MOARdV Posted October 16, 2016 Author Share Posted October 16, 2016 7 hours ago, Ruedii said: I was wondering, how much work would it take to transition over RPM to the new text and vector-graphics rendering engine shipped in 1.2? Could this be done without breaking backwards compatibility with old mods? Could I get some feedback on this idea from people more familiar with RPM's inner workings before I file a feature request over at GitHub? The JSISwitchableVariableLabel and JSIVariableLabel that are used for text on the older non-MFD props were converted because the module they used in KSP now uses TextMeshPro (the new text rendering engine). Everything else will be drastically more challenging: to use a font in TextMeshPro, you have to import it to TMP, which means owning a license for their software. I don't own a license, and I can't justify spending close to USD$95 on one, since Unity and TMP aren't remotely related to my professional development. The second problem is, even if I had the fonts imported, I don't know how readily I could use them, since I use custom shaders for certain applications of the text - I don't know if the shaders could be used as drop-in replacements, or if I'd have to rewrite them entirely to work with TMP. Right now, my KSP time is spent on other priorities, so researching the second question won't happen any time soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fwiffo Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 On 10/16/2016 at 6:48 AM, MOARdV said: I don't own a license, and I can't justify spending close to USD$95 on one @MOARdV and @Ruedii if the time comes when you are ready to move forward with research on it, let me know if I can help with a donation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruedii Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 On 10/16/2016 at 9:48 AM, MOARdV said: The JSISwitchableVariableLabel and JSIVariableLabel that are used for text on the older non-MFD props were converted because the module they used in KSP now uses TextMeshPro (the new text rendering engine). Everything else will be drastically more challenging: to use a font in TextMeshPro, you have to import it to TMP, which means owning a license for their software. I don't own a license, and I can't justify spending close to USD$95 on one, since Unity and TMP aren't remotely related to my professional development. The second problem is, even if I had the fonts imported, I don't know how readily I could use them, since I use custom shaders for certain applications of the text - I don't know if the shaders could be used as drop-in replacements, or if I'd have to rewrite them entirely to work with TMP. Right now, my KSP time is spent on other priorities, so researching the second question won't happen any time soon. Thanks for the answer. Second question, is switching to Unity's HTML5 canvas utility (the second option for nice text canvasing) or the standard mono one also out of the question? I'm not sure what subsets of Mono Unity ships, so I don't know if it has the Cairo and GTK# classes. Both of these are excellent choices if available and the two are designed to integrate. If not, Unity updated their HTML renderer to full HTML5/CSS3+ support and substantial DynamicSVG support. This rendering pipeline (shared with Unity2D) can output to a texture or overlay and it supports most web-font types. For scripting it integrates fully with Unity's mono substructure as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOARdV Posted October 19, 2016 Author Share Posted October 19, 2016 9 hours ago, Ruedii said: Second question, is switching to Unity's HTML5 canvas utility (the second option for nice text canvasing) or the standard mono one also out of the question? I don't know Unity, so I can't say. Text rendered by RPM outside of the previously mentioned classes all use an enhanced TextMesh class that I rolled to provide some features the Unity TextMesh didn't support, and any replacement for that would need to be close to a drop-in for all applications - render-to-texture for the MFD and other screens as well as rendering in scene with custom shaders for labels on props. In either case, I am not developing new features for RPM at the moment, so any such R&D won't be any time soon. For what it's worth, the default font used in RPM's sample MFDs is low fidelity - it looks like it was upsampled using a point filter. For comparison, look at the fonts used for the ALCOR lander - they're rendered at the same resolution, but they don't have the same blockiness. So, if the issue is the blocky nature of the MFD text, that can be changed by replacing the font texture JSI/RasterPropMonitor/Library/Fonts/baseFont.dds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mystique Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 (edited) Any chance of 0.28 being available via CKAN? Edit: sorry, missed CKAN disclaimer in OP. Edited October 21, 2016 by Mystique Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brigadier Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 On 2016-10-19 at 2:08 PM, Mystique said: Any chance of 0.28 being available via CKAN? Read back up this thread just a few posts and read the OP FAQs, the answer is already there - CKAN is not support by the mod author. Ask this question in the CKAN thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linuxgurugamer Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 On 10/16/2016 at 2:17 AM, Ruedii said: I was wondering, how much work would it take to transition over RPM to the new text and vector-graphics rendering engine shipped in 1.2? Could this be done without breaking backwards compatibility with old mods? Could I get some feedback on this idea from people more familiar with RPM's inner workings before I file a feature request over at GitHub? Don't bother. RPM is in a maintenance mode while @MOARdV is working on a new mod to eventually replace it. Unless there is an overriding reason, he has stated that he is not going to add any new features to this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOARdV Posted October 21, 2016 Author Share Posted October 21, 2016 RPM beta 2 is out. The only change is re-exporting texts used in certain props - particularly, the updated ASET props that alexustas is testing at the moment. If you're not using those, you don't need to update yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhedd Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 (edited) EDIT: I was having trouble getting version b1 to work, but b2 works fine, so nevermind. Edited October 25, 2016 by Rhedd Problem solved Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss8913 Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 OK I usually don't have problems getting things from github but I am not finding the download .zip file that the README.md references, for 0.28b2 - can anyone tell me where it is and how/why it's not in the normal place that I [seem to be] used to? Thanks in advance, sorry for the dumb question... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOARdV Posted October 25, 2016 Author Share Posted October 25, 2016 1 hour ago, ss8913 said: OK I usually don't have problems getting things from github but I am not finding the download .zip file that the README.md references, for 0.28b2 - can anyone tell me where it is and how/why it's not in the normal place that I [seem to be] used to? Thanks in advance, sorry for the dumb question... RPM releases are always on GitHub. Beta 2 should be clearly visible as the first entry on that page. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss8913 Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 4 hours ago, MOARdV said: RPM releases are always on GitHub. Beta 2 should be clearly visible as the first entry on that page. thanks, I just.. missed it somehow before. Got it now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nukeboyt Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 Does anyone know the proper way to un-dock using RPM in IVA and STAY in IVA (not switch to external view)? I know it's possible because I've done it on occasion. But I cannot get it to happen regularly. I'm planning an Apollo style mission and want to stay in IVA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOARdV Posted October 25, 2016 Author Share Posted October 25, 2016 28 minutes ago, nukeboyt said: Does anyone know the proper way to un-dock using RPM in IVA and STAY in IVA (not switch to external view)? I know it's possible because I've done it on occasion. But I cannot get it to happen regularly. I'm planning an Apollo style mission and want to stay in IVA I've spent a lot of time dealing with what happens on an undock, thanks to various bugs in RPM. I believe the issue is the way KSP handles undocking. When two vessels are docked, they are treated as one single vessel. What happens when you undock is that KSP creates a new vessel. The 'current' vessel (the vessel you were flying before undocking) remains, but all of the undocked parts are removed from that vessel and placed in a new vessel that's created on the spot. Whether you remain in IVA depends on whether the IVA you are in stays on the 'current' vessel, or if the IVA is part of the 'new' vessel. If it's the 'current' vessel, you remain in IVA. If it's the 'new' vessel, you're kicked out. I'm pretty sure that's how it works, but there may be some additional factors that I don't know about. So, if KSP decides the CSM is the 'current' vessel, you can stay in IVA only if you remain in the CSM. If you ride the LEM all the way, you've got to find a way to make the LEM the primary component on docking. I don't know how KSP decides which vessel remains, so I don't have any recommendations there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tybot Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 I don't know if I've fully tested this, but I believe if you have a part set via 'Control from here', the vessel that contains that part is the one that persists. Try setting control on the cockpit of the vessel you want to keep before undocking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nukeboyt Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 12 minutes ago, MOARdV said: I've spent a lot of time dealing with what happens on an undock, thanks to various bugs in RPM. I believe the issue is the way KSP handles undocking. When two vessels are docked, they are treated as one single vessel. What happens when you undock is that KSP creates a new vessel. The 'current' vessel (the vessel you were flying before undocking) remains, but all of the undocked parts are removed from that vessel and placed in a new vessel that's created on the spot. Whether you remain in IVA depends on whether the IVA you are in stays on the 'current' vessel, or if the IVA is part of the 'new' vessel. If it's the 'current' vessel, you remain in IVA. If it's the 'new' vessel, you're kicked out. I'm pretty sure that's how it works, but there may be some additional factors that I don't know about. So, if KSP decides the CSM is the 'current' vessel, you can stay in IVA only if you remain in the CSM. If you ride the LEM all the way, you've got to find a way to make the LEM the primary component on docking. I don't know how KSP decides which vessel remains, so I don't have any recommendations there. Very helpful! Thanks. It'd also be cool to be able to switch from one command pod to another without leaving IVA, but I know that's not possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nukeboyt Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 Noticing some sort of weird artifacting when using a docking camera. The in the second between the two pictures, the mouse was moved ever so slightly and the "artifact" disappeared. Also, it changed in size as the mouse was moved around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOARdV Posted October 26, 2016 Author Share Posted October 26, 2016 2 hours ago, nukeboyt said: It'd also be cool to be able to switch from one command pod to another without leaving IVA, but I know that's not possible. the 'V' key changes seats while in IVA. You can switch from one pod to another in the same ship that way. Once you separate ships, that doesn't work, of course. I don't expect that it'd be possible to switch to another vessel while still in IVA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nukeboyt Posted October 26, 2016 Share Posted October 26, 2016 I wasn't clear. I meant I wish you could transfer a Kerbal from one seat (like in the CSM) to an empty seat (like in the LEM) without leaving IVA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOARdV Posted October 26, 2016 Author Share Posted October 26, 2016 59 minutes ago, nukeboyt said: I wasn't clear. I meant I wish you could transfer a Kerbal from one seat (like in the CSM) to an empty seat (like in the LEM) without leaving IVA Ah. That might be possible, but it's not something I'll be putting in RPM any time soon, since RPM is currently in maintenance mode. I can look into it in the follow-on mod, although that is still a long ways from being ready. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icedown Posted October 26, 2016 Share Posted October 26, 2016 2 hours ago, nukeboyt said: I wasn't clear. I meant I wish you could transfer a Kerbal from one seat (like in the CSM) to an empty seat (like in the LEM) without leaving IVA You might try ship manifest if it is updated. It can do transfers but I'm not sure about while in iva. It might work if it's not the active kerbal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gobolinno Posted October 26, 2016 Share Posted October 26, 2016 [Stupid question of the day I guess] Is there any MOD or option where we can "make parts to function" from IVA using RPM?. (Aka: Collecting and transmitting science). =) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icedown Posted October 26, 2016 Share Posted October 26, 2016 27 minutes ago, gobolinno said: [Stupid question of the day I guess] Is there any MOD or option where we can "make parts to function" from IVA using RPM?. (Aka: Collecting and transmitting science). =) You can do this through action groups or using vessel viewer. The parts list in vessel viewer is a pain to walk through with a big ship though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tybot Posted October 26, 2016 Share Posted October 26, 2016 29 minutes ago, gobolinno said: [Stupid question of the day I guess] Is there any MOD or option where we can "make parts to function" from IVA using RPM?. (Aka: Collecting and transmitting science). =) There is Vessel Viewer which also integrates into RPM but it has yet to update to 1.2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstah Posted October 26, 2016 Share Posted October 26, 2016 55 minutes ago, gobolinno said: [Stupid question of the day I guess] Is there any MOD or option where we can "make parts to function" from IVA using RPM?. (Aka: Collecting and transmitting science). =) 25 minutes ago, Tybot said: There is Vessel Viewer which also integrates into RPM but it has yet to update to 1.2. I miss VesselView, it added a lot of immersion and utility to RPM. But, while it hasn't been updated, this one has: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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