Chinese Space Program (CNSA) & Ch. commercial launch and discussion

[steve9728]

42 minutes ago, Codraroll said:

North Korean slogan.

Well you know, DPRK is our ‘Blood Alliance’ so it’s nothing weird that they seems like us

I think one of the reasons why put so many words on there would be: We can’t put commercial advertisements on there because we got laws to ban it. And is too weird that leave these place blank. Ask someone to draw something on there would be too expansive. So, slogan, put the slogan on there!

Actually, this kind of thing can be worst: once there have a interview about the women soldier in SWAT. There have a slogan backed to her said: Training Counter Terrorist Elite (打造反恐精兵). The character of ‘打’ was not in the camera, and the ‘恐’ was covered by this soldier. And what we saw the slogan in the interview was ‘Rebellious Elite (造反精兵)’

Spoiler

“I used to have a nice job but…”

Edited June 23, 2022 by steve9728

[JoeSchmuckatelli]

7 hours ago, Codraroll said:

If you can say it in a single breath, it's not a proper North Korean slogan.

LOL!

[SunlitZelkova]

21 hours ago, Codraroll said:

Heh, that's one of the cultural things that are different to understand on the other side of the world: the fixation with what we perceive as overly long and detailed slogans. A Western company might put "Seriousness, reliability, safety" as core values somewhere in a document of project values, but rarely more than three individual points, and it'd be seen as overly cheesy to put it on a banner.  Writing your goals and aspirations in huge letters on the side of a wall would be quite unthinkable. 

At least it's even worse in North Korea. "We must work with supreme diligence to execute the plan of the 49th workers' party congress and produce more potatoes to feed the motherland!" or stuff like that seems to decorate every wall over there. If you can say it in a single breath, it's not a proper North Korean slogan.

I don’t think this has anything to do with culture. It’s political. *cue mods gasping*

In Japan our political slogans are just as straight and to the point as Western ones. Even the Japanese Communist Party’s are rather simple. This is despite having certain cultural aspects similar to our communist neighbors.

If you look at a picture of any Stalin-era Soviet parades on the Red Square, you will see a very long placard, sometimes consisting of a single slogan stretching all the way across the State Department Store (the other side of the procession across from Lenin’s Mausoleum). China and North Korea adopted this one way or another at some point.

Note that in the Republic of China- both prior to and since 1949- political slogans were/are fairly similar to whatever was common at the time in the West.

———

Getting back to space related stuff…

Here is a neat video showcasing China’s first atomic bomb detonation, first hydrogen bomb detonation, first MRBM (including a nuclear test), and finally, China’s first satellite, Dong Fang Hong (The East is Red)* 1 (the space part, yay!). It is set to… music, not too bad but different from as advertised.

Disco apparently has a different meaning in China. The PLARF once released a promo video supposedly featuring disco music, and an OSINT dude remarked it was definitely not disco as we know it in the Western bloc.

*Before anyone makes a comment about long winded names… I personally don’t think that’s the case. It only seems that way because “translations” are at times rather garbagy and while they do capture the detailed meaning, there is a simplicity that is lost somewhere too. In Japanese (and presumably Chinese) this is not what would be considered a “sentence” in a Western language, but is more of a phrase-like word with meaning, like how in English one can call someone an “explorer” instead of “a man/woman who travels to new places in search of discoveries”. It’s just that English is not as flexible as Asian languages at times so 东方红/東方紅 jp btw not traditional cn gets translated as a literal sentence instead of the far more simple phrase it actually is, because there is just no equivalent in English.

Similar examples can be found in Japanese late WWII aircraft names. The C6N 彩雲 (Saiun) is a “phrase-like word with meaning”, but in English is the somewhat long winded (for an aircraft) C6N Iridescent Cloud. I imagine there are other Chinese examples too.

[steve9728]

3 hours ago, SunlitZelkova said:

I don’t think this has anything to do with culture. It’s political. *cue mods gasping*

Try not to break the rule: I think it have both of them. For example, in the classroom of high and senior high schools. You can see many slogen about must study harder kind of things. Is that political? It can't reach that. But in the launch center or somewhere the troop's trainning site, can we saying that there is no political element at all in this? The answer also would be 'no' either.

Much of this is a cultural and political 'inertia': my master's master did it, so when it's my master's and my turn, then we'll do it too.

3 hours ago, SunlitZelkova said:

I imagine there are other Chinese examples too.

In the age of the telegraph, Chinese could be compressed to the maximum extent possible and still give a full description of what was happening. Let's take an example that doesn't sound good: send a telegram to my brother about 'Dad has died, come home quickly for the funeral'. A Chinese telegram could be: 父亡速归 (translate directly: father died, come home quickly). In the telegraphic era, each Chinese character was referred to using a 4-digit number. This undoubtedly saved a great deal of time in transmitting information and, because every word of the telegraph was not cheap, a certain amount of cost was saved at the same time.

Spoiler

the number of this telegram can be:

父	3637
亡	0072
速	6643
归	2981

Almost every Chinese character can have a story, and because a single character can contains so much information that some definite article is needed to indicate what the character is describing. But this kind of thing does not only occur in Chinese-English or Japanese-English translations, it often occurs in translations from English to Chinese as well. For example, I'm quite getting used of English's "which is... who is..."that thing. And there's no similar way to say that in Chinese. So often I need a little time to warm up my 'Chinese module' when I'm chatting to my friends back home after I've finished writing my school essay report or something like that.

Edited June 24, 2022 by steve9728

[Beccab]

Uhhhh

[steve9728]

15 minutes ago, Beccab said:

Uhhhh

I have not done any research on this company. Anyway, from a personal point of view, whenever I see any of new domestic private aerospace company, my reflex is "What's another clever excuse to get the big bosses to inject money?"

Alright, this one isn't someone making big rocket or something but the little satellites. I find them offical webside and I believe they are focusing on the high resolution satellites constellations. The satellites seem to be civilian gadgets for particularly peaceful purposes. Perhaps this isn't a quite good excuse to get the money and they can't afford a good desginer for their logo hahaha

Spoiler

The typical application scenarios they claim for their satellites are:

• Marine Target Detection

  Using current advanced marine target interpretation algorithms or technologies, target monitoring is carried out for the Yangtze estuary and coastal marine vessel targets and their possible illegal oil discharges or oil spills at sea, providing information support for marine monitoring supervision and forensics.

• Marine Oil Spill Monitoring

  Using a combination of visible and infrared wavelengths to enhance oil film information, we can quickly respond to oil spill incidents to locate the oil film zone, assess the oil spill area and ship burning smoke area, etc., providing efficient technical support for an emergency response such as maritime centres.

• Unauthorised building monitoring along metro lines

  Provides monitoring services for changes in the environment around the metro transport routes, detecting changes in significant buildings along with the metro, identifying new buildings, demolished buildings and large construction projects, unauthorised rubbish deposition, etc.

• Land Use Classification

  Land use classification is extracted for the Yangtze River Delta Integration Demonstration Area, including types of arable land, forest land, rural residential land, urban residential land, rivers, lakes, public construction land, commercial land, and mudflats, grassland, railways, rail transit, and unused land.

• Smart Agriculture

  The integrated use of satellite remote sensing 3S technology and cloud computing technology to achieve the "eye in the sky" inspection of crop types and area changes within the plot, can provide objective, high-quality spatial data cloud services for agricultural management departments, agricultural research institutes, agrarian insurance companies and other units.

• Monitoring of crop planting surface distribution

  Based on HDSAT data, the remote sensing dynamic monitoring algorithm is built to monitor the distribution of planting surfaces within crop plots and regularly update the information of typical crop plots, which is used to provide important references for business decisions such as contract signing, insurance and loans for farmers.

• Water Environment Monitoring

  Using high-resolution remote sensing image processing technology, the quantitative inversion model algorithm of pollutants in water bodies is established to achieve the monitoring of suspended matter content, water transparency, chlorophyll-a, dissolved organic matter and other indicators as well as monitoring of water quality disasters such as cyanobacterial blooms.

• Power station wire tower monitoring

  The use of stereo satellite image data covering the region to survey power projects in remote areas with complex terrain, inconvenient traffic and lack of information, provides a new way of line selection, optimal design and section collection for power transmission lines.

 

see, how peacefully they are

Edited June 24, 2022 by steve9728

[steve9728]

After all the plagiarism, here's something that's essentially technically original: the Beijing Institute of Spacecraft System Engineering has applied for a new patent called "Airship protection cover capable of being repeatedly unfolded and folded". I think it may be use on the new manned spacecraft in future.

This one got 'offically machine translation' (sounds weird). So I think it's easily for everyone to find the details about it.

 

Edited June 24, 2022 by steve9728

[TheFlyingKerman]

8 hours ago, Beccab said:

Uhhhh

In China maps are state secret, so mapping is illegal for any private individual/organization, and by extension building and launching any satellite capable of observing the Earth. Similar for providing telecommunication. There is simply no market space for a real private space company.

The China Aerospace Science and Technology Corporation is really a PLA branch reorganized as a company (I think in the early 90's).

[steve9728]

1 hour ago, TheFlyingKerman said:

In China maps are state secret, so mapping is illegal for any private individual/organization, and by extension building and launching any satellite capable of observing the Earth. Similar for providing telecommunication. There is simply no market space for a real private space company.

It's not exactly illegal, only if you don't declare to government departments to be regulated. After all, Chinese people also drive and have to use navigation apps. You may find "Eh why, why doesn't the road network on the satellite image of the Chinese map match up with the road network in the picture?" That's because there is a law that states that the latitude and longitude coordinates used for satellite images are Mars coordinates.

Here it is the one of the major navigation app's provider: AutoNavi (高德) Map's satelite map demo. People can buy the service for such as the map for the agricultural protection drones, truck routing for freight companies and so on. 

Why there's no 'real private space company'. Firstly, objectively speaking, there are still gaps in China's space technology. Secondly, private spaceflight may not even be able to make a solid rocket if it does not receive technical and policy support from the state or the local government. Finally, perhaps it's a cultural difference, but in China anyway, to do something similar without government regulation people will think you are doing something nefarious and unscrupulous. Come on, if one day there have several cars that you'll know it's a Chinese mapping company's by a quick glance driving around in America communities nearly everywhere, and who knows how many their satellites focusing the America communities. Then they claim that they are mapping America without any kind of US gov's supervision. What you think?

Edited June 25, 2022 by steve9728

[Codraroll]

16 hours ago, steve9728 said:

Come on, if one day there have several cars that you'll know it's a Chinese mapping company's by a quick glance driving around in America communities nearly everywhere, and who knows how many their satellites focusing the America communities. Then they claim that they are mapping America without any kind of US gov's supervision. What you think?

Eh, the Russians have been doing the same for decades. The Germans did too. The British before them. Mapping other countries is kind of a thing.

On 6/24/2022 at 8:31 PM, Beccab said:

Uhhhh

I wonder whether the explanation was that they didn't know any better, or that they didn't care. Either way, there's absolutely no way in which this makes "SAST" look any better in the eye of the competent beholder. 

[steve9728]

Looks like the Shenzhou-14 crew has cleaned and tidied up the room now:

00:16: they are unboxing a new grapple fixture for the robotic arm!

 

In terms of the schedule, the Tianzhou-3 cargo ship probably will leave the station in couple of weeks. And leaves the forward docking port for the Wentian module.

Edited June 26, 2022 by steve9728

[steve9728]

CZ-4C Y46 rocket successfully launched the Gaofen (High Resolution)-12 03 satellite into orbit.

 

The chief designer of the Tianwen-1 orbiter and Zhurong Mars rover, Sun Zezhou said that will be planned a test mission for the Tianwen-1 orbiter: atmopheric braking. It will make the perigee perimartian of the orbit to 50 km. I think it's to gain some experience for the Tianwen-3 mission.

 

"What's the most difficult thing to do in space?"

"The hardest and most tiring thing to do in space, and things that aren't always done well, is to cut your toenails!" Zhai Zhigang, captain of the Shenzhou-13 crew speaking at the first press conference back to Earth. "First, the foot hardly be retracted, you have to wrench the foot. Secondly, you can't let the toenail fly around, so you have to catch it after you cut it immediately. Then vacuum it up."

Spoiler

 

 

Edited June 29, 2022 by steve9728

[SunlitZelkova]

9 hours ago, steve9728 said:

The chief designer of the Tianwen-1 orbiter and Zhurong Mars rover, Sun Zezhou said that will be planned a test mission for the Tianwen-1 orbiter: atmopheric braking. It will make the perigee of the orbit to 50 km. I think it's to gain some experience for the Tianwen-3 mission.

 

How is it supposed to do this with no ablative surfaces?

I suppose it won’t be going as fast as Tianwen-3 coming in from interplanetary space would, but it still sounds dangerous.

[CatastrophicFailure]

16 minutes ago, SunlitZelkova said:

How is it supposed to do this with no ablative surfaces?

I suppose it won’t be going as fast as Tianwen-3 coming in from interplanetary space would, but it still sounds dangerous.

I think that’s high enough that heating is low enough that no “heat shield” is needed, one of the NASA Mars orbiters did similar. It’s a very very slow process over dozens of orbits. 

[steve9728]

1 hour ago, SunlitZelkova said:

How is it supposed to do this with no ablative surfaces?

I suppose it won’t be going as fast as Tianwen-3 coming in from interplanetary space would, but it still sounds dangerous.

I think is to vertify some theories or assumptions calculated by the experts on ground to see "what happen if we let it brake in the Mars outer atmospher?". I think that more likely to be CNSA's experts want to have the data by themselves instead of the foreign data. After all, the rover on Mars now is sleeping to avoid the dangerous situation in Mars winter. The rover can't do anything for several months, and the orbiter was finished every missions, so why not...

Speaking of data, Tianwen-1 orbiter has finished all the established scientific exploration missions. In this two years flying around Mars, Tianwen and Zhurong has send back 1040 GB raw science data to Earth. 

Several new photos from Mars:

Ascraeus Mons, shot by Tianwen's medium resolution camera:

The Mars' antarctic ice cap

The west part of the Valles Marineris

The impact craters in Arabia Terra

The edge of Maunder Crater shot by the Tianwen's high resolution camera. The lower left of the picture shows the interior of the ring pit, with the rim of the pit visible as a clear collapse into the pit.

And a small sand dunes taken by the Zhurong rover before it enter the sleep mode

Edited June 29, 2022 by steve9728

[steve9728]

Spacety (天仪研究院) was published an article about their satellite completing its deorbit test and re-entering the atmosphere. And they attached a photo with the article:

 

People comment below: Wait? Are you just use a tape measure for antenna?

Yang Feng, Spacety's CEO: Yep, it's the most common tape measure you know. It used to be that such things were made of memory alloy, but then we somehow found that tape measure also worked quite well.

Another comment: Can these survive more than 24 hours?

Yang Feng: The longest-lived satellite we've had is three years and nine months. And now it's entire system still stable, happy with that?

 

Damn that's one of the coolest and most economical things I ever know

Edited July 1, 2022 by steve9728

[steve9728]

7 hours ago, steve9728 said:

Damn that's one of the coolest and most economical things I ever know

Another comment below: someone visit the Spacety years before. And Spacety's CEO show him a video of Earth taken from 500km high. He let that guy guess how much of this camera was. That guy: that's rocket science, hundred thousand RMB perhaps?

Spacety's CEO: nah, 42 RMB

 

(2.5rmb you can get a can of coke in China)

[steve9728]

CZ-5 Y6 rocket's first stage engine, and CZ-5 Y7 rocket's second stage engine was completed 'ground calibration test run.' In term of the current schedule, they are the engines for launching the Chang-e 6 and 7 around 2024.

"These engines will be subjected to high altitude simulation tests to obtain vacuum thrust performance parameters. If the engine functions and performance parameters meet the overall technical requirements of the rocket, it will be delivered for assembly."

[steve9728]

On 6/23/2022 at 8:10 AM, steve9728 said:

Now I see why there have something sail like thing in the patch: CZ-2D Y64 rocket's loading component has deployed the biggest deorbit sail ever in China. In the fully unfurled state, the sail has an area of 25m². 

The sail tests on the ground:

"Without de-orbiting measures, a satellite of the 15kg class at an altitude of 700km would remain in orbit for 120 years or more at the end of its life; with a de-orbiting sail of 2m², the time in orbit could be reduced to less than 10 years."

Original source

 

Chinese want to occupy the moon... again

Don't know is NASA having something trouble on getting funding these days, or just simply their boss has smoked something up again since his "takes two to tango". Anyway, I don't want to comment anything based on respect for the rules of this forum.

Edited July 5, 2022 by steve9728

[steve9728]

A successful launch of the 'Feitian-1 (飞天一号, Flying-1)' rocket ram-combined power rocket led by the Northwest Polytechnic University's School of Aerospace's Air-Sky Combined Power team. "For the first time in the international arena, the kerosene-fuelled rocket ramjet combined cycle engine has verified the smooth multimodal transition and wide-area integration capability of rocket/sub combustion, sub combustion, super combustion and rocket/super combustion, and has broken through key technologies such as thermal throat adjustment and efficient combustion organization of ultra-wide cladding lines, and the flight test was a success." (Original source)

[SunlitZelkova]

8 hours ago, steve9728 said:

Don't know is NASA having something trouble on getting funding these days, or just simply their boss has smoked something up again since his "takes two to tango". Anyway, I don't want to comment anything based on respect for the rules of this forum.

The silly thing about such comments regarding the Moon is that it legitimizes Rogozin’s statements about Artemis being for “militarization of the Moon”/attempting to build an international coalition to occupy the Moon, because no one has cited any evidence regarding these things. If Bill Nelson wants to be taken seriously without evidence, does that mean we can take Rogozin seriously too?

The comments about Tiangong are even worse, although I suppose Roscosmos passively accused American astronauts of drilling a hole in a Soyuz.

Another reason I think this is very… silly, to put it lightly… is that if nefarious activities were happening aboard Tiangong and with the ILRS, the intelligence community would be all over it. Instead, we mainly get vague “China is challenging the US and poses a threat in space”, which mainly has to do with dual use capabilities and actual ASAT development, but rarely mentions the crewed space program, nor the deep space exploration program.

[tater]

 

[steve9728]

When I revisited my phone album, I found these pictures taken during my trip to Beijing on 2018:

Clothes and boots worn by Jing Haipeng, the crew of Shenzhou-7,9 and 11. This is the one worn on his Shenzhou-11 mission and collected by the Military Museum of the Chinese People's Revolution.

And the flag waved during the first Chinese EVA mission by Zhai Zhigang. The National Museum of China collect this.

Spoiler

Have to say the flag is much thicker than I expected.

[steve9728]

Xuyang-15 cargo ship has arrived in Tianjin port.  From the planned launch of "Wentian" this month and the arrival of the cargo ship in Tianjin in April for the transhipment mission, it makes sense that "Mengtian", which is planned to be launched in October, would arrive in Tianjin at this time.

 

Deep Blue Aerospace (深蓝航天)'s 20 tonne thrust Thunder Reusable 1 engine has finished it's first test run. It tested five times and the engine accumulated run for 138 seconds. Longest single working time up to 90 seconds.

 

Seems like we are going to have a new VAB at Wenchang launch centre in Hainan

And just a short distance to the southwest, construction has begun on China's first commercial space launch site.

 

Embassy of China in Algeria launched a "talk with taikonauts" campaign. But somehow, I have a felling it might not work pretty well...

 

[Vanamonde]

Some comments removed or moved to another thread. Please leave politics out of the discussions on this forum.