can be the same used on this warning, and I want to cross check the CDT2503 part to see if I'm not involved on it somehow.

Oh, your ModuleManager's cache too, please. Just to double checking.

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Zah

Zah

Posted
Posted
  On 4/9/2019 at 4:27 AM, Lisias said:

No evident bug. You know, bugs are insidious social beings - they like to hide on the mob. :)

I find this warning… interesting.  

[WRN 18:17:44.468] [Part]: PartModule KJRDecouplerReinforcementModule at CDT2503, index 26: index exceeds module count as defined in cfg.
Looking for KJRDecouplerReinforcementModule in other indices...
[WRN 18:17:44.469] ...no KJRDecouplerReinforcementModule module found on part definition. Skipping...

Do you have TweakScale installed? If yes, can you publish your KSP.log on some snippet server? Under certain circumstances, TweakScale is withdrawing itself from some parts to prevent disasters, and it does it by deleting itself from a data structure that can be the same used on this warning, and I want to cross check the CDT2503 part to see if I'm not involved on it somehow.

Oh, your ModuleManager's cache too, please. Just to double checking.

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Yes, but not the most current version of Tweakscale, it's on my update list. There's definitely something weird going on in this install though, RCSBuildAid fails to register the toolbar button when going back to the SPH/VAB after flight. I've spent the last days writing MM patches so I have to check if the problem persists, else the cache is going to be different. I saved the log though, will post it later.

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Zah

Zah

Posted
Posted (edited)
  On 4/9/2019 at 4:27 AM, Lisias said:

No evident bug. You know, bugs are insidious social beings - they like to hide on the mob. :)

I find this warning… interesting.  

[WRN 18:17:44.468] [Part]: PartModule KJRDecouplerReinforcementModule at CDT2503, index 26: index exceeds module count as defined in cfg.
Looking for KJRDecouplerReinforcementModule in other indices...
[WRN 18:17:44.469] ...no KJRDecouplerReinforcementModule module found on part definition. Skipping...

Do you have TweakScale installed? If yes, can you publish your KSP.log on some snippet server? Under certain circumstances, TweakScale is withdrawing itself from some parts to prevent disasters, and it does it by deleting itself from a data structure that can be the same used on this warning, and I want to cross check the CDT2503 part to see if I'm not involved on it somehow.

Oh, your ModuleManager's cache too, please. Just to double checking.

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My KSP now keeps shooting itself, badly (I mean, it runs, but...).
I'm getting random exception spamming (it doesn't have to be Snacks as in this case, it can also be KER).
Log: https://mega.nz/#!h85wxKYR!ucza-loyTpsknQR6U7KsAUf0j6LZGlcjp-aEbHy9Ep0

I may have messed up a config file somewhere in there, but other than haven't really added anything new, so I don't understand why it got so bad all of a sudden.

When KER shoots itself it spams like this(happens in a different "save"):

  Reveal hidden contents

A few Addon Binder problems in the log, and some weird exceptions. I updated to the newest Kopernicus Backport, no change.

"ADDON BINDER: Cannot resolve assembly: TestFlightCore, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=null" is fascinating.

Edited by Zah
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Lisias

Lisias

Posted
Posted
  On 4/11/2019 at 2:15 PM, Zah said:

My KSP now keeps shooting itself, badly (I mean, it runs, but...).
I'm getting random exception spamming (it doesn't have to be Snacks as in this case, it can also be KER).
Log: https://mega.nz/#!h85wxKYR!ucza-loyTpsknQR6U7KsAUf0j6LZGlcjp-aEbHy9Ep0

I may have messed up a config file somewhere in there, but other than haven't really added anything new, so I don't understand why it got so bad all of a sudden.

A few Addon Binder problems in the log, and some weird exceptions. I updated to the newest Kopernicus Backport, no change.

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the ADDON BINDER is only a problem when the line starts with [ERR . When starts with [LOG is just informative.

However, two things caught my attention on your log:

  • A really big amount of empty configs. [ERR hh:mm:ss.nnnn] Error: Empty part config file
    • Search for "Empty part config file" on your log, and check the original zip file of the mod to see if it is, indeed, empty
    • otherwise, you could had some filesystem corruption on your rig!
  • A TypeLoadException on BDAnimationModules (see below)
    • Since you mentioned Kopernicus, it make some sense
    • Update or downgrade BD Animation Modules to see if anything changes
  Reveal hidden contents

I also noticed the your are using UbioWeldingLtd  (original one?). Be advised that Module Manager 4 introduced a change (perhaps by mistake) that make the Welding Tool to bork when it try to use its services to create new parts. I think I fixed it on my personal (and heavily experimental) fork of MM - at least, it appears to be working fine. I suggest you move MM back to the latest 3.x version, or take your chances :D with mine for while if you are in the mood to get yourself in yet deeper trouble. :P As long as I find the time to properly test and gather test results from other players, I will apply a (tiny!) pull request to the Maintainer with the fix (being the reason I offering you this incredible chance to shoot yourself on your feet. Both of them!).

I will send you a link in PVT if you are interested (that thing is experimental, not for broad consumer use!).

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Zah

Zah

Posted
Posted (edited)
  On 4/11/2019 at 2:51 PM, Lisias said:

 

  •  

I also noticed the your are using UbioWeldingLtd  (original one?). Be advised that Module Manager 4 introduced a change (perhaps by mistake) that make the Welding Tool to bork when it try to use its services to create new parts. I think I fixed it on my personal (and heavily experimental) fork of MM - at least, it appears to be working fine. I suggest you move MM back to the latest 3.x version, or take your chances :D with mine for while if you are in the mood to get yourself in yet deeper trouble. :P As long as I find the time to properly test and gather test results from other players, I will apply a (tiny!) pull request to the Maintainer with the fix (being the reason I offering you this incredible chance to shoot yourself on your feet. Both of them!).

I will send you a link in PVT if you are interested (that thing is experimental, not for broad consumer use!).

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Not actively, I planned on copying this install once I got it working to make a MM3 welding KSP while playing on the other.
Not sure if testing an experimental build on this behemoth installation is wise, but I'm not going to say "no".

  Quote

the ADDON BINDER is only a problem when the line starts with [ERR . When starts with [LOG is just informative.

However, two things caught my attention on your log:

  • A really big amount of empty configs. [ERR hh:mm:ss.nnnn] Error: Empty part config file
    • Search for "Empty part config file" on your log, and check the original zip file of the mod to see if it is, indeed, empty
    • otherwise, you could had some filesystem corruption on your rig!
  • A TypeLoadException on BDAnimationModules (see below)
    • Since you mentioned Kopernicus, it make some sense
    • Update or downgrade BD Animation Modules to see if anything changes
Expand  

Yeah, BD Animation Modules is where I'm at right now, too. The files are indeed empty/commented out. The drive is a new Samsung SSD, so no worries. I do have a billion part mods in this. I guess I could just remove those empty files, haha.

I removed some minor mods that threw exceptions (Janitor's Closet, [x]Science... but those were minor, really).

When KER shoot itself the KER 'window' looks like this https://i.imgur.com/zCJFoHa.jpg xD

Edit:
I updated BD Animation Modules (and a few other random things) and the spam is gone/KER works. Maaaybe I can now finally go back to what I wanted to test in the first place. Oh KSP.
Wait, no, I still need to figure out what borked up RCS Build Aid.

Edit 2:
Ah, glorious, at least that problem is still there /s.
  

[ERR 16:56:40.750] ToolbarControl: WARNING: RegisterMod, LoadedScene: MAINMENU, called too late for: KronalVesselViewer_NS, Kronal Vessel Viewer, button may not be registered properly

[ERR 16:56:40.751] ToolbarControl: WARNING: RegisterMod, LoadedScene: MAINMENU, called too late for: ABFW_NS, Advanced Fly-By-Wire, button may not be registered properly

[ERR 16:56:40.753] ToolbarControl: WARNING: RegisterMod, LoadedScene: MAINMENU, called too late for: Proximity_NS, Proximity, button may not be registered properly

[LOG 16:56:40.888] [MechJeb2] Loading Shaders Bundles
[LOG 16:56:40.890] Assembly : ModuleManager | Version : 4.0.2.0 found !
[LOG 16:56:40.890] Minimal version needed is : 2.8.0
[LOG 16:56:40.890] INT : 402/280
[LOG 16:56:40.890] Assembly : KIS | Version : 1.18.6971.42939 found !
[LOG 16:56:40.890] Minimal version needed is : 1.5.0
[LOG 16:56:40.890] INT : 7251/150
[ERR 16:56:40.890] ToolbarControl: WARNING: RegisterMod, LoadedScene: MAINMENU, called too late for: PartAngleDisplay_NS, Part Angle Display, button may not be registered properly

[ERR 16:56:40.891] ToolbarControl: WARNING: RegisterMod, LoadedScene: MAINMENU, called too late for: PartCommander_NS, Part Commander, button may not be registered properly

[ERR 16:56:40.999] ToolbarControl: WARNING: RegisterMod, LoadedScene: MAINMENU, called too late for: RCSBuildAid_NS, RCS Build Aid, button may not be registered properly


Edit3: And the timewarp-"warp" is also still present.
https://imgur.com/a/NRO1E2t

My list of things to fix is long.

Edited by Zah
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Lisias

Lisias

Posted
Posted
  On 4/11/2019 at 3:01 PM, Zah said:

Edit 2:
Ah, glorious, at least that problem is still there /s.
  

[ERR 16:56:40.750] ToolbarControl: WARNING: RegisterMod, LoadedScene: MAINMENU, called too late for: KronalVesselViewer_NS, Kronal Vessel Viewer, button may not be registered properly

 

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I think LGG already fixed it on the latest release of ToolbarControl. If you are using the latest, good chances Kronal is registering its buttons too late on the party. In a way or another, LGG is the guy to help you on it (long time since I gave a look on the code, don't remember anything about…)

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Zah

Zah

Posted
Posted (edited)
  On 4/11/2019 at 7:27 PM, Lisias said:

I think LGG already fixed it on the latest release of ToolbarControl. If you are using the latest, good chances Kronal is registering its buttons too late on the party. In a way or another, LGG is the guy to help you on it (long time since I gave a look on the code, don't remember anything about…)

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It's not only KVV, it's a bunch of mods with off/on problems.

But currently testing the warp bug, KJR/AS/no struts:
KJR - craft messed up after time warp,
normal autostruts to grandparent (no KJR installed) - no messed up craft after warp
no struts at all (with that nearly 500t craft xD) - no problem, either.

Hm... that would point to KJR being the issue, sort of?

Edited by Zah
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