[1.8+] Real Fuels

[NathanKell]

@K3achas update your KSP. 1.0.5 has been patched since the version you downloaded.

[mark7]

Some weird problems occurred. Engines didnt show up in the engine section, but in fueltank section. And some engines' GUI show up but empty, and I cant change anything to these engines in VAB (like thrust, gimbal range, ETC)

Trying to find a way to upload the log……

edit：http://pan.baidu.com/s/1jHz3onO here it is. Click “下载” to download……(I am stupid and just cant find a way to upload the file to a foreign website……I will change the link as soon as I figure out how to do that……Sorry for the inconvenience OTZ

edit2: https://www.dropbox.com/s/nzub85t59mj2pft/KSP.log?dl=0 There we go Orz

Edited February 24, 2016 by mark7

[NathanKell]

@mark7 If a part maker does not have the engine set to the correct category (there's now an Engines category, Propulsion is obsolete), it will show up in the wrong place. Ask the part maker to update their mod to 0.90+ categories. As to configs: did you install an engine config pack?

[mark7]

2 hours ago, NathanKell said:

@mark7 If a part maker does not have the engine set to the correct category (there's now an Engines category, Propulsion is obsolete), it will show up in the wrong place. Ask the part maker to update their mod to 0.90+ categories. As to configs: did you install an engine config pack?

yes，I have installed RF-stockalike. But even I deleted the patch and override the engine cfgs by myself,the problem still occurred

[Starwaster]

19 minutes ago, mark7 said:

yes，I have installed RF-stockalike. But even I deleted the patch and override the engine cfgs by myself,the problem still occurred

Then don't you think that maybe the problem is with the part maker as NathanKell said?

edit: what do you mean about overriding them yourself? What exactly are you doing? 

Edited February 24, 2016 by Starwaster

[mark7]

16 minutes ago, Starwaster said:

Then don't you think that maybe the problem is with the part maker as NathanKell said?

edit: what do you mean about overriding them yourself? What exactly are you doing? 

I copy the codes from the patches, paste them to the engine cfgs---not woring

Then I deleted all the codes related to RF, leave just the mix ratio (these engines are from cryoengines so they burn LH2/OX originally)------still not working

Then I deleted RF, this time it worked, but all my rocket are useless without RF, so⋯⋯

[blowfish]

19 minutes ago, mark7 said:

I copy the codes from the patches, paste them to the engine cfgs---not woring

Then I deleted all the codes related to RF, leave just the mix ratio (these engines are from cryoengines so they burn LH2/OX originally)------still not working

Then I deleted RF, this time it worked, but all my rocket are useless without RF, so⋯⋯

You shouldn't be moving any configs around when installing (unless you know what you're doing and have a specific reason).  Just install the appropriate directories to GameData.

[mark7]

1 hour ago, blowfish said:

You shouldn't be moving any configs around when installing (unless you know what you're doing and have a specific reason).  Just install the appropriate directories to GameData.

Well，I am no stranger to MM cfgs. What I have done is just manually add the codes from the patch to the cfgs.

Also, if there isnt a problem, I wont mess up with the code to fix it.

[Starwaster]

1 hour ago, mark7 said:

Well，I am no stranger to MM cfgs. What I have done is just manually add the codes from the patch to the cfgs.

Also, if there isnt a problem, I wont mess up with the code to fix it.

Your RealFuels installation is behind and needs updating.

Using the very latest RealFuels version I am unable to reproduce your problem. I downloaded the CryoEngines parts pack and they work fine. No issues with the GUI. I am able to change engine settings such as fuel configurations and change gimbal settings.

Clearly you do not have the most recent RealFuels or you do not have it properly installed.

You have also been hacking on executables and plugins so this is the extent of how far I am willing to investigate this issue and will not be assisting further.

Good luck!

[mark7]

28 minutes ago, Starwaster said:

Your RealFuels installation is behind and needs updating.

Using the very latest RealFuels version I am unable to reproduce your problem. I downloaded the CryoEngines parts pack and they work fine. No issues with the GUI. I am able to change engine settings such as fuel configurations and change gimbal settings.

Clearly you do not have the most recent RealFuels or you do not have it properly installed.

You have also been hacking on executables and plugins so this is the extent of how far I am willing to investigate this issue and will not be assisting further.

Good luck!

Fine,thank u anyway⋯⋯

For now I suppose it is some sort of an incompatible problem. 

[blowfish]

1 hour ago, mark7 said:

Fine,thank u anyway⋯⋯

For now I suppose it is some sort of an incompatible problem. 

I'd recommend at least trying an unmodified install before giving up. If you want to make modifications, a clean install gives you a place to start with to figure out what's breaking. 

[mark7]

Shame to talk about it, but to find the possible"incompatible problem", I copy the KSP to another disk on my computer⋯⋯

And the bugs all disappeard⋯⋯I dont even change a single code or plugin⋯⋯

What the⋯⋯

Edited February 25, 2016 by mark7

[KvaNTy]

Guys, can you help me figure this out? After installing RF, active engines neither produces reasonable amounts of heat nor conduct it to connected parts. And fuel tanks temp stuck at 300K(Az50+NTO).
Both screenshots above were taken at just a moment before fuel tanks became empty. In RF's case it took twice as much time.

Common sense tell me that it's not how it supposed to be. I've already checked and rechecked every part, tool, mod and source line related to temperature except that haven't looked at SolverEngine's source code yet.
So how it should work and where a problem can possibly be?

[Starwaster]

3 hours ago, KvaNTy said:

 

Guys, can you help me figure this out? After installing RF, active engines neither produces reasonable amounts of heat nor conduct it to connected parts. And fuel tanks temp stuck at 300K(Az50+NTO).
Both screenshots above were taken at just a moment before fuel tanks became empty. In RF's case it took twice as much time.

Common sense tell me that it's not how it supposed to be. I've already checked and rechecked every part, tool, mod and source line related to temperature except that haven't looked at SolverEngine's source code yet.
So how it should work and where a problem can possibly be?

Why would common sense tell you that the way stock engines and fuel tanks deal with heat is in a realistic manner? 

Realistically speaking, most of the heat produced by a rocket engine exits out of the chamber and then the nozzle along with the propellants. Yes, the engine itself should heat up but the degree to which that happens in stock is unrealistic and unreasonable.

IRL, rocket engines also have heat shields attached to protect the fuel tanks. Having heat dumped into your tanks is not a good thing, it is a bad thing, especially if those tanks have cryogenic fuels that you want to stay cold, like a 7-11 Slurpee.

Fuel tanks also have insulation on them. (some have more than I think they should have given what some of those tanks were supposed to represent historically, but that's another discussion entirely)

Edited February 26, 2016 by Starwaster

[KvaNTy]

@Starwaster, so what, everything works as intended?
The thing is: On one hand over half of this thread people were discussing how to get rid of engine's heat and not to let it boiloff fuel in tanks. Even your Heat Pumps for RF is about the same thing.
On other hand me trying to find the way to overheat at least something, except of placing it in front of engine nozzle. Tank's surface can't be that much insulated and engine running at full throttle for several minutes should warm a bit.
So my first obvious thought was "Something is not right".

Edited February 26, 2016 by KvaNTy

[Svm420]

9 minutes ago, KvaNTy said:

@Starwaster, so what, everything works as intended?
The thing is: On one hand over half of this thread people were discussing how to get rid of engine's heat and not to let it boiloff fuel in tanks. Even your Heat Pumps for RF is about the same thing.

Has little to do with engine heat and more to do with environmental heat. And due to the fact that either way insulation isn't perfect so it was more about keep any heat out not engine in particular not sure where you got that idea.

[KvaNTy]

21 minutes ago, Svm420 said:

Has little to do with engine heat and more to do with environmental heat. And due to the fact that either way insulation isn't perfect so it was more about keep any heat out not engine in particular not sure where you got that idea.

Ah, that's the thing. I've overlooked this fact somehow.
I just want to hear that I'm not alone and that every RealFuels user can keep his LV-T45 running forever without worrying about overheating.

[Svm420]

Just now, KvaNTy said:

Ah, that's the thing. I've overlooked this fact somehow.
I just want to hear that I'm not alone and that every RealFuels user can keep his LV-T45 running forever without worrying about overheating.

Yep just like IRL

[Starwaster]

2 minutes ago, Svm420 said:

Yep just like IRL

Well, IRL it would break down eventually. Forever is an awful long time

4 minutes ago, KvaNTy said:

Ah, that's the thing. I've overlooked this fact somehow.
I just want to hear that I'm not alone and that every RealFuels user can keep his LV-T45 running forever without worrying about overheating.

To elaborate a little, You know how in stock you can't run a nuclear engine without radiators?

IRL that wouldn't be so much an issue. You might want radiators to cool it AFTER the burn. Or throttle it back slooowly. 

[KvaNTy]

15 hours ago, Starwaster said:

To elaborate a little, You know how in stock you can't run a nuclear engine without radiators?

IRL that wouldn't be so much an issue. You might want radiators to cool it AFTER the burn. Or throttle it back slooowly. 

Yeah, in lot of videos. That's why expected something like that in my install. Now I see.
I've seen in a lot of literature that getting away heat, especially constant, caused by fusion or decay, could become engineering nightmare when you have no conducting environment.

[Joco223]

Is there a Methane as a resource? I would like to make a patch so my Methane Rocketry mod works with Real Fuels

[Autochton]

23 minutes ago, Joco223 said:

Is there a Methane as a resource? I would like to make a patch so my Methane Rocketry mod works with Real Fuels

Liquid methane is in there, I know. As for gaseous, I don't think so, but I could be wrong. It might be added with a life support mod (as a product of the Sabatier reaction).

[FallenPhoenixRA]

Hey how do I get rid of Ignitions in this mod? I like the idea of real fuels but I am doing an RSS game. I have to use stock until I can figure out what I can do to get rid of the ignitions. Thanks! 

[Starwaster]

1 hour ago, Joco223 said:

Is there a Methane as a resource? I would like to make a patch so my Methane Rocketry mod works with Real Fuels

It's part of the Community Resource Pack and it's named LqdMethane. That's what Real Fuels uses. Try taking a look at the Stockalike Engines pack linked below:

Generally, you'll configure your engine as usual (preferably with ModuleEngineRF) but then you'll also put a ModuleEngineConfigs in the part that will list all possible engine configurations where you can Isp as a modifier to the base Isp. (if the base were a kerosene burning engine then methane would have a modifier of about 1.03)

 

 

[NathanKell]

v10.8.4

• Update propellant status info line during warp as well.
• Change background color of engine stack icon based on propellant stability (like parachutes).
• Add the tech required to unlock a config to the info tooltip for that config (for unavailable configs).